George Will, The GOP, And Conservatism

 

George Will has a new piece at NRO about the relationship between the conservative movement and the Republican party. I’d like to focus on his second to last paragraph in which he writes,

The beginning of conservative wisdom is recognition that there is an end to everything: Nothing lasts. If Trump wins, the GOP ends as a vehicle for conservatism. And a political idea without a political party is an orphan in an indifferent world.

Trump winning will not end the GOP as a vehicle for conservatism because the GOP hasn’t been a vehicle for conservatism for quite some time. The national GOP is full of weak, spineless, and ineffectual opportunists who can barely string together a conservative argument. Mitch McConnell did not receive a single concession from the Democrats in the most recent CR and he ensured the end of US control of the internet.

The nomination of Donald Trump has so appalled George Will that he has left the Republican party. The conservative heresy was just a bridge too far for him. We should have nominated someone from the current GOP because they would really enact conservative policy. The conservative movement should be led by the people who allowed the Iranians to get nuclear weapons with the Corker Bill, ensured that countries run by dictators will have more control over the internet, allowed Obama to make illegal Obamacare payments, and acted impotently while the director of the IRS lied about targeting conservatives.

Donald Trump is a result of the failure of the GOP to be a vehicle for conservatism. George Will is an example of the failed conservative elite. Conservatism will survive because our ideas are correct and timeless. However, it’s time we considered changing the way we sell it and spread it. George Will is right that nothing lasts. The old guard elite conservative punditry that he represents have failed conservatism, the country, and should be left behind with the current GOP leadership. It’s hard to admit, but we are losing the battle for this country. We need a new plan and new leaders.

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  1. Robert McReynolds Member
    Robert McReynolds
    @

    Yeah you pretty much summed up the past 15 years.

    • #1
  2. TKC1101 Member
    TKC1101
    @

    Conservatives befriended the political elites and despised the great basket of deplorables that occupy our nation in great numbers. They chose to hope the donor driven pols would take their ideas and run with them.

    So they now are hurt that the enemies they placed their hopes in turn out to have taken them for a ride and the people they despise have stopped listening to them.

    My sympathy knows lots of bounds.

    • #2
  3. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    I’m encouraged to hear you say, Hercules, that we don’t need to dump the values; we just need to be willing to abandon the GOP and those who call themselves Conservatives but aren’t. Getting those who consider themselves “everyone else” to come together, may be one of our biggest challenges.

    • #3
  4. CoffeeDogHouse Inactive
    CoffeeDogHouse
    @CoffeeDogHouse

    Susan Quinn:I’m encouraged to hear you say, Hercules, that we don’t need to dump the values; we just need to be willing to abandon the GOP and those who call themselves Conservatives but aren’t. Getting those who consider themselves “everyone else” to come together, may be one of our biggest challenges.

    Back when Trump was the “presumptive” nominee, I entertained fantasies of a mass walkout from the GOP of all those who identify with conservative principles.  Alas, just a fantasy.

    I think part of getting the “everyone else” coalition to… uh, coalesce requires a basic resetting of the very meaning of “conservative.”  I suspect that popular opinion, exacerbated by a compliant media, has absorbed a very warped idea of what it means.  Many of my liberal colleagues conflate conservatism with racism, sexism, insert-your-bad-ism here.

    So a re-framing is in order.  Of what importance to the concept are judo-christian values?  Constitutional principles?  Civil liberties?

    I try very hard to stick to this definition: the exercise of the least (but still effective) government authority to preserve and protect our society and the rights of those within it.  Many liberals equate that to just believing in social darwinism.  I just think of it as civilization via an Occam’s Razor approach.

    • #4
  5. Mountie Coolidge
    Mountie
    @Mountie

    Robert McReynolds:Yeah you pretty much summed up the past 15 years.

    We haven’t had a conservative in the White House since Reagan. That’s more like 28 years.

    • #5
  6. Hercules Rockefeller Inactive
    Hercules Rockefeller
    @HerculesRockefeller

    Susan Quinn:I’m encouraged to hear you say, Hercules, that we don’t need to dump the values; we just need to be willing to abandon the GOP and those who call themselves Conservatives but aren’t. Getting those who consider themselves “everyone else” to come together, may be one of our biggest challenges.

    We do not have to dump our values, but I think we need to get very tough and very honest. We need to be able to look at the GOP and conservative institutions and say openly and clearly that they have failed. We aren’t one more essay on Edmund Burke or one more Jack Kemp story away from making changes. We are at square one and the faster we admit our position, the faster we can start moving forward.

    • #6
  7. Old Bathos Member
    Old Bathos
    @OldBathos

    Will’s analysis is silly. The party is simply a functional structure analogous to the other one. If there is a viable conservative movement with a viable conservative leader, the party structure can be taken. There are precedents.

    The problem is that the policy consequences of a half century of Democratic ideas have created problems. Democrats brazenly claim the mantle of change and solutions for the disasters that are largely their fault.

    BUT… Will and other conservatives (mea culpa) delight in dissecting the assininity of Dem ideas but invariably fail to articulate what an innovative conservative solution (not an oxymoron) looks like. People default to voting for “program” solutions because it does not seem that an alternative is on the table other than the mess that is the status quo.

    There is nothing lasting or philosophically transformational about Trump. He is merely collective raised middle finger to the menu presented by our respective leaders.

    • #7
  8. Hercules Rockefeller Inactive
    Hercules Rockefeller
    @HerculesRockefeller

    Susan Quinn:I’m encouraged to hear you say, Hercules, that we don’t need to dump the values; we just need to be willing to abandon the GOP and those who call themselves Conservatives but aren’t. Getting those who consider themselves “everyone else” to come together, may be one of our biggest challenges.

    I think an important place to start would be to admit that we are the new counter culture. We are where the liberals and progressives were in the early 1960s. The progressives are the Puritans and we are the kids who just want to dance in Footloose. Once we accept that, we can stop trying to get the approval of liberals. This NRO piece about Anne Coulter at Rob Lowe’s roast is a prime example, whether you like Anne Coulter or not, the counter culture doesn’t care what the liberals think of us. That is the mentality that we need right now. The progressives will never accept us, so why even bother playing by their rules.

    • #8
  9. Arizona Patriot Member
    Arizona Patriot
    @ArizonaPatriot

    I disagree with the OP.  The Republican party, until Trump, has been the best available vehicle for conservatism.  We are in a deeply divided country that elected Obama twice.  Politics is the art of the possible, and a serious rightward move has not been possible since Reagan.

    There have been significant Republican and Conservative victories over the past 15 years, though more at the state level.  GW Bush and the Republican Congress passed 2 major tax cuts.  We got 2 good conservative SCOTUS justices.  There have been many pro-life victories at the state level.  Unions were busted in Wisconsin and Michigan.  The GOP Congress significantly reined in spending after the Democrat’s spree in 2009-2010.

    A serious rightward move might have been possible this year.  My personal judgment is that Trump is a weak candidate, staying close to Clinton because she is also a weak candidate.  I think that several alternatives would have beaten Clinton badly, including Rubio and Kasich.  I’m less sure about Cruz (though he’s my favorite from a policy perspective).

    We don’t get to run election experiments, so there’s no way that I can prove this conclusively, and no way that others can disprove it.

    • #9
  10. Arizona Patriot Member
    Arizona Patriot
    @ArizonaPatriot

    I also disagree with George Will, or to be more precise, I think that his opinion is premature.  If Trump loses, I think that the Republican party and the Conservative movement will be OK.  If Trump wins, he may govern as a conservative and do a pretty good job, in which case the Republican party and the Conservative movement will also be OK.  Trump may cause significant damage if he wins the election but governs badly.

    • #10
  11. CoffeeDogHouse Inactive
    CoffeeDogHouse
    @CoffeeDogHouse

    Hercules Rockefeller:

    I think an important place to start would be to admit that we are the new counter culture. We are where the liberals and progressives were in the early 1960s. The progressives are the Puritans and we are the kids who just want to dance in Footloose. Once we accept that, we can stop trying to get the approval of liberals. This NRO piece about Anne Coulter at Rob Lowe’s roast is a prime example, whether you like Anne Coulter or not, the counter culture doesn’t care what the liberals think of us. That is the mentality that we need right now. The progressives will never accept us, so why even bother playing by their rules.

    Yup.  Like a fresh rotation of the Hegelian Dialectic.

    • #11
  12. Matt Upton Inactive
    Matt Upton
    @MattUpton

    Hercules Rockefeller: I think an important place to start would be to admit that we are the new counter culture. We are where the liberals and progressives were in the early 1960s. The progressives are the Puritans and we are the kids who just want to dance in Footloose. Once we accept that, we can stop trying to get the approval of liberals. This NRO piece about Anne Coulter at Rob Lowe’s roast is a prime example, whether you like Anne Coulter or not, the counter culture doesn’t care what the liberals think of us. That is the mentality that we need right now. The progressives will never accept us, so why even bother playing by their rules.

    On that note I do want to recommend the new TV series Speechless (or at the very least the pilot). It plays very well on the target rich environment of the shallow PC mentality of school districts. In one scene, the namesake character who is mute and wheelchair bound is greeted to his new class by enthusiastic cheers and a nomination for class president. He asks (through his aid) “Why? You don’t know me.” And the teacher, with all the earnestness in the world answers, “Because you are… because.. because you  stand taller than the rest of us sitting down.”

    I nearly died. It was one of the best sitcom pilot I had watched in a long time. The reverence for victim status is skewered, the family genuinely loves each other, and all the actors’ performances are great.

    • #12
  13. Robert McReynolds Member
    Robert McReynolds
    @

    Mountie:

    Robert McReynolds:Yeah you pretty much summed up the past 15 years.

    We haven’t had a conservative in the White House since Reagan. That’s more like 28 years.

    True but I was giving some sort of nod to the 94 Revolution. Bushism killed whatever momentum Reagan and Gingrich created prior to 2001.

    • #13
  14. Tom Meyer Member
    Tom Meyer
    @tommeyer

    Hercules Rockefeller:The nomination of Donald Trump has so appalled George Will that he has left the Republican party. The conservative heresy was just a bridge too far for him. We should have nominated someone from the current GOP because they would really enact conservative policy. The conservative movement should be led by the people who allowed the Iranians to get nuclear weapons with the Corker Bill, ensured that countries run by dictators will have more control over the internet, allowed Obama to make illegal Obamacare payments, and acted impotently while the director of the IRS lied about targeting conservatives.

    I don’t want to get in the habit of defending the Republican Congress — Lord knows they deserve criticism — but this is a very incomplete list. Limiting discussion to Obama’s term and just off the top of my head, Congressional Republicans:

    • Held ranks on ObamaCare
    • Deep-sixxed Merrick Garland’s nomination.
    • Deep-sixxed cardcheck
    • Deep-sixxed cap-and-trade
    • Deep-sixxed post-Newtown federal gun bans/restrictions
    • Told the Iranian government that the US Congress is not bound by the president’s executive agreement.

    While I am totally amenable to finding this list disappointing or insufficient — and won’t deny that Obama’s been able to wreak significant damage, regardless — it’s hardly inconsequential, either. And while some of these were measures were popular, others have brought significant heat.

    Putting aside Congress, @arizonapatriot‘s list of Republican achievement in the states is significant. And while there have been major setbacks (the ObamaCare decisions and Obergefell), I’d add that conservatives have won significant victories against the Left, including:

    • McDonald v. Chicago (2nd Amendment)
    • Fisher v. University of Texas (Affirmative Action
    • Burwell v. Hobby Lobby Stores (Freedom of Conscience/Religious Liberty)
    • Citizens United (1st Amendment)

    Those are just off the top of my head. There are more.

    • #14
  15. Tom Meyer Member
    Tom Meyer
    @tommeyer

    Shorter version: These have been a very difficult, painful eight years during the Left has made significant progress and in which we’ve lost much ground. My objection is to the notion that this took place without significant (and often effective) opposition from the Right and without some significant (and often effective) victories along the way.

    • #15
  16. Pilli Inactive
    Pilli
    @Pilli

    Tom Meyer, Ed.:

    Hercules Rockefeller:The nomination of Donald Trump has so appalled George Will that he has left the Republican party. The conservative heresy was just a bridge too far for him. We should have nominated someone from the current GOP because they would really enact conservative policy. The conservative movement should be led by the people who allowed the Iranians to get nuclear weapons with the Corker Bill, ensured that countries run by dictators will have more control over the internet, allowed Obama to make illegal Obamacare payments, and acted impotently while the director of the IRS lied about targeting conservatives.

    I don’t want to get in the habit of defending the Republican Congress — Lord knows they deserve criticism — but this is a very incomplete list. Limiting discussion to Obama’s term and just off the top of my head, Congressional Republicans:

    • Held ranks on ObamaCare

    Exactly how has holding ranks on Obama Care been an accomplishment?  We still have O-Care.  Nothing has been done to reduce its impact.  The only thing I can remember of any consequence was that when it came down to Congress Critters and their staffs having to use O-Care, they voted to exempt themselves.  They certainly didn’t hold ranks against that!

    • #16
  17. Susan Quinn Contributor
    Susan Quinn
    @SusanQuinn

    Pilli: Exactly how was holding ranks on Obama Care been an accomplishment? We still have O-Care. Nothing has been done to reduce its impact. The only thing I can remember of any consequence was that when it came down to Congress Critters and their staffs having to use O-Care, they voted to exempt themselves. They certainly didn’t hold ranks against that!

    Did Rubio’s bill pass to keep the govt. from making up shortages for the insurance companies? Can’t remember.

    • #17
  18. Palaeologus Inactive
    Palaeologus
    @Palaeologus

    Pilli:

    Tom Meyer, Ed.:

    Hercules Rockefeller:The nomination of Donald Trump has so appalled George Will that he has left the Republican party. The conservative heresy was just a bridge too far for him. We should have nominated someone from the current GOP because they would really enact conservative policy. The conservative movement should be led by the people who allowed the Iranians to get nuclear weapons with the Corker Bill, ensured that countries run by dictators will have more control over the internet, allowed Obama to make illegal Obamacare payments, and acted impotently while the director of the IRS lied about targeting conservatives.

    I don’t want to get in the habit of defending the Republican Congress — Lord knows they deserve criticism — but this is a very incomplete list. Limiting discussion to Obama’s term and just off the top of my head, Congressional Republicans:

    • Held ranks on ObamaCare

    Exactly how has holding ranks on Obama Care been an accomplishment? We still have O-Care. Nothing has been done to reduce its impact. The only thing I can remember of any consequence was that when it came down to Congress Critters and their staffs having to use O-Care, they voted to exempt themselves. They certainly didn’t hold ranks against that!

    Did Tom call it an accomplishment?

    It diminished Obama’s accomplishment, by making it entirely partisan. Thereby limiting it’s legitimacy and setting the stage to wreck it. Unfortunately, our party went nuts and nominated a pandering clown.

    • #18
  19. Mesulkanen Member
    Mesulkanen
    @

    I don’t see how Will represents the failed elite. He has been advocating the conservative cause consistently – smaller and smaller-scoped federal government, clipping the regulatory state, and preserving liberty. One can add reform-conservative ideas to this foundation.

    What has really wounded the conservative movement is its infiltration by the crypto-authoritarians (Hannity, Ingrham, and the other doggie-vitamin hucksters) spouting their Strong-Man and nativist dreck, equating conservativsim with Obama-hating, Hillary-hating,  and a calling for a brutish type of Judaeo-Christian hegemony. They were only interested in getting the State’s boot off of their neck and onto the neck of their enemies.

    The other gang that slipped in under the tent were the K-street corruptocrats. They had no interest whatsoever in smaller government, all they cared about was getting lobbyist checks to be written to the RNC rather than the DNC.

    In short, when you let characters wave the conservative banner who are anything but conservative, you are permitting your movement to be hijacked and destroyed.

    • #19
  20. The Cloaked Gaijin Member
    The Cloaked Gaijin
    @TheCloakedGaijin

    Tom Meyer, Ed.:

    Hercules Rockefeller: nomination of Donald Trump has so appalled George Will that he has left the Republican party. The conservative heresy was just a bridge too far for him. We should have nominated someone from the current GOP because they would really enact conservative policy. The conservative movement should be led by the people who allowed the Iranians to get nuclear weapons with the Corker Bill, ensured that countries run by dictators will have more control over the internet, allowed Obama to make illegal Obamacare payments, and acted impotently while the director of the IRS lied about targeting conservatives.

    I don’t want to get in the habit of defending the Republican Congress —  …but….

    • Held ranks on ObamaCare

    Paul Ryan lied, and the conservatives refused to defund Obamacare.  How many times does this have to be explained!

    “I tell people at home is think we can get 85% of this for sure repealed through reconciliation.” — Paul Ryan, 2012

    Hey, how about defund 100% of it.

    Held ranks you say?  Held ranks?  What does this even mean as my health insurance is expected to go up by x3 to x9 since the Obamacare debate began.

    Don’t (beep) down our legs and tell us its raining.

    Look at the latest realclearpolitics likely voter poll in a couple of Democrat states:

    Minnesota, tied.

    Oregon +3 Clinton.

    Rhode Island +3 Clinton.

    Maine +3 Clinton.

    New Jersey +4 Clinton.

    Washington +6 Clinton.

    Illinois +6 Clinton.

    Even Democrats can spot failure at some point.

    • #20
  21. Randal H Member
    Randal H
    @RandalH

    Hercules Rockefeller: The beginning of conservative wisdom is recognition that there is an end to everything: Nothing lasts.

    Somehow this quote from Will seems like an oxymoron. I thought the whole point of conservatism is that some truths, some traditions, some aspects of culture, etc. are eternal and worth preserving. Seems more nihilistic than conservative.

    • #21
  22. TKC1101 Member
    TKC1101
    @

    mesulkanen: What has really wounded the conservative movement is its infiltration by the crypto-authoritarians (Hannity, Ingrham, and the other doggie-vitamin hucksters) spouting their Strong-Man and nativist dreck, equating conservativsim with Obama-hating, Hillary-hating, and a calling for a brutish type of Judaeo-Christian hegemony. They were only interested in getting the State’s boot off of their neck and onto the neck of their enemies.

    Sounds like a small, elite movement to me. Lots of people not only are not welcome, but are quite nefarious in the process.

    • #22
  23. James Gawron Inactive
    James Gawron
    @JamesGawron

    Hercules Rockefeller: Donald Trump is a result of the failure of the GOP to be a vehicle for conservatism.

    HR,

    This is a very powerful statement for which I don’t think there is any reasonable retort. The fact that Trump offends sensibilities is an incredibly shallow excuse for ignoring the fact that the current Republican Party, much like General McClellan, given all the resources and advantages could not produce any results. Even though McClellan was fabulously well connected and Lincoln was an awkward brute from the frontier, Mr. Lincoln fired McClellan. The American voter has just fired the current Republican Party. They had better think about what it takes to win if they want to get rehired. If Mr. Will and others wish to sit this one out that is their choice and their right. However, I would ask that they spare me the pretentious explanations which thinly cover their fervent hope that Trump will lose. That hope has nothing to do with what is best for the country. When one can send one’s children to the best private schools, afford the best private health insurance, be protected by one’s own security guards, and shift assets to shelter a massive wealth against any negative economic forecast, I think one loses touch with the reality of life for those who lead honest lives but have less.

    Regards,

    Jim

    • #23
  24. The King Prawn Inactive
    The King Prawn
    @TheKingPrawn

    Another case of right diagnosis, wrong prescription. Trump is the answer to conservatism’s failings in the same way a shotgun blast is the answer to a knife wound.

    • #24
  25. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    Palaeologus: It diminished Obama’s accomplishment, by making it entirely partisan. Thereby limiting it’s legitimacy and setting the stage to wreck it. Unfortunately, our party went nuts and nominated a pandering clown.

    Obamacare may have had its “legitimacy limited” but the problem is Republican failure to prevent the damage it has done to the delivery of medical care.

    • #25
  26. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    mesulkanen:I don’t see how Will represents the failed elite. He has been advocating the conservative cause consistently – smaller and smaller-scoped federal government, clipping the regulatory state, and preserving liberty. One can add reform-conservative ideas to this foundation.

    What has really wounded the conservative movement is its infiltration by the crypto-authoritarians (Hannity, Ingrham, and the other doggie-vitamin hucksters) spouting their Strong-Man and nativist dreck, equating conservativsim with Obama-hating, Hillary-hating, and a calling for a brutish type of Judaeo-Christian hegemony. They were only interested in getting the State’s boot off of their neck and onto the neck of their enemies.

    The other gang that slipped in under the tent were the K-street corruptocrats. They had no interest whatsoever in smaller government, all they cared about was getting lobbyist checks to be written to the RNC rather than the DNC.

    In short, when you let characters wave the conservative banner who are anything but conservative, you are permitting your movement to be hijacked and destroyed.

    “Bake the cake.” — George Will

    • #26
  27. Keith Keystone Member
    Keith Keystone
    @KeithKeystone

    Hercules Rockefeller: The national GOP is full of weak, spineless, and ineffectual opportunists who can barely string together a conservative argument.

    Unlike Trump who strings together all sorts of arguments for conservatism. Like taking guns from “people who shouldn’t have them” and…

    fully supporting the government “no-fly” secret list which violates civil liberties and…

    saying that the top priorities of the federal government are health care and education and…

    refusing to address our entitlement crisis that consumes the majority of our budget and…

    expanding entitlements to include paid maternity leave and…

    I could go on and on. But whew I sure am glad we got rid of those RINOs! But hey, he fights! Did you see the debate! He’s one tough cookie!

    • #27
  28. Keith Keystone Member
    Keith Keystone
    @KeithKeystone

    The Cloaked Gaijin:Look at the latest realclearpolitics likely voter poll in a couple of Democrat states:

    Susan Quinn:

    Susan Quinn

    Pilli: Exactly how was holding ranks on Obama Care been an accomplishment? We still have O-Care. Nothing has been done to reduce its impact. The only thing I can remember of any consequence was that when it came down to Congress Critters and their staffs having to use O-Care, they voted to exempt themselves. They certainly didn’t hold ranks against that!

    Did Rubio’s bill pass to keep the govt. from making up shortages for the insurance companies? Can’t remember.

    Yes it did. And it was probably the most effective thing that anyone did to fight Obamacare. I believe it is the reason so many insurers are leaving the exchanges. They can’t get their pockets lined by govt. payouts.

    • #28
  29. Jamie Lockett Member
    Jamie Lockett
    @JamieLockett

    The Cloaked Gaijin:

    Tom Meyer, Ed.:

    Hercules Rockefeller: nomination of Donald Trump has so appalled George Will that he has left the Republican party. The conservative heresy was just a bridge too far for him. We should have nominated someone from the current GOP because they would really enact conservative policy. The conservative movement should be led by the people who allowed the Iranians to get nuclear weapons with the Corker Bill, ensured that countries run by dictators will have more control over the internet, allowed Obama to make illegal Obamacare payments, and acted impotently while the director of the IRS lied about targeting conservatives.

    I don’t want to get in the habit of defending the Republican Congress — …but….

    • Held ranks on ObamaCare

    Paul Ryan lied, and the conservatives refused to defund Obamacare. How many times does this have to be explained!

    “I tell people at home is think we can get 85% of this for sure repealed through reconciliation.” — Paul Ryan, 2012

    Hey, how about defund 100% of it.

    Held ranks you say? Held ranks? What does this even mean as my health insurance is expected to go up by x3 to x9 since the Obamacare debate began.

    Don’t (beep) down our legs and tell us its raining.

    Look at the latest realclearpolitics likely voter poll in a couple of Democrat states:

    Minnesota, tied.

    Oregon +3 Clinton.

    Rhode Island +3 Clinton.I

    Maine +3 Clinton.

    New Jersey +4 Clinton.

    Washington +6 Clinton.

    Illinois +6 Clinton.

    Even Democrats can spot failure at some point.

    It’s almost like you think there’s no opposition party in this country.

    • #29
  30. Joseph Stanko Coolidge
    Joseph Stanko
    @JosephStanko

    Hercules Rockefeller: Conservatism will survive because our ideas are correct and timeless.

    If only we knew what those ideas were.  Trouble is, we no longer agree what “conservatism” even means.  We’re at each other’s throats because we no longer agree on immigration, trade deals, or foreign policy, to name 3 examples off the top of my head.

    • #30
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