Recommended by Ricochet Members Created with Sketch. Michael Walsh At PJ Media Declares War On Never Trump

 

Article entitled The Moral Cowardice Of The NeverTrumpumpkins

Is Trump the best the GOP might have offered? Probably not; I was a fan of Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker, but he was gone before most of the country figured out who he was. Is a vote for Hillary and against Trump because you believe she is the lesser of two evils defensible? Of course it is, however wrongheaded. Is staying home an option? Absolutely — but then you don’t get to kick about the results.

As Milton writes in the Areopagitica:

I cannot praise a fugitive and cloistered virtue, unexercised and unbreathed, that never sallies out and sees her adversary, but slinks out of the race where that immortal garland is to be run for, not without dust and heat.

Anything else is simply moral preening from the sidelines. Now is the time for all good men and women to come not to the aid of their party, but of their country.

Read the whole thing. If you dare.

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  1. A-Squared Coolidge

    Larry Koler:

    A-Squared:

    Larry Koler:

    A-Squared:

    …Either way the country loses. Hillary causes more harm in short term, Trump causes more harm in the long run. I care more about the long run.

    You have to vote for the better candidate.

    So, I should vote for Clinton because she will cause less harm in the long run.

    Got it. Thanks.

    Exactly — if that is your determination at least you are giving the country your best advice.

    But I can’t vote for Clinton anymore than I can vote for Trump, but by not voting for Clinton even though I think she causes less long-term harm to the country, I am actually helpimg Trump.

    • #91
    • August 20, 2016, at 11:27 AM PDT
    • Like
  2. A-Squared Coolidge

    MJBubba:

    This is a tough fight, and a desperate one. If they win, there may never be any opportunity for the conservative movement to recover, nor any future for conservative leadership in the GOP.

    You’ve summed up my thoughts well. If Trump becomes President and the leader of the GOP, there may never be an opportunity for the conservative movement to recover within the GOP nor will there be any future for conservative leadership in the GOP.

    It wil not help the GOP or the country for Trump to turn the GOP into another party of central planners.

    • #92
    • August 20, 2016, at 11:49 AM PDT
    • Like
  3. Larry Koler Inactive

    A-Squared:

    Larry Koler:

    A-Squared:

    Larry Koler:

    A-Squared:

    …Either way the country loses. Hillary causes more harm in short term, Trump causes more harm in the long run. I care more about the long run.

    You have to vote for the better candidate.

    So, I should vote for Clinton because she will cause less harm in the long run.

    Got it. Thanks.

    Exactly — if that is your determination at least you are giving the country your best advice.

    But I can’t vote for Clinton anymore than I can vote for Trump, but by not voting for Clinton even though I think she causes less long-term harm to the country, I am actually helpimg Trump.

    You need to learn to be more decisive in life. Get on the ball, man.

    (humor- just so you know)

    • #93
    • August 20, 2016, at 4:22 PM PDT
    • Like
  4. Midget Faded Rattlesnake Contributor

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    • #94
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:23 PM PDT
    • Like
  5. Larry Koler Inactive

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    • #95
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:24 PM PDT
    • Like
  6. Midget Faded Rattlesnake Contributor

    Larry Koler:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    No, because I recognize the pattern. It’s nothing about Ricochet policy, but about which Member-Feed posts tend to attract recommends. All Pseud need is two more recommends, and his quote of someone else will be Main Feed.

    • #96
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:25 PM PDT
    • Like
  7. Biden Pure Demagogue Coolidge
    Biden Pure DemagogueJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Larry Koler:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    No, because I recognize the pattern. It’s nothing about Ricochet policy, but about which Member-Feed posts tend to attract recommends. All Pseud need is two more recommends, and his quote of someone else will be Main Feed.

    Wait a minute – I thought the threshold was 10?

    • #97
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:32 PM PDT
    • Like
  8. Biden Pure Demagogue Coolidge
    Biden Pure DemagogueJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Larry Koler:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    No, because I recognize the pattern. It’s nothing about Ricochet policy, but about which Member-Feed posts tend to attract recommends. All Pseud need is two more recommends, and his quote of someone else will be Main Feed.

    Mr Walsh will be very disappointed.

    • #98
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:35 PM PDT
    • Like
  9. Lash LaRoche Inactive

    Pseudodionysius:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Larry Koler:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    No, because I recognize the pattern. It’s nothing about Ricochet policy, but about which Member-Feed posts tend to attract recommends. All Pseud need is two more recommends, and his quote of someone else will be Main Feed.

    Wait a minute – I thought the threshold was 10?

    Yes, that’s what I thought.

    • #99
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:38 PM PDT
    • Like
  10. Biden Pure Demagogue Coolidge
    Biden Pure DemagogueJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Larry Koler:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    No, because I recognize the pattern. It’s nothing about Ricochet policy, but about which Member-Feed posts tend to attract recommends. All Pseud need is two more recommends, and his quote of someone else will be Main Feed.

    I’ve been speaking with my team of tag writers and they’re feeling very under appreciated these days.

    • #100
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:40 PM PDT
    • Like
  11. Midget Faded Rattlesnake Contributor

    Pseudodionysius:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Larry Koler:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    No, because I recognize the pattern. It’s nothing about Ricochet policy, but about which Member-Feed posts tend to attract recommends. All Pseud need is two more recommends, and his quote of someone else will be Main Feed.

    Wait a minute – I thought the threshold was 10?

    It’s been at 15 for a few weeks now. A threshold of 10 was clearly too low, so it was upped to 50, then knocked back down to 15. This Rudert Number may change from time to time, in search of some elusive “sweet spot”, and perhaps, if no sweet spot can be found, the feature may eventually be scrapped. We’ll see. TPTB are very into keeping this feature if at all possible, though.

    When the Rudert Number changes, the change should be announced… somewhere… If not, and you think you’re above the number, please ask what’s up! Currently, keeping something off the Main Feed re-sets the recommend counter back to zero, as does editing the piece. I am not sure whether anyone has tested whether something knocked off the Main Feed once will reappear on the Main Feed if it gets another 15 recommends – someone should test this…

    • #101
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:44 PM PDT
    • Like
  12. Biden Pure Demagogue Coolidge
    Biden Pure DemagogueJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Oh good grief.

    You hear the lady. I NEED SOME MORE RECOMMENDATIONS.

    I’m out of Atlantic city casino bribe money, so I’ll owe you a pack of smokes.

    • #102
    • August 20, 2016, at 6:50 PM PDT
    • Like
  13. tigerlily Member

    A-Squared:

    MJBubba:

    This is a tough fight, and a desperate one. If they win, there may never be any opportunity for the conservative movement to recover, nor any future for conservative leadership in the GOP.

    You’ve summed up my thoughts well. If Trump becomes President and the leader of the GOP, there may never be an opportunity for the conservative movement to recover within the GOP nor will there be any future for conservative leadership in the GOP.

    It wil not help the GOP or the country for Trump to turn the GOP into another party of central planners.

    Agree.

    • #103
    • August 20, 2016, at 8:40 PM PDT
    • Like
  14. Boss Mongo Member

    A-Squared: But I can’t vote for Clinton anymore than I can vote for Trump, but by not voting for Clinton even though I think she causes less long-term harm to the country, I am actually helpimg Trump.

    • #104
    • August 20, 2016, at 9:26 PM PDT
    • Like
  15. Mister D Member

    A-Squared: Do you meant that Trump voters would rather serve under Hillary than win the election?

    They voted for the least qualified, least liked, major party candidate in US history, and the only candidate for whom it was clear 10 months ago had little chance of winning the election. So, yes, it does seem that way.

    • #105
    • August 20, 2016, at 10:54 PM PDT
    • Like
  16. Mister D Member

    Mike LaRoche: However, the so-called leaders of the GOP refuse to fight for said principles. Hence, Trump.

    GOP won’t stand for principles, vote for a man with no principles.

    Tired of nominating RINO’s, vote for a man who’s been a Republican for 10 minutes.

    Tired of the GOP making deals with Democrats, vote for the man who brags about the deals he’ll make with Democrats.

    Want to beat Hillary above all else, vote for the man with the worst poll numbers against her.

    Rage about Obama’s flouting the constitution, vote for the candidate who promises to do it even more.

    • #106
    • August 20, 2016, at 11:01 PM PDT
    • Like
  17. Lash LaRoche Inactive

    Mister D:

    Mike LaRoche: However, the so-called leaders of the GOP refuse to fight for said principles. Hence, Trump.

    GOP won’t stand for principles, vote for a man with no principles.

    Tired of nominating RINO’s, vote for a man who’s been a Republican for 10 minutes.

    Tired of the GOP making deals with Democrats, vote for the man who brags about the deals he’ll make with Democrats.

    Want to beat Hillary above all else, vote for the man with the worst poll numbers against her.

    Rage about Obama’s flouting the constitution, vote for the candidate who promises to do it even more.

    Rage about Trump’s poll numbers while Trump leads in the latest LA Times poll.

    • #107
    • August 21, 2016, at 12:16 AM PDT
    • Like
  18. Mister D Member

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Larry Koler:

    Midget Faded Rattlesnake:

    Pseudodionysius:One of The Most Popular On The Member Feed *and* a whole pile of recommendations.

    Hmmmmmm.

    This is not surprising at all.

    Because of some policy thing at Ricochet? Some policy we don’t know about?

    No, because I recognize the pattern. It’s nothing about Ricochet policy, but about which Member-Feed posts tend to attract recommends. All Pseud need is two more recommends, and his quote of someone else will be Main Feed.

    So what? Does that mean he wins the free set of steak knives and not you?

    • #108
    • August 21, 2016, at 12:31 AM PDT
    • Like
  19. Mister D Member

    Mike LaRoche:

    Mister D:

    Mike LaRoche: However, the so-called leaders of the GOP refuse to fight for said principles. Hence, Trump.

    GOP won’t stand for principles, vote for a man with no principles.

    Tired of nominating RINO’s, vote for a man who’s been a Republican for 10 minutes.

    Tired of the GOP making deals with Democrats, vote for the man who brags about the deals he’ll make with Democrats.

    Want to beat Hillary above all else, vote for the man with the worst poll numbers against her.

    Rage about Obama’s flouting the constitution, vote for the candidate who promises to do it even more.

    Rage about Trump’s poll numbers while Trump leads in the latest LA Times poll.

    Half a point lead in precisely one poll.

    Cherry pick much?

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/

    • #109
    • August 21, 2016, at 12:33 AM PDT
    • Like
  20. Lash LaRoche Inactive

    Boss Mongo:

    A-Squared: But I can’t vote for Clinton anymore than I can vote for Trump, but by not voting for Clinton even though I think she causes less long-term harm to the country, I am actually helpimg Trump.

    Pretty much the NeverTrump philosophy right there.

    • #110
    • August 21, 2016, at 12:46 AM PDT
    • Like
  21. Mike Rapkoch Moderator

    Okay. I dared to read it.

    So when do we get to read something that explains why we should vote for Trump, except, well, he’s better than Hillary? Walsh doesn’t even try to make that case. Hey! I’m all ears. How, outside of an endless series of drop dead platitudes, will Trump make America great again? All I hear is a “I’ll make America great again, cuz I’m great, so I will make America great again!” Gee, I’m sorry if I’m less than overwhelmed.

    But I am persuadable. Could Mr. Walsh (whose recent book was equally underwhelming) please make an attempt to convince me?

    • #111
    • August 21, 2016, at 2:00 AM PDT
    • Like
  22. Fred Houstan Member

    So I took @p on his dare — and found nothing new. I was sincerely, if desperately, hoping for a new argument. “Hold your nose and suck it up, you snob,” isn’t working for me.

    Mike LaRoche: Speaking of Milton, “Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heaven” could be the NeverTrumper motto.

    Um, what? Trump is God now? Alrighty, then but feels too heretical to countenance.

    I’ve tried mightily, and in vain, to get behind Trump. The most dissuasive voice against my supporting him isn’t the #nevertrumpers, it’s Trump. Last week was a good week for Trump. If he continues down this road, I just might vote for him. But last week might have also been an outlier.

    • #112
    • August 21, 2016, at 6:31 AM PDT
    • Like
  23. SkipSul Coolidge
    SkipSulJoined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    I think it apropos, at this late time, to yet again ask:

    If you are a NeverTrump, is there anything at this point that would sway you the other way?

    If you are voting Trump, is there anything at this point that would sway you the other way?

    Short of affirmative answers on either of the above questions, is there any point to continuing to have these arguments?

    • #113
    • August 21, 2016, at 6:42 AM PDT
    • Like
  24. Jamie Lockett Inactive

    Mike LaRoche:

    Mister D:

    Mike LaRoche: However, the so-called leaders of the GOP refuse to fight for said principles. Hence, Trump.

    GOP won’t stand for principles, vote for a man with no principles.

    Tired of nominating RINO’s, vote for a man who’s been a Republican for 10 minutes.

    Tired of the GOP making deals with Democrats, vote for the man who brags about the deals he’ll make with Democrats.

    Want to beat Hillary above all else, vote for the man with the worst poll numbers against her.

    Rage about Obama’s flouting the constitution, vote for the candidate who promises to do it even more.

    Rage about Trump’s poll numbers while Trump leads in the latest LA Times poll.

    One poll does not a president make.

    • #114
    • August 21, 2016, at 7:00 AM PDT
    • Like
  25. A-Squared Coolidge

    skipsul: If you are a NeverTrump, is there anything at this point that would sway you the other way?

    I am not NeverTrump. I’ve repeatedly said Trump could earn my vote between now and November. He hasn’t bothered to try until the last week or so.

    I assume he will revert to form soon. He doesn’t seem to want to be President, he would rather go to the rallies where everybody already loves him than try to convert any independents.

    • #115
    • August 21, 2016, at 7:36 AM PDT
    • Like
  26. Fred Houstan Member

    skipsul: Short of affirmative answers on either of the above questions, is there any point to continuing to have these arguments?

    I fully agree arguments here are useless. The camps are formed. There is a third position as well — where I apparently sit. For now, I’m voting for (more likely) McMullin or (just to show how close the bottom of the barrel we are) Johnson .

    The ball is — as it has been since Trump won 5 states after WI — in Trump’s court. I suspect a few #nevertrumpers might vote for Trump in their cloistered voting booth —only if Trump stops with the boorish and childish bs.

    • #116
    • August 21, 2016, at 7:42 AM PDT
    • Like
  27. Crow's Nest Inactive

    skipsul:I think it apropos, at this late time, to yet again ask:

    If you are a NeverTrump, is there anything at this point that would sway you the other way?

    If you are voting Trump, is there anything at this point that would sway you the other way?

    Short of affirmative answers on either of the above questions, is there any point to continuing to have these arguments?

    I’m not NeverTrump, but surely a montage like this with the Federalist Papers as reading material couldn’t hurt ;)

    • #117
    • August 21, 2016, at 7:57 AM PDT
    • Like
  28. Boss Mongo Member

    Mike Rapkoch: So when do we get to read something that explains why we should vote for Trump, except, well, he’s better than Hillary?

    Mike, I think this is a key component of our internecine friction.

    I don’t need any more than that. Throw up any negative on Trump, my assessment will be Hillary is worse.

    This a visceral thing; I don’t think we can argue others out of their positions.

    I view HRC as a totalitarian villain that will consciously work to undermine our Republic. In that light, Trump, while not desirable, is acceptable.

    • #118
    • August 21, 2016, at 9:17 AM PDT
    • Like
  29. Man With the Axe Member

    skipsul:If you are a NeverTrump, is there anything at this point that would sway you the other way?

    Yes. His recent speeches have hit mostly all the right notes about the issues, though not on trade. I give him credit for acting like a serious person for the first time in the whole campaign, instead of like a celebrity who was mostly looking for yucks from his rally audiences.

    He came a bit closer to acting like an actual human being when he said he regretted causing pain with some of his remarks. I didn’t find him to be sincere, but still he said it.

    He needs to show me that he is, deep down, a serious man who is willing to learn about the history of this country and the world, about the Constitution and the government, about economics, and about foreign relations. I still feel that his ignorance is disqualifying. I don’t expect him to become an expert overnight, but he should show that he’s learning.

    He needs to show me that he is not a heartless bully who revels in insulting people as a means of getting what he wants. That he does not need to “counter punch” every time someone says something negative about him. He may be the least gracious person I’ve ever encountered. He could try to win over some of these naysayers, and show that he is not the small man he has so far proven to be.

    • #119
    • August 21, 2016, at 10:04 AM PDT
    • Like
  30. James Lileks Contributor

     I cannot praise a fugitive and cloistered virtue, unexercised and unbreathed, that never sallies out and sees her adversary, but slinks out of the race where that immortal garland is to be run for, not without dust and heat.

    Got it, Jack. Moral cowardice. But what if you have been sallying forth, seeing thine adversary for what he is, slinking not away from the race but making known your belief that the adversary is personally, intellectually, morally, and ideologically unfit for the office? And then, having made that case for a year, you act in a way that contradicts everything you supposedly believed?

    You might say it’s necessary, but I wouldn’t call it morally courageous.

    • #120
    • August 21, 2016, at 10:11 AM PDT
    • Like

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