Ricochet is the best place on the internet to discuss the issues of the day, either through commenting on posts or writing your own for our active and dynamic community in a fully moderated environment. In addition, the Ricochet Audio Network offers over 50 original podcasts with new episodes released every day.
Ricochet: Turning Guys Who Bug You Into Features
“I’m willing to believe that you’re human, or that I am. But I don’t see how both of us could be, and so persistently misunderstand each other.” Not a comfortable impasse to reach in an argument, and not the sort of impasse promising friendship rather than enmity. And yet, around here, it still does. Not always, but it can.
I remember saying the above to fellow Ricochet member @titustechera when we first were getting to know each other. Because the way we chose to first get to know each other was to have blazing rows. Every. Single. Flippin’. Time. It did not seem possible for one of us to comment on the other without provoking some sort of deep, even existential, dispute, which you’d think would be kind of hard to do on a website where members pay to join an online conversation with at least somewhat like-minded people. They were at least civil rows — constrained as we both were by the Code of Conduct. Nonetheless, that it was even possible for two people with anything in common to disagree so thoroughly courted absurdity. How could we?
I got to know fellow members @mikerapkoch and @balldiamondball in basically the same way. I suspect there were more first impressions of shrill pomposity all round than any of us would prefer to recall now. As I remember it, I was the crazy libertarian crank; they, like Titus, were among the “conservatives who hate libertarians because…”
So when they first saw me coming, they’d think, “Here comes one of those frivolous, soulless libertarians, overeducated in abstractions and understanding nothing else.” And when I first saw them coming, I’d think, “Oh, those conservatives, the ones who argue as if the sum of human knowledge began and ended with the Ancient Greeks,” or “This guy reminds me of why I hated the guys on my high school debate team. He gives a bad imitation of deductive logic, then says it ‘proves’ him right.”
Even so, we had an obligation to keep it civil, and, at some level, I realized, we must have at least found each other interesting. Else why, on a site with thousands of members, did we repeatedly pick on each other to tussle with?
We found each other interesting.
I, at least, couldn’t help but find my curiosity piqued by these weirdos, and I’m weird enough myself that there’s no reason they shouldn’t have thought the same of me. Well, if you keep your curiosity piqued long enough, odds are good you’ll find something in common.
Maybe just little things, or things that seem little at the time. Some offhand remark, a joke, even, about luck, or love, or suffering – most of us are fortunately incapable of laughing along strict factional lines. Or maybe you learn one “minor” detail about the other guy that casts new light on your previous sense of him. This happened with me and Ball. Somehow the rather nerdly topic of Bayesian inference came up and he mentioned, yep, that was his kind of inference – and then I knew that he knew he wasn’t claiming airtight deduction when he got all “debatey,” he wasn’t trying to “prove” a false sense of certitude. Maybe he wasn’t even the “debatey” type at all. Well, that’s a relief!
Bad puns, a “favorite” pet peeve, some hilariously awful meme in the Member Feed… it doesn’t take much, necessarily, to see the guy you once thought of as simply “opponent” in a friendlier light. As far as it’s possible to befriend those you’ve never met in person, I’m glad to say I’ve befriended Mike and Titus. Despite our differing, even antagonistic, ideological affiliations, we’ve discovered the kind of understanding that’s better than mere agreement. Ball Diamond Ball and I, we’re more like frenemies, but in the good sense of the term – the kind of friendly opponent you end up appreciating, maybe in spite of yourself (Ball is one of our feistier members, and Moderating does oblige me to give excess feisting the hairy eyeball).
Some members come here for the ideas and stay for the people. I came here for the people – this wondrous group of folks in an Internet comments section of all things who were lighthearted, funny, and civil – and stayed for the people. This election season has proven exceptionally stormy, making enmity easier and friendship harder, even among the good-natured and good-humored. But guys like Titus, Mike, and Ball are living proof to me that, even on the internet, it’s possible to befriend the opponents who try your patience, even the ones who thoroughly frustrate – perhaps even embarrass – you with their insistence on what you’re sure just has to be the wrong kind of thinking!
Or, at least, it’s possible on Ricochet.
We want you to become a member, and the number one reason is the friends you will make here. We want to meet you. Join today and the first month is on us!
Published in Group Writing
Right in Chicago and I were ready to kick each other’s ass when we met. Turns out he’s crazier than me in mostly the same ways and we became friends who still chat today. The night Curious John, Right in Chicago, my wife and I had a meal he said,” you know it’s national bourbon day”, and it was on. A drunken chariot race through the streets of Chitown was a moment I’ll treasure.
Proving that it’s possible to make friends even when you’re a lawyer.
You heard it here first, folks. I’m super human!
Deadlines, Midge, deadlines.
I try not to argue in here because people take it the wrong way.
Trigger warning.
Often the people you fight with tooth and nail become the ones you are allies with on another issue. And there are some people you have–ahem–personality conflicts with that you should avoid.
Yes. Contrary to popular belief, it really is ok to let someone be wrong on the internet – even in a community like this.
This is still the best place on the web with absolutely the best people. We may and do disagree at times on individual issues, but I have found that we still find common ground on others, and that keeps the civility, and, perhaps, even growing respect and friendship alive. This nasty season of elections will end soon, but Ricochet and its terrific host of members will remain. Bless and keep you all.
Hmmm, do I want to add my 2 cents?
I’ve been a member for awhile. I visit Ricochet a couple of times a day. I don’t live on Ricochet and I don’t particularly want to get into a long discussion or argument about anything. I’ve learned quite a bit from the other members’ posts and also from discussions in comment threads. I find myself often starting several conversations with “I was reading this thread on Ricochet and…..” I listen to most of the podcasts. I have fairly strong opinions about things but I’m open to being persuaded.
That being said, I visit less often lately. The recent Mad Dogs and Englishmen comment thread perfectly illustrates why. I sometimes think the level of “discussion” will get to the point of arguing over what the definition of “is” is.
Maybe I’m not the kind of member Ricochet has in mind. But that’s my 2 cents.
Now, how am I going to fit this on a T-shirt? Maybe just “incapable of laughing along strict factional lines”…
Very good post, Wee Wan Wattlesnake. I will ponder these sentiments in my heart.
I think you also used that line in reference to one of Titus’ favorite writers, James Poulos.
If Scalia and Ginsberg could be friends, there’s no reason a conservative and a libertarian can’t. Comment often enough, or even just lurk a lot, and you’re bound to find yourself disagreeing with people you thought of as allies and being surprised when that guy you thought was bonkers writes something you find insightful or hilarious. I’ll admit that sometimes I get a notification one of my comments was liked by someone I had a negative view of and my first thought is, “Maybe I’ve judged incorrectly. They like something I’ve said so they can’t be that bad.”
Sometimes contentious relationships give each party a better understanding of each other’s position, even if neither moves an inch ideologically.
I knew it!
What is your superpower?
You’re exactly the right person for Ricochet – I can relate to all you said – You are not the kind of member Ricochet has in mind? Someone that quotes from Ricochet and visits several times of day? On the contrary, and I do the same. It’s a joy and relief to have any kind of common sense discussion in this mayhem world – my husband says you can’t get off that site for an hour can you?! Yes I can, but sometimes, would rather not. I like the people, the stories – all of it!
PS Midget – loved your story! Best part is someone from another walk of life “likes” a measly comment or story of mine!
Well, geeze . . . I’m fight’n back tears here.
(Ok. I exaggerate a little. But this really was lovely. And true.)
I can hear infrasound with my butt.
BDB, you’re just inviting gay jokes.
This got me wondering why I came here–which I think was for a place find solace after things started to go south in the country during the (yay–nearly over!) Obama years. I do stay for the colorful people, the ideas, and the chance to run the stuff going through my brain past some smart folks. I’ve had so much fun meeting up with people I’ve met here. Every one I’ve met has been just wonderful, and instantly feels like a real friend. I have friends all over the world this way and I love it.
Wouldn’t it be dull if we all just rubber-stamped each other?
There’s so much to enjoy here. Run into a lemon? Next!
Well, the whole thing is news to me, too. But going by my correspondence with Midge, which is not negligible, it’s obscurity. That’s my super power…
Great post, Midge! I do love Ricochet and probably spend too much time here. I actually appreciate when people disagree with me, as long as they’re not nasty. It allows me to engage with questions, as tactfully as I can and not take it personally! I also learn a lot when we go back and forth a bit. I think I have a reputation as a “nice person,” which quite frankly sounds boring, but it also means that if someone knows me, he or she will likely engage respectfully. So being nice has its ups and downs. I’ve gone through the annoyance stage with a number of people, and there are very few that I don’t like. And I can just stay away. There’s so much to read that’s just plain enjoyable and informative! Thanks for this piece!
No, it’s not.
Awesome.
Oh no, not another INTP! I thought the CoC limited us to one per thread.
(Following my own advice and letting someone be wrong.) – ;)
It better not! I like my fellow weirdos!
Are all weirdos INTP? I don’t feel like googling another initialism.
Yes ; )
Of course, as an ENFP, they think I’m the weirdo…which is fair