Trump Reconsidered

 

It’s time for those of us holding our noses at Trump to reconsider our approach. He’s not our cup of tea, but he may be a cup we have to drink from. Barring a minor miracle in Iowa, or a major one in New Hampshire, Trump is going to be our nominee. He may even be the president. It’s time we tried to make that unwanted cup as palatable as possible.

What is at stake here is not our pride or our good taste, but the future of the country we love. After the depredations of Obama’s rule, we conservatives do not have the luxury of holding our breath until our preferred candidate materializes; we owe it to America to try to make the best of a potential Trump presidency.

The attitudes expressed by George Will, Jay Nordlinger, Mona Charen, and others whom I admire are wrong: rather than be embarrassed by Trump or worry that he will tarnish the conservative movement, conservatives should be taking a page from the Left and try to bring The Donald into the fold. In short, we need less public fulmination and more private persuasion.

I have nothing against Trump as a person. His bluster and crassness are unappealing to me, but my real reservation about him is that he does not grasp the wily ways of the Left and thus will be duped into policies that will work against his intended purpose. Remember the governorships of Arnold Schwarzenegger and Jesse Ventura.

The testimony of Conrad Black and others has shown me a side of Donald Trump I did not think existed. They both attest to his kind support during their times of trouble. This speaks to magnanimity, something sorely lacking in our times. The norm of our days is that your conservative friends vanish when you are accused of anything, however unjustly. Trump stands by his friends.  I am not arguing that Trump is Mitt Romney — a person of exemplary moral character — but that he could be somebody we could do business with.

Conservative thought leaders should approach Trump quietly and respectfully in an attempt to alert him to the dangers that litter the ideological landscape. This may already be going on behind the scenes, but if it is not, it should happen, pronto. That delegation should be led by Conrad Black and Larry Kudlow, resplendent in their finery. It should also include George Will, Charles Krauthammer, Jay Nordlinger and Mona Charen all dressed as penitents, unshod and wrapped in sackcloth.

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  1. Frank Soto Member
    Frank Soto
    @FrankSoto

    Sal: He’s not our cup of tea but he may be a cup we have to drink from.

    I may have to drink from a cup of single payer healthcare, anti-freedom of speech and religion, protectionism, and complete ignorance on all topics of economics and defense?

    No sir, I do not.

    All of which is bad enough without mentioning he was pro-illegal immigration, pro abortion on demand and said that Hillary Clinton was the best secretary of state we have ever had, just a couple of years ago.

    The man is a buffoon, a liar, and he will not have my vote under any circumstance, as he is not a conservative of any stripe.

    • #1
  2. Yudansha Member
    Yudansha
    @Yudansha

    Amen, Frank.  If he’s the nominee, I’ll vote Libertarian.

    Regarding his “inevitability” based on his polling numbers, color me skeptical.  Polling has been so very wrong, so very often recently that I don’t think his numbers in any way reflect reality.  Republican voters may be angry and truculent, but they have rarely shown an propensity for outright suicide.  Quite the opposite in fact — we usually pick the safest possible candidate.

    No. Trump will get nowhere near the nomination. Not in this Universe.

    • #2
  3. BrentB67 Inactive
    BrentB67
    @BrentB67

    If it makes you feel better I don’t think Trump converts his poll numbers to victory in Iowa or New Hampshire. I think he will do well enough to continue self funding, but do not see him with an outright victory.

    Will that derail his campaign? As long as he is willing and keep writing the checks he will probably stay in the game.

    • #3
  4. BrentB67 Inactive
    BrentB67
    @BrentB67

    Frank Soto:

    Sal: He’s not our cup of tea but he may be a cup we have to drink from.

    I may have to drink from a cup of single payer healthcare, anti-freedom of speech and religion, protectionism, and complete ignorance on all topics of economics and defense?

    No sir, I do not.

    All of which is bad enough without mentioning he was pro-illegal immigration, pro abortion on demand and said that Hillary Clinton was the best secretary of state we have ever had, just a couple of years ago.

    The man is a buffoon, a liar, and he will not have my vote under any circumstance, as he is not a conservative of any stripe.

    Then you are just voting for Hillary! To the fainting couch!

    • #4
  5. Sal Reagan
    Sal
    @Sal

    Frank Soto, there is no guarantee that Trump will be swayed by conservative arguments, but we have a duty to try to persuade him to our cause.

    • #5
  6. Sal Reagan
    Sal
    @Sal

    Yudansha, a vote for the libertarian candidate is vote for Hillary. In the presidency she will get to nominate Supreme Court justices. Remember that Antonin Scalia is in his 80s. Trump never lied to the parents of fallen heroes.

    • #6
  7. Yudansha Member
    Yudansha
    @Yudansha

    Sal:Yudansha, a vote for the libertarian candidate is vote for Hillary.

    I know.  I don’t care.

    • #7
  8. Randy Weivoda Moderator
    Randy Weivoda
    @RandyWeivoda

    Sal: It’s time we tried to make that unwanted cup as palatable as possible.

    That’s right, it is time.  For too long people in states like Iowa, New Hampshire, and South Carolina got the first chance to help decide who our nominee is going to be.  States at the tail end of the process often found that the die had been cast by the time they had their say.  Enough, I say.  We should unanimously acclaim who our nominee is right now.

    I can tell you one thing.  Four years ago, there’s nothing that brought more joy to conservatives than hearing again and again who the inevitable Republican candidate was going to be.  And when Mitt Romney was given the nomination it made it all the sweeter that we had been told for several months that nobody else ever really had a chance.

    • #8
  9. Matt Bartle Member
    Matt Bartle
    @MattBartle

    Best reflection on Trump I’ve read is today in American Thinker:

    “Although I may not especially like the erratic, often juvenile Mr. Trump, it isn’t lost on me that he at least doesn’t hold me in contempt. He may make war on illegal immigration and Muslim fundamentalism, but most of the alternatives are making war on me.”

    Read more: http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2015/12/it_has_come_to_this.html

    • #9
  10. Guruforhire Inactive
    Guruforhire
    @Guruforhire

    Sal:Frank Soto, there is no guarantee that Trump will be swayed by conservative arguments, but we have a duty to try to persuade him to our cause.

    I said awhile ago the best thing the republican party could do was pass over some policy advisers now while you still had a chance to be the one writing the formal policy positions.

    • #10
  11. Paul Dougherty Member
    Paul Dougherty
    @PaulDougherty

    Sal:Frank Soto, there is no guarantee that Trump will be swayed by conservative arguments, but we have a duty to try to persuade him to our cause.

    He doesn’t strike me as a man easily persuadable by argument, regardless of the content or messenger. He is untethered to the country’s concerns.

    • #11
  12. Eric Hines Inactive
    Eric Hines
    @EricHines

    I’ll hold my nose and vote Trump over any Democrat.  Any other course is just hiding under the bed and surrendering the nation to another four years of Democrat/Progressive damage to our nation.

    Eric Hines

    • #12
  13. Ario IronStar Inactive
    Ario IronStar
    @ArioIronStar

    Yudansha:

    Sal:Yudansha, a vote for the libertarian candidate is vote for Hillary.

    I know. I don’t care.

    Now it looks like it’s time for the supporters of the establishment to take their ball and go home.  Nyah, nyah, so there.

    • #13
  14. BrentB67 Inactive
    BrentB67
    @BrentB67

    Guruforhire:

    Sal:Frank Soto, there is no guarantee that Trump will be swayed by conservative arguments, but we have a duty to try to persuade him to our cause.

    I said awhile ago the best thing the republican party could do was pass over some policy advisers now while you still had a chance to be the one writing the formal policy positions.

    Reading his policy papers on his website they aren’t terrible. I think the concern like KP highlights is that he doesn’t always adhere to his own plans.

    • #14
  15. Paul Dougherty Member
    Paul Dougherty
    @PaulDougherty

    BrentB67:

    Guruforhire:

    Sal:Frank Soto, there is no guarantee that Trump will be swayed by conservative arguments, but we have a duty to try to persuade him to our cause.

    I said awhile ago the best thing the republican party could do was pass over some policy advisers now while you still had a chance to be the one writing the formal policy positions.

    Reading his policy papers on his website they aren’t terrible. I think the concern like KP highlights is that he doesn’t always adhere to his own plans.

    Are you confident that he has an intention to adhere to his proposed policies?  I suspect he approaches “his” policies the way he does to his amended statements. “That is not what I said”, when it was what he said. He is untethered to any position. That is what is making him so apparently effective.  He says whatever the situation calls for and we mistake it for sincere greatness.

    • #15
  16. Guruforhire Inactive
    Guruforhire
    @Guruforhire

    BrentB67:

    Guruforhire:

    Sal:Frank Soto, there is no guarantee that Trump will be swayed by conservative arguments, but we have a duty to try to persuade him to our cause.

    I said awhile ago the best thing the republican party could do was pass over some policy advisers now while you still had a chance to be the one writing the formal policy positions.

    Reading his policy papers on his website they aren’t terrible. I think the concern like KP highlights is that he doesn’t always adhere to his own plans.

    Nobody does.  But you have the opportunity to establish the anchor around which he has to operate, and pick the advisers which will carry over into a trump administration which will be one providing the plans “prepare for me 3 plans to do x and present the trade offs between them.”

    Trump is handing the Party the chance to pick the “smart advisers.”

    Its a win-win.  He outsources resolving the hard part about running an outsider campaign, and the party elders get to keep him and his voters on the reservation.

    • #16
  17. Paul Dougherty Member
    Paul Dougherty
    @PaulDougherty

    He fired Gene Simmons.

    This sounds trite and like pop culture frivolity but I think it is vary insightful. Trump fired Mr. Simmons against Tump’s own business interest. Gene Simmons was the strongest talent in the group and he was right on the issue. The question before the board was about his marketing judgement and Mr. Simmons refused to back down and admit he was wrong , when he was not wrong. Mr. Trump recognized Gene Simmons as a threat to his personal spotlight. That is why he fired him. These are the actions that a two-bit dictator does when assuming power. Eliminate talented threats.

    For background on my interest, I  loathe KISS. The music is horrible and the garish costume always stuck me as silly. That said, it was the sheer marketing genius of the bass player that got them to international super-stardom.  That was their real talent.

    • #17
  18. Bob W Member
    Bob W
    @WBob

    He is extremely insecure and susceptible to flattery, most recently by Putin. That’s the side of him that I worry about the most.

    • #18
  19. Sal Reagan
    Sal
    @Sal

    BrentB67, I hope you are right, but just in case you are not, conservatives should be trying to bring Trump into the fold rather than just excoriating him. Thanks for your service. Sal

    • #19
  20. donald todd Inactive
    donald todd
    @donaldtodd

    Frank Soto: #1 “All of which is bad enough without mentioning he was … pro abortion on demand”

    Trump: One thing about me, I’m a very honorable guy. I’m pro-life, but I changed my view a number of years ago. One of the primary reasons I changed [was] a friend of mine’s wife was pregnant, and he didn’t really want the baby. He was crying as he was telling me the story. He ends up having the baby and the baby is the apple of his eye. It’s the greatest thing that’s ever happened to him. And you know here’s a baby that wasn’t going to be let into life. And I heard this, and some other stories, and I am pro-life.

    Q: So those stories did change you, they came around and changed you?

    A: They changed me. Yeah, they changed my view as to that, absolutely.

    • #20
  21. Sal Reagan
    Sal
    @Sal

    Paul Dougherty, Trump needs to be shown how consistent conservative policies are the only vehicle to his goals. Remember O’Sullivan’s Law, everything and everyone who is not explicitly conservative will, over time become a liberal. Rush calls it the most gutless choice one can make and he is right.

    • #21
  22. donald todd Inactive
    donald todd
    @donaldtodd

    BrentB67:If it makes you feel better I don’t think Trump converts his poll numbers to victory in Iowa or New Hampshire.

    “If it makes you feel better..”  Are we moving into feelings now?  Have conservatives started to flutter?  Do we need smelling salts?

    • #22
  23. Frank Soto Member
    Frank Soto
    @FrankSoto

    Donald,

    Im old enough to remember when Mitt Romney using a similar tale of having his mind changed was not sufficient for many on this site.

    Trump gets passes in his flip flopping and all around incoherence that none of you would grant anyone but Trump.

    • #23
  24. donald todd Inactive
    donald todd
    @donaldtodd

    Yudansha:Amen, Frank. If he’s the nominee, I’ll vote Libertarian.

    No. Trump will get nowhere near the nomination. Not in this Universe.

    Libertarian?  In the universe you are writing about Trump crapped out early and is now long gone.

    In this universe that hasn’t happened.  I know because I hear Will and Krauthammer and others on the FNS panel shriek with horror every time he comes up.

    We live in different universes.

    • #24
  25. donald todd Inactive
    donald todd
    @donaldtodd

    Yudansha:

    Sal:Yudansha, a vote for the libertarian candidate is vote for Hillary.

    I know. I don’t care.

    A true conservative, not.

    • #25
  26. Sal Reagan
    Sal
    @Sal

    Yudansha, if you are a conservative you should care. The country is going down the tubes; we don’t have the luxury of holding out for perfect candidates. The rule should be: elect the most conservative candidate the pester him or her constantly to move right. This is how the left got to where they got. We should follow their example, if not their morals.

    • #26
  27. donald todd Inactive
    donald todd
    @donaldtodd

    Not only is the perfect the enemy of the good, the good is the enemy of the evil.  If Trump is the nominee, then he gets my vote.

    Nor am I so stupid as to think that Trump’s nomination automatically hands the election to Hillary!.  No votes have been cast.  Regarding handing the election to Hillary! I haven’t yet figured out if that ploy is cowardice or fear mongering.

    • #27
  28. V the K Member
    V the K
    @VtheK

    I may have to drink from a cup of single payer healthcare, anti-freedom of speech and religion, protectionism, and complete ignorance on all topics of economics and defense?

    As opposed to a Republican Party that has:

    • Fully funded Obamacare
    • Fully funded Executive Amnesty
    • Fully funded Planned Parenthood
    • Fully funded Obama’s Justice Department as it cracks down on 1st, 2nd, 4th, and 10th Amendment Rights
    • Fully Funded Obama’s EPA, including the implementation of all of his Climate Change Protocols
    • Facilitated the acceptance and implementation of Obama’s Iran Deal
    • Gave its blessing to Obamatrade
    • Celebrated all of the above as proof that “Congress is working again.”

    You can understand why I am not particularly upset that a ‘True Republican’ may not be the nominee.

    • #28
  29. donald todd Inactive
    donald todd
    @donaldtodd

    Frank Soto:Donald,

    Im old enough to remember when Mitt Romney using a similar tale of having his mind changed was not sufficient for many on this site.

    Trump gets passes in his flip flopping and all around incoherence that none of you would grant anyone but Trump.

    I am too.  Romney claimed to be the best friend abortion ever had when he ran against Kennedy for a Massachusetts Senate seat.  Since I was once a Democrat, and I have changed, I am willing to allow others to come to the same conclusions, however they get there and whenever they get there, no matter what they once sounded like.

    My religion bids me to do so, and even provides a confessional for me.  The big book bids me to do so.  My own faults bid me to do so.  Being aware of my own faults, I can afford to be generous to others who are running the gauntlet I am running through.  Personally – without regard to the election – I hope Trump continues to change with what seems to me to be for the better.

    • #29
  30. BrentB67 Inactive
    BrentB67
    @BrentB67

    Paul Dougherty:

    BrentB67:

    Guruforhire:

    Sal:Frank Soto, there is no guarantee that Trump will be swayed by conservative arguments, but we have a duty to try to persuade him to our cause.

    I said awhile ago the best thing the republican party could do was pass over some policy advisers now while you still had a chance to be the one writing the formal policy positions.

    Reading his policy papers on his website they aren’t terrible. I think the concern like KP highlights is that he doesn’t always adhere to his own plans.

    Are you confident that he has an intention to adhere to his proposed policies?

    No more than I am any other candidate. It is similar to Marco Rubio trying to figure out immigration policy and Ted Cruz daily waffle on farm subsidies.

    I suspect he approaches “his” policies the way he does to his amended statements. “That is not what I said”, when it was what he said. He is untethered to any position. That is what is making him so apparently effective. He says whatever the situation calls for and we mistake it for sincere greatness.

    I agree. How does that differ from any other person in the field?

    • #30
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