Contributor Post Created with Sketch. The First GOP Debate: One Thought

 

The last time around — in 2011 and 2012 — I followed developments minutely, profiling most of the candidates and hoping against hope that someone would emerge on the Republican side who was more impressive than the godfather of Obamacare. But it did not happen. In the world of the blind, the one-eyed man is king, and Mitt Romney was the one-eyed man. The Republican bench was bare. We had has-beens (Gingrich, Santorum) and never-could-have-beens … and so, late in the game, I reluctantly, then a bit too enthusiastically, embraced Romney.

This time, the Republican Party has such a plethora of talent that there are three serious possibilities who did not make the cut for the late-evening debate. Rick Perry, Bobby Jindal, and Carly Fiorina are all superior to the best of the candidates that we had last time.

There are 20 comments.

Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.
  1. Mike Rapkoch Moderator

    Agreed Paul. I do hope Jindal or Fiorina jump in the polls.

    • #1
    • August 6, 2015, at 5:36 PM PDT
    • Like
  2. Concretevol Thatcher

    I agree also. I would guess Fiorina and Perry make the jump, just don’t see Jindal getting traction.

    • #2
    • August 6, 2015, at 5:49 PM PDT
    • Like
  3. Frozen Chosen Inactive

    Uh, Rick Perry was a candidate last time

    • #3
    • August 6, 2015, at 6:56 PM PDT
    • Like
  4. Chuck Enfield Coolidge

    Frozen Chosen:Uh, Rick Perry was a candidate last time

    Can you prove that?

    • #4
    • August 6, 2015, at 7:57 PM PDT
    • Like
  5. Leigh Member

    I still think they should have done some rotation between breaks rather than having two separate debates.

    • #5
    • August 6, 2015, at 8:16 PM PDT
    • Like
  6. Umbra Fractus Coolidge
    Umbra Fractus Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    They should handle it like English soccer: Trump and Kasich get relegated, and the top two from the afternoon debate (I didn’t watch it, but it sounds like Fiorina and either Perry or Jindal) get promoted.

    • #6
    • August 6, 2015, at 8:32 PM PDT
    • Like
  7. Percival Thatcher
    Percival Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    They definitely need to come up with a better system of determining which candidates get into the debates. The margin of error on the polls in question were as high as 5-6%.

    • #7
    • August 6, 2015, at 9:51 PM PDT
    • Like
  8. The Cloaked Gaijin Member

    Rick Perry with glasses is better than Rick Perry on back pain medication?

    However, is the Rick Perry on back pain medication better than the Rick Perry that endorsed Al Gore for president?

    Wasn’t this the plot of the movie Multiplicity? Too many copies and the last one comes out messed up. Or does the formula reverse for Rick Perrys?

    I’ll take Air Force pilot Rick Perry and glasses Rick Perry for the win. Then I’d chuck the others.

    A pilot that insists upon wearing glasses. Yeah, this is going to work out well.

    How about a combination of Katy Perry with Luke Perry? That would be really handy when you need a brunette to play a Vulcan or Romulan with long sideburns.

    • #8
    • August 6, 2015, at 10:14 PM PDT
    • Like
  9. raycon and lindacon Inactive

    Once the Kabuki is over, JEB will be the anointed one for the GOP establishment, and we will have a replay of 2012. Then we will content ourselves with four more years of ineffective opposition, if not outright collaboration with the left. Once again a Republican congress will either make empty promises if they win or whine about the conservatives if they lose.

    After over 50 years of watching this happen, broken only by Reagan, who the GOP establishment was unable to defeat, those of us old enough realize that there is no organized opposition party to fight against the left cannot play. If the GOP doesn’t get killed off, there will be no going back.

    And don’t think that the efforts of Obama will be stopped. He represents the future of America if the left remains unopposed.

    • #9
    • August 7, 2015, at 12:14 AM PDT
    • Like
  10. Titus Techera Contributor

    I think your story of pure maidens betrayed by evil rakes forgot that before Reagan there was Goldwater…

    • #10
    • August 7, 2015, at 1:55 AM PDT
    • Like
  11. raycon and lindacon Inactive

    And Goldwater was vigorously opposed by the combined efforts of both the GOP establishment and the left.

    He did not win the presidency.

    • #11
    • August 7, 2015, at 7:19 AM PDT
    • Like
  12. Titus Techera Contributor

    raycon and lindacon:And Goldwater was vigorously opposed by the combined efforts of both the GOP establishment and the left.

    He did not win the presidency.

    Yeah, but don’t tell me it’s kabuki if conservatives cannot get their act together. Goldwater did win the nomination, when the establishment was rather more serious than it is now.

    Conservatism sometimes sounds like a kind of secret religion: Nobody is a conservative in public life. In politics you need politicians who need the support of the electorate. The establishment & the left have not somehow secretly made it impossible for conservatives to come up with good politicians.

    Are there not enough red states? What’s the problem? Why does the party base or some moiety thereof have to keep yelling for Mr. Carson or Mr. Cain or Mrs. Fiorina or whoever else was this kind of populist fantasy? It seems like conservatives either are unable to judge politicians or to support them or to really think about politics as requiring politicians. & this is not to say conservatives are the only ones who do kooky things–there are all those who support strange little politicians–Mr. Pataki, Mr. Huntsman, & however many others. & that’s leaving Mr. Trump out of it–I’m not ready to blame conservatism for that calamity.

    • #12
    • August 7, 2015, at 7:32 AM PDT
    • Like
  13. Paul A. Rahe Contributor
    Paul A. Rahe

    Frozen Chosen:Uh, Rick Perry was a candidate last time

    Only in a manner of speaking. He was coming off a major operation and feeling the after-effects of being put under. He is much, much better on his feet now.

    • #13
    • August 7, 2015, at 10:57 AM PDT
    • Like
  14. Paul A. Rahe Contributor
    Paul A. Rahe

    raycon and lindacon:Once the Kabuki is over, JEB will be the anointed one for the GOP establishment, and we will have a replay of 2012. Then we will content ourselves with four more years of ineffective opposition, if not outright collaboration with the left. Once again a Republican congress will either make empty promises if they win or whine about the conservatives if they lose.

    After over 50 years of watching this happen, broken only by Reagan, who the GOP establishment was unable to defeat, those of us old enough realize that there is no organized opposition party to fight against the left cannot play. If the GOP doesn’t get killed off, there will be no going back.

    And don’t think that the efforts of Obama will be stopped. He represents the future of America if the left remains unopposed.

    I hope that you are wrong, but …

    • #14
    • August 7, 2015, at 10:58 AM PDT
    • Like
  15. Titus Techera Contributor

    Paul A. Rahe:

    Frozen Chosen:Uh, Rick Perry was a candidate last time

    Only in a manner of speaking. He was coming off a major operation and feeling the after-effects of being put under. He is much, much better on his feet now.

    He cannot attract enough attention to be in the debates? Well, the real debates. Well, they’re not really debates. Let’s call it the pageant. & America now has a pageant where the right-of-center folks who said all-image-no-practice Sen. Obama was no good cannot be bothered to care about life-of-service-&-accomplishment Mr. Perry because they’ve got the hots for Mr. Trump, the last of the buffalo bullies.

    • #15
    • August 7, 2015, at 11:04 AM PDT
    • Like
  16. Frozen Chosen Inactive

    Paul A. Rahe:

    Frozen Chosen:Uh, Rick Perry was a candidate last time

    Only in a manner of speaking. He was coming off a major operation and feeling the after-effects of being put under. He is much, much better on his feet now.

    I’ve seen Perry in a few interviews recently and while he is marginally better than he was in 2012 he is still far behind Rubio, Fiorina, Cruz and a few others when it comes to thinking on his feet. He can read a speech but anyone can do that.

    I just don’t think Perry is that bright. He’s not stupid by any means – just kind of average. Reminds me of George Bush.

    • #16
    • August 7, 2015, at 11:46 AM PDT
    • Like
  17. Frozen Chosen Inactive

    raycon and lindacon:Once the Kabuki is over, JEB will be the anointed one for the GOP establishment, and we will have a replay of 2012. Then we will content ourselves with four more years of ineffective opposition, if not outright collaboration with the left. Once again a Republican congress will either make empty promises if they win or whine about the conservatives if they lose.

    After over 50 years of watching this happen, broken only by Reagan, who the GOP establishment was unable to defeat, those of us old enough realize that there is no organized opposition party to fight against the left cannot play. If the GOP doesn’t get killed off, there will be no going back.

    And don’t think that the efforts of Obama will be stopped. He represents the future of America if the left remains unopposed.

    I agree that Jeb would lose but I’m not convinced any of the other candidates would win either. We need to be unconventional in 2016. The old ways just don’t work with this electorate. I believe that Rubio and Fiorina offer our best hope to change the paradigm.

    • #17
    • August 7, 2015, at 11:49 AM PDT
    • Like
  18. Umbra Fractus Coolidge
    Umbra Fractus Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Frozen Chosen: I just don’t think Perry is that bright. He’s not stupid by any means – just kind of average. Reminds me of George Bush.

    Perry’s not used to debating; I don’t think he’s ever had any real competition. Even when he first took office he ascended from the Lt. Governorship when Bush became President, so there was no real primary process. And, of course, the idea that Texas Democrats might concern him is just laughable.

    • #18
    • August 7, 2015, at 5:10 PM PDT
    • Like
  19. Titus Techera Contributor

    Umbra Fractus:

    Frozen Chosen: I just don’t think Perry is that bright. He’s not stupid by any means – just kind of average. Reminds me of George Bush.

    Perry’s not used to debating; I don’t think he’s ever had any real competition. Even when he first took office he ascended from the Lt. Governorship when Bush became President, so there was no real primary process. And, of course, the idea that Texas Democrats might concern him is just laughable.

    It was not Dems that bothered him in Texas: It was the Bush family; they were political enemies. I believe he did fear one great primary challenge–Mrs. Kay Bailey Hutchinson?–but it didn’t happen in 2002, when I guess it would have been a more serious challenge–it happened in 2010… Still, it was not nothing-

    • #19
    • August 8, 2015, at 12:18 AM PDT
    • Like
  20. Umbra Fractus Coolidge
    Umbra Fractus Joined in the first year of Ricochet Ricochet Charter Member

    Titus Techera: It was not Dems that bothered him in Texas: It was the Bush family; they were political enemies. I believe he did fear one great primary challenge–Mrs. Kay Bailey Hutchinson?–but it didn’t happen in 2002, when I guess it would have been a more serious challenge–it happened in 2010… Still, it was not nothing-

    KBH was a) pro-choice (though admittedly closer to Tom Meyer than the typical Democrat on the issue) and b) a former senator running at a time when anti-Washington sentiment was at its peak. All Perry really had to do was make the race into Washington vs. Austin* and he had it in the proverbial bag.

    *We make fun of Austin but it’s still preferable to Washington.

    • #20
    • August 8, 2015, at 8:42 AM PDT
    • Like

Comments are closed because this post is more than six months old. Please write a new post if you would like to continue this conversation.