The Spirit of Ricochet: Elevating the Tone

 

RadicalCivilityIn response to our unceasing efforts to persuade our own members to join Ricochet, one of our members sent us a message. The key sentence was unsettling:

The ratio of thoughtful, respectful, and factual comments to insulting and emotive comments is not inspiring.

Our first response was defensive. We promptly crunched the numbers, having rigorously defined the terms “thoughtful,” “respectful,” “factual,” insulting,” “emotive,” and “inspiring,” and found the ratio is entirely inspiring.

But after we smoothed our ruffled feathers and got over our how very dare yous, we admitted it. Inspiring is not good enough. The ratio must be glorious. We must settle for nothing less than the Golden Ratio: “All comments must always be thoughtful, factual and respectful. None may be emotive or insulting.” (Emotion is fine. It’s politics, after all. But comments that call to mind the hystrionics in Britain in the wake of the death of Princess Diana are not.)

One of my “bosses” suggested the problem might defy automation. He insinuated that it might require more “work” on my part. “Get out there and be a beat cop, Claire. Go smack ’em down (politely) if you see anyone disgracing our honor with so much of a hint of an insulting or emotive comment.”

To which of course I said, “Don’t be absurd. We are American. Nothing defies our automation. We build better mousetraps. We build them bigger, better, faster and open longer. “Defies automation?” That’s what they used to say about flying.”

A lively, civil, polite, debate about Ricochet politics ensued. We have the seeds of good ideas, I suspect. But we must think more about them lest on careful inspection they prove to be stupid.

For now I wonder if you would indulge me in an experiment.

The “like” button is a blunt tool. Members have no way to show each other that they like a comment for a good reason. Merely “liking” something is for the soft-minded who do not belong here. On Ricochet we do not “like” things because we feel good about them. We like them because we have good reasons to prefer them.

“First thing we do before anything new and fancy is kill the bugs. Down to the very last roach,” said the Boss. Hard to disagree. But what if we try this as a temporary workaround. Suppose these were the new “like” buttons:

Logical Rigor (LR): “I liked your comment because your argument is sound: The argument is valid, and all of the premises are true.” (If you require a refresher on these terms, this will do.)

Ourstanding Civility (OC): “Whereas an uncivilized man might have responded to the previous comment with a disgraceful locution, you chose to respond with wit, tact, and civility. How admirable.”

Elevating the Tone of the Thread (ETT): Very occasionally a spectre of incivility haunts a thread on Ricochet. Even if no one has violated the CoC, the tone is somehow not in the right spirit. When this happens, our members tend politely to encourage each other to sort themselves out. Those who do should be lauded (or Liked) for encouraging civilized norms.

Introducing a Good Idea (IGI): “I had not thought of it that way. That stopped me in my tracks. You may be right, you may be wrong, but that’s the kind of new perspective on this problem that makes me think we might get somewhere with it.”

Consistent Intellectual Standards (CIS): Those willing reconsider their position if presented with conflicting data or a better argument are neither weak nor wobbly: They are intellectually rigorous. On Ricochet, this is a quality we treasure.

What do you say: Shall we try them for a week? Use the old like button as usual, but when you see the above qualities, reply to the post in question with the abbreviations: LR, OC, ETT, INI, CIS. No need to say more.

Then you can tell us next week if your experience of Ricochet was more agreeable as a result. It is a bit complicated, but why not try? The worst that could happen is we don’t like it.

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  1. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Claire Berlinski:Well, yes.

    But we do prefer less Diana and more Churchill here. (And I don’t think you need to worry overmuch about us going all humorless while I’m around. )

    You had them starting to wind themselves up, Claire. Now you went and broke the mainspring.

    • #31
  2. user_656019 Coolidge
    user_656019
    @RayKujawa

    The Great Adventure!:

    Claire Berlinski

    Claire, I sincerely hope you made that comment with your tongue firmly planted in your cheek.

    Yeah! LR, OC, ETT.

    • #32
  3. user_656019 Coolidge
    user_656019
    @RayKujawa

    Arahant:

    Claire Berlinski:Well, yes.

    But we do prefer less Diana and more Churchill here. (And I don’t think you need to worry overmuch about us going all humorless while I’m around. )

    You had them starting to wind themselves up, Claire. Now you went an broke the mainspring.

    LR, ETT.

    Claire, you forgot Charles maybe?

    • #33
  4. user_656019 Coolidge
    user_656019
    @RayKujawa

    Arahant:

    The Great Adventure!: My intellectual powers

    We’re the hexuple nines, because the Triple Nines are just too slow for Ricochet. But that’s alright. You have proven your intelligence by joining the rest of us big brains as a member.

    ETT(NOT)

    • #34
  5. user_645 Member
    user_645
    @Claire

    Ray Kujawa:

    But if you can’t handle the silliness or the whimsicalness of most of the comments, you probably won’t catch the seriousness and spirit either.

    Can’t handle silliness and whimsicalness at all, Ray. You know me: Famous for being entirely literal-minded and absolutely lacking in playfulness. Why, I do not even laugh at Belgian jokes. If you tell me a helicoper crashed in a Belgian cemetary and the rescue teams have already found 100 dead people, I will just stare blankly at you and say, “I do not see why that’s funny.”

    • #35
  6. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    So, Claire, if one has a British dialect, as opposed to the common American dialects, does that automatically elevate the tone of the conversation?

    • #36
  7. Stad Coolidge
    Stad
    @Stad

    What we need is a way to punish posting or commenting wrongdoers—not those who violate the COC, but those who exceed the bounds of good taste in a discussion thread.  I’m not asking for an outright ban, but something more than a slap on the wrist if they would only repent and acknowledge their sins.

    For example, someone who commits a sexist faux pas in a post or comment can declare “I was wrong, so FSOG (Fifty Shades of Grey) me!”

    Any commenter accusing a poster of being a closet liberal can apologize with “My bad, I’ll drop my Jeb Bush donation and DMTTC (donate money to Ted Cruz).”

    Someone who posts “Hillary Clinton might not make a bad President” can make amends to his fellow Ricochetti by pronouncing “I’m getting a tattoo that says RFHN! (Ready for Hillary—Not!)”.

    There are dozens I could come up with, but let me say in closing . . .

    Claire, your new icon is HOT!  Ooops, my bad . . . I guess you need to FSOG me.

    My silk tie awaits . . . (so much for elevating the tone, not to mention the intellectual quality of the thread)

    • #37
  8. EThompson Member
    EThompson
    @

    Severely Ltd.:I would opt for all of us growing thicker skins. Short of insults I sure don’t mind a heated discussion now and then and enforcing a code of strict civility reminds of nothing more than the PC thought police.

    I’ve seen folks called out for getting too personal and that seems to be effective. I’d rather be paying for raucous, boisterous discussions like The Inklings than having everyone tiptoeing around afraid of hurting anyone’s feelings. We on the right are considerate but I hope not gelded.

    LR.

    • #38
  9. Ricochet Member
    Ricochet
    @BertHuggins

    How about a button with “ISBIOTACO” – it should be intuitively obvious to a casual observer

    • #39
  10. Skarv Inactive
    Skarv
    @Skarv

    The proposal is likely to discourage posting which I believe is a mistake for Ricochet as a business.  As we do not know how many members there are I can only guess and my guess is that the ratio of members who contribute in writing compared to total number of members is very small. That is probably an indication that the subscribers who are highly unlikely to leave is small.

    A grading system would discourage contribution further and make the member pages less enticing to read. Ricochet should try to increase the number of posters as it would deepen the engagement and make the site more likely to grow and flourish.

    BTW: Not to complain on low LR and CIS but the golden ratio is a/b=(a+b)/a=1.61…

    • #40
  11. user_1938 Inactive
    user_1938
    @AaronMiller

    Ray Kujawa:Methinks you think popular posts like the PIT and Chix PIT are beneath you.

    I’m not saying other threads, both member and contributor initiated, don’t get their share of insulting and emotive comments. When we tire of the tone of the conversation, we PITsters retreat to our oases for rest and relaxation from the stress of dealing with abusive commenters. The fact that these posts exist and continue to be supported by a loyal cadre of members might confirm some of the original points of your post.

    Newcomers, tread carefully. It’s called the PIT because it’s quicksand, a black hole. Dare to enter and you might never escape.

    So far, I have managed to avoid four PITs. Yet Ricochet still manages to swallow hours before I blink and notice the sun already setting.

    • #41
  12. user_656019 Coolidge
    user_656019
    @RayKujawa

    Stad:What we need is a way to punish posting or commenting wrongdoers—not those who violate the COC, but those who exceed the bounds of good taste in a discussion thread. I’m not asking for an outright ban, but something more than a slap on the wrist if they would only repent and acknowledge their sins.

    If you feel the person did the opposite of one of the acronyms, my suggestion is to include the (NOT) or perhaps (not) functional argument. Or perhaps (not?), (not!?), (not!?!), including !’s and/or ?’s as they were wont to do years ago in commenting on the questionableness or brilliance of moves in analyses of chess matches. Too sarcastic, perhaps?

    • #42
  13. Howellis Inactive
    Howellis
    @ManWiththeAxe

    I find the general tone of Ricochet perfectly fine. Once in a while the harshness gets ever so slightly elevated, but we’re all big boys and girls, and should be able to handle the little bit of churlishness we occasionally see. If it gets to be too much, feel free to point it out in a comment. I’ll bet you get a quick apology.

    As for the like button, I agree that it might be better to have both  “like” and “agree” buttons. If we’re going to have alphabet soup, I’ll suggest a few that are already prevalent on the net that might be useful on Ricochet, and maybe should have their own buttons:

    • GMTA Great minds think alike.
    • YAOTM   Yet Another Off Topic Message
    • ITA    I Totally Agree
    • A2D  Agree to Disagree
    • NAGI    Not A Good Idea
    • FCOL   For Crying Out Loud
    • #43
  14. Jon Gabriel, Ed. Contributor
    Jon Gabriel, Ed.
    @jon

    Jason Rudert:I’m not taking this thread seriously until that pinky gets tucked in. Look at how exjon does it.

    IGI

    • #44
  15. user_656019 Coolidge
    user_656019
    @RayKujawa

    Aaron Miller:

    Ray Kujawa:

    So far, I have managed to avoid four PITs. Yet Ricochet still manages to swallow hours before I blink and notice the sun already setting.

    Or sun rising, as the case may be.

    • #45
  16. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Ray Kujawa:

    Stad:What we need is a way to punish posting or commenting wrongdoers—not those who violate the COC, but those who exceed the bounds of good taste in a discussion thread. I’m not asking for an outright ban, but something more than a slap on the wrist if they would only repent and acknowledge their sins.

    If you feel the person did the opposite of one of the acronyms, my suggestion is to include the (NOT) or perhaps (not) functional argument. Or perhaps (not?), (not!?), (not!?!), including !’s and/or ?’s as they were wont to do years ago in commenting on the questionableness or brilliance of moves in analyses of chess matches. Too sarcastic, perhaps?

    PL/1 had a symbol for that ¬, so ¬LR, ¬IGI, etc.

    • #46
  17. user_2505 Contributor
    user_2505
    @GaryMcVey

    Anything to do with firearms and taxes gets a spirited response, but generally Ricos agree on those issues (broadly yes, and no, respectively).

    Churches are a little trickier, largely because we have a well-noted 500 year disagreement within the Christian family which has fortunately calmed markedly. These confessional disagreements tend to be goodnatured and are rarely sharp, though I’ve seen, and had some dustups. One endless thread was an unyielding argument about whether Jews should see converts to Christianity as traitors or as trailblazers. It got heated, and frankly it had to, if the topic of religion wasn’t going to be banned altogether. Many Rico friendships or ideological coalitions are crossfaith, no pun intended.

    Police powers is sizzlin’ hot around here, running the gamut between old fashioned law and order conservatives, principled libertarians, people with experience in law enforcement, people with bad experiences with law enforcers, and even a mutant strain I’ve bitterly come to call the “cop killer conservatives” who feel that anyone with a badge is an oppressor waiting to reveal themselves. Four of my brothers have served or are serving as city policemen, so no, I can’t be more polite. I’m doing the best I can.

    Warfare and the “American empire” are also a much more mixed bag than most liberals would guess from a conservative web site. Somewhere between Rand Paul and John Bolton are the To Hell With Them Hawks, which I suspect may be the default Ricochet membership position.

    So we reach the top of the Ricochet Top Ten Fight Club list of decreasing civility, gay rights (however you define the subject) including SSM. Even here, though, I’d have to say that conversation has tended towards more, not less civility. A good part of the reason is that Cato Rand and Zafar are personally popular even when their opinions aren’t; I’ve seen some grudging agreement on the merits of the people, not the arguments on both sides.

    • #47
  18. Steve C. Member
    Steve C.
    @user_531302

    BTW: Not to complain on low LR and CIS but the golden ratio is a/b=(a+b)/a=1.61…

    TMMDNR

    • #48
  19. user_656019 Coolidge
    user_656019
    @RayKujawa

    Jason Rudert:Ironically, this post actually violates the First Rule of Ricochet:

    You do not ask for usability improvements on Ricochet. Whatever it is, it’s just too hard.

    ETT(not)

    • #49
  20. user_645 Member
    user_645
    @Claire

    Arahant:So, Claire, if one has a British dialect, as opposed to the common American dialects, does that automatically elevate the tone of the conversation?

    That would severely, and I do mean severely, depend on the kind of British accent. You realize that the British class structure is more rigid than Imperial China’s, right?

    • #50
  21. T-Fiks Member
    T-Fiks
    @TFiks

    My goodness. I retired at 63 from teaching, in part because of the ponderous student-work scoring rubrics that were imposed on us by our betters in administration. What’s next, a stack of posts to grade before Monday?
    The impulse to fine-tune the feedback is understandable, but can I please just mark “like” on a post if I have an ill-defined, visceral appreciation of it?

    • #51
  22. kylez Member
    kylez
    @kylez

    Mike LaRoche:I propose a like button for Texans: Boy Howdy (BH)

    “I tell you what”

    • #52
  23. kylez Member
    kylez
    @kylez

    T-Fiks:My goodness. I retired at 63 from teaching, in part because of the ponderous student-work scoring rubrics that were imposed on us by our betters in administration. What’s next, a stack of posts to grade before Monday? The impulse to fine-tune the feedback is understandable, but can I please just mark “like” on posts if I have an ill-defined, visceral appreciation of it?

    I-DVA

    • #53
  24. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Claire Berlinski:

    Arahant:So, Claire, if one has a British dialect, as opposed to the common American dialects, does that automatically elevate the tone of the conversation?

    That would severely, and I do mean severely, depend on the kind of British accent. You realize that the British class structure is more rigid than Imperial China’s, right?

    But of course, my deah. I would nevah be speaking of the plebeian dialects, such as Brummies or in Yorkshah.

    • #54
  25. user_75648 Thatcher
    user_75648
    @JohnHendrix

    Trink:Claire :) Brilliant satire.

    It IS isn’t it ? :(

    Now she won’t answer just so as to drive you crazy wondering.

    • #55
  26. user_1938 Inactive
    user_1938
    @AaronMiller

    By the way, the last time (of only two) I flagged a comment, I also sent the author of the flagged comment a private message to explain my reasoning. This seems fair, like the legal notion of being able to confront one’s accuser.

    The “offender” and “tattletale” quickly came to a general agreement and there were no hard feelings. Flagging doesn’t have to be an irreparable conflict.

    Generally, I just try to play the role of apologist (I’m a middle child, after all) or to refocus the conversation on impersonal considerations. But at times a private message to another member might be more appropriate, because that doesn’t distract further from the larger conversation and it’s easier to swallow than being called out in public.

    • #56
  27. user_645 Member
    user_645
    @Claire

    Well, sounds like everyone hates this idea. Never mind.

    Can’t know until you ask, though, right?

    • #57
  28. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Claire Berlinski:Well, sounds like everyone hates this idea. Never mind.

    Can’t know until you ask, though, right?

    I don’t think everyone does. Ray is liberally sprinkling acronyms around the PIT now. You’ve created a monster.

    • #58
  29. Pencilvania Inactive
    Pencilvania
    @Pencilvania

    If you really want to elevate the tone, you need to get more women commenting.  Specifically, sopranos.

    • #59
  30. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Pencilvania:If you really want to elevate the tone, you need to get more women commenting. Specifically, sopranos.

    *Bangs head against desktop.*

    Musician jokes are inappropriate for elevating Ricochet. Helium works much better.

    • #60
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