How Can a President Tell the Truth About Radical Islam?

 

640px-EnterpriseTripoliFrom a weekly column by Rev. George Rutler:

Exactly 229 years ago this month, when the Barbary pirates were menacing ships of the newborn United States off the coasts of Tunis and Algiers, Thomas Jefferson and John Adams met in London with a Muslim diplomat representing the Bey of Algiers to inquire why his religion made his people so hostile to a new country that posed them no threat. They reported to Congress through a letter to John Jay, then Secretary of Foreign Affairs, the ambassador’s explanation that:

“Islam was founded on the Laws of their prophet, that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman who should be slain in battle was sure to go to paradise.”

….[I]f God is pure will without reason, whose mercy is gratuitous and has nothing to do with any sort of moral covenant with the human race, then irrational force in his name is licit, and conscience has no role in faith. This is not the eccentric interpretation of extremists; it is the logical conclusion of the assertions in the Koran itself.

May we grant that Fr. Rutler is onto something here, namely that: a) “Irrational force,” as he calls it, is indeed consonant with the underlying Islamic worldview; and that, b) Muslims have been visiting violence upon the West for a very long time, as demonstrated by the depredations of the Barbary pirates (not to mention the conquest of Byzantium and Spain and the various attempts to invade Europe proper).

Grant all that, and you still end up with a difficult question about just what American diplomats and high officials — above all, of course, the president — should say. How is President Obama — how is his successor — to tell the truth about radical Islam without inciting civilizational anger on the part of the world’s 1.6 billion Muslims? How?

Image Credit: “EnterpriseTripoli” by William Bainbridge Hoff (died 1903) – http://www.archives.gov/research/military/navy-ships/sailing-ships.html. Licensed under Public Domain via Wikimedia Commons.

Published in General
Like this post? Want to comment? Join Ricochet’s community of conservatives and be part of the conversation. Join Ricochet for Free.

There are 112 comments.

Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.
  1. Tuck Inactive
    Tuck
    @Tuck

    AIG:

    Right, because that’s exactly what Obama is doing.

    Isn’t it?  Obama’s making a fool out of himself with the Iranians, and as for the boots on the ground bit, I gather you’ve still not read the papers…

    • #91
  2. user_645 Member
    user_645
    @Claire

    Zafar:

    AIG:

    Georgia,

    I’ve never been to Georgia either, but probably ought to go, because I suspect my understanding of it is distorted. Expats in Turkey think of the entire country as “where to go for a decent bottle of wine.” I’m absolutely sure there’s more the country than that–always is–but when anyone in Istanbul says, “Come on over, I’ve just come back from Georgia,” you reckon there might be something on the table worthy of the detour, or at least better than a bottle of Angora Kirmizi.

    Lots of journalists brought back some great table wine in 2008. (They went there figuring for sure that if the Russian 58th Army and airborne troops were in South Ossetia, someone was going to buy that article, but all they came back with was wine. And we needed it, too, because the financial crisis had by that point destroyed whatever was left of our careers. Or Western journalists’ careers, anyway. It was a banner year for Kremlin-aligned journalists. But it’s not exactly like Russian imperialists think of the Caucasus as “the place you visit for the inexpensive and surprisingly drinkable wine.”)

    • #92
  3. Zafar Member
    Zafar
    @Zafar

    Claire Berlinski:

    But it’s not exactly like Russian imperialists think of the Caucasus as “the place you visit for the inexpensive and surprisingly drinkable wine.”)

    Weirdly:

    It was meant to be a triumphant comeback that would patch up sour diplomatic relations between former Soviet republics and satisfy Russia’s thirst for quality wine. But following a six-year ban from the country, Georgian wines are facing an uphill battle in the market and experts say they are unlikely to regain their former glory.

    • #93
  4. Zafar Member
    Zafar
    @Zafar

    Tuck:

    Zafar:

    1. That calculation, imho, should be what governs Obama’s statements – and I think that it does.

    It defined Bush’s statements.

    Obama, well, let’s just say that if he was actively trying to undermine the United States and our allies, it would be tough to distinguish those actions from what he’s doing now.

    Ask the Syrian moderates, or the Kurdistani moderates, how helpful Obama’s been.

    Actually he’s giving military aid to both of them – in Syria (no moderates around except for [relatively] Asad, but to the Free Syrian Army fwiw) and the Kurdish proto-states in Northern Iraq.

    These are both Muslim dispensations of some sort.  The Kurds are somewhat moderate wrt social issues, but not so much when it come to ethnic nationalism (and that’s a problem in a heterogenous area).

    You tell me how Obama could have made an alliance with them while declaring that the West’s problem is with Islam.  I don’t think it would have been possible.

    • #94
  5. user_1184 Inactive
    user_1184
    @MarkWilson

    When I was a kid my dad would go off for the weekend to hunt ducks with my uncles.  When he brought them home he would identify them for me: this one is a mallard, that one is a pintail, and that one is a ruddy duck.  I thought it was neat to learn about all these different variations on the duck, but I always wanted to see a regular duck.  But he never brought one.

    Years later, it became a running joke with my friend as we took fishing trips and caught all kinds of “exotic” fish like bass, sunnies, and walleye.  But we were always giving each grief about never catching that elusive regular fish.

    I think we should retire the idea of “moderate Islam”; it implies that nonviolent Muslims are not devout, only lukewarm or fence-sitting in their faith.  Not only is it patronizing and devaluing of sincere religious belief — but who wants to rise up and take a stand for “moderation”?

    Instead we should talk about regular Muslims in the same sense we say “regular Joe”.  It’s easier for a regular, but fervent, people to stake out a position and excommunicate the extremists* than it is for someone called “moderate” to stand for a belief system that, as a moderate, they really don’t believe in too seriously.

    *Nobody considers William F. Buckley, Jr a “moderate” for his casting out the John Birch Society.

    • #95
  6. Dave Carter Podcaster
    Dave Carter
    @DaveCarter

    Mark Wilson:”… who wants to rise up and take a stand for “moderation”?”

    The RNC.

    • #96
  7. Ball Diamond Ball Member
    Ball Diamond Ball
    @BallDiamondBall

    <blockquote>Mark Wilson

    I think we should retire the idea of “moderate Islam”; it implies that nonviolent Muslims are not devout, only lukewarm or fence-sitting in their faith.  Not only is it patronizing and devaluing of sincere religious belief — but who wants to rise up and take a stand for “moderation”?

    Instead we should talk about regular Muslims in the same sense we say “regular Joe”.</blockquote>

    Well said.  This is the same feeling I am reachng for in “peace-loving Muslims, who want to raise their kids just like we do”.  I try to describe, rather than label.

    • #97
  8. Peter Robinson Contributor
    Peter Robinson
    @PeterRobinson

    Ball Diamond Ball:<blockquote>

    I think we should retire the idea of “moderate Islam”; it implies that nonviolent Muslims are not devout, only lukewarm or fence-sitting in their faith. Not only is it patronizing and devaluing of sincere religious belief — but who wants to rise up and take a stand for “moderation”?

    Instead we should talk about regular Muslims in the same sense we say “regular Joe”.</blockquote>

    Well said. This is the same feeling I am reachng for in “peace-loving Muslims, who want to raise their kids just like we do”. I try to describe, rather than label.

    I’m with Diamond Ball here, Mark.  This is an important observation, very well stated.

    • #98
  9. Tommy De Seno Member
    Tommy De Seno
    @TommyDeSeno

    Peter Robinson:

    Ball Diamond Ball:<blockquote>

    I think we should retire the idea of “moderate Islam”; it implies that nonviolent Muslims are not devout, only lukewarm or fence-sitting in their faith. Not only is it patronizing and devaluing of sincere religious belief — but who wants to rise up and take a stand for “moderation”?

    Instead we should talk about regular Muslims in the same sense we say “regular Joe”.</blockquote>

    Well said. This is the same feeling I am reachng for in “peace-loving Muslims, who want to raise their kids just like we do”. I try to describe, rather than label.

    I’m with Diamond Ball here, Mark. This is an important observation, very well stated.

    It’s the same reason why I rejected “Fundamentalist Muslim” to describe the terrorists.  You’ll sweep up too many non-violent Muslims who identify with the label “Fundamentalist” as a signal that they are devout.

    • #99
  10. Steve in Richmond Member
    Steve in Richmond
    @SteveinRichmond

    Peter Robinson:With a view to summoning this nation to the intense and prolonged effort to fight the war where it must be fought, while at the same time keeping the peace with the roughly 1.2 billion Muslims, give or take one or two hundred million, who are not at war with us, what should this president–what should any president–say?

    I think we focus too much on the roughly 1.2 billion Muslims and go too far to accomodate and avoid offense.  This does not make us enlightened or better human beings.  It makes us suckers and an accessory to our own demise.  This is a culture war, where one side is playing to the death, and the other refuses to face this fact.  Just because the majority are not at war with us does not mean they are on our side.  There comes a point where the need to stand up for yourself and assertively promote your beleifs and culture outweighs the need to keep the peace.  Especially when failure to do so can lead to irreparable harm to first dozens, then hundreds, then thousands,  and then millions of innocents.

    • #100
  11. AIG Inactive
    AIG
    @AIG

    Tuck:

    AIG:

    Right, because that’s exactly what Obama is doing.

    Isn’t it? Obama’s making a fool out of himself with the Iranians, and as for the boots on the ground bit, I gather you’ve still not read the papers…

    I don’t read papers. That’s so 1995. I’m not sure you have, however. Otherwise you’d have read about the bombing campaign against ISIS that pushed them back from Kobane and many places in Iraq.

    • #101
  12. AIG Inactive
    AIG
    @AIG

    Claire Berlinski:

    Zafar:

    AIG:

    Georgia,

    I’ve never been to Georgia either, but probably ought to go, because I suspect my understanding of it is distorted. Expats in Turkey think of the entire country as “where to go for a decent bottle of wine.” I’m absolutely sure there’s more the country than that–always is–but when anyone in Istanbul says, “Come on over, I’ve just come back from Georgia,” you reckon there might be something on the table worthy of the detour, or at least better than a bottle o

    Well, my point was the “travel article” is very silly. It’s just a list of countries no one ever visits. But “dangerous”? How is Georgia or Algeria…or even Iran…dangerous places to visit? Iran maybe if you’re an American, but that’s for political reasons.

    If you want to find dangerous places to visit, look south of the US border, or, 90% of the rest of the planet that isn’t Europe or rich Asian countries. Pretty sure I’d be a lot safer traveling through Algeria, than traveling through Brazil.

    • #102
  13. Tuck Inactive
    Tuck
    @Tuck

    AIG:

    Otherwise you’d have read about the bombing campaign against ISIS that pushed them back from Kobane and many places in Iraq.

    That’s the bombing campaign that he’s doing after he pulled our troops out from a largely-peaceful Iraq without leaving anyone around to ensure the peace was kept, thus allowing groups like ISIS to re-emerge in Iraq?   Just making sure it’s the right bombing campaign…

    • #103
  14. Tuck Inactive
    Tuck
    @Tuck

    I just got around listening to Peter’s interview with General Mattis, aka “Jim”.

    I think he answers Peter’s question quite well.

    • #104
  15. user_645 Member
    user_645
    @Claire

    Steve in Richmond:

    This is a culture war, where one side is playing to the death, and the other refuses to face this fact.

    I agree that it’s a culture war and have no idea who’s refusing to face the fact. Let’s assume we agree about that, and are discussing strategy. “Divide and conquer” is not exactly some radical new idea, is it? Especially when a large number of the people we’re talking about are very eager to fight on our side.

    • #105
  16. Tuck Inactive
    Tuck
    @Tuck

    Claire Berlinski:

    Steve in Richmond:

    This is a culture war, where one side is playing to the death, and the other refuses to face this fact.

    I agree that it’s a culture war and have no idea who’s refusing to face the fact….

    Well, if you need an idea…  Because there’s clearly a large constituency for putting one’s head in the sand and ignoring the culture war:

    Obama Tries To Change Terrorism Rhetoric, Remove Terms Like ‘Islamic Radicalism’ From National Security Document

    Army brass promoted Fort Hood gunman Nidal Malik Hasan even after attempt to contact Al Qaeda

    • #106
  17. Tuck Inactive
    Tuck
    @Tuck

    Tuck:

    Claire Berlinski:

    Steve in Richmond:

    This is a culture war, where one side is playing to the death, and the other refuses to face this fact.

    I agree that it’s a culture war and have no idea who’s refusing to face the fact….

    Well, if you need an idea… Because there’s clearly a large constituency for putting one’s head in the sand and ignoring the culture war:

    Oh, and I neglected to include this:

    Judicial Watch has released hundreds of pages of FBI memos and other documents revealing that, in 2012, the agency purged its anti-terrorism training curricula of material determined by an undisclosed group of “Subject Matter Experts” (SME) to be “offensive” to Muslims. The excised material included references linking the Muslim Brotherhood to terrorism, tying al Qaeda to the 1993 World Trade Center and Khobar Towers bombings, and suggesting that “young male immigrants of Middle Eastern appearance … may fit the terrorist profile best.””

    • #107
  18. AIG Inactive
    AIG
    @AIG

    Tuck:

    AIG:

    Otherwise you’d have read about the bombing campaign against ISIS that pushed them back from Kobane and many places in Iraq.

    That’s the bombing campaign that he’s doing after he pulled our troops out from a largely-peaceful Iraq without leaving anyone around to ensure the peace was kept, thus allowing groups like ISIS to re-emerge in Iraq? Just making sure it’s the right bombing campaign…

    No, must be some other fictitious country you’re speaking of. I can’t recall any “largely peaceful” place called Iraq.

    • #108
  19. Ricochet Member
    Ricochet
    @ArizonaPatriot

    AIG:

    Tuck:

    AIG:

    Otherwise you’d have read about the bombing campaign against ISIS that pushed them back from Kobane and many places in Iraq.

    That’s the bombing campaign that he’s doing after he pulled our troops out from a largely-peaceful Iraq without leaving anyone around to ensure the peace was kept, thus allowing groups like ISIS to re-emerge in Iraq? Just making sure it’s the right bombing campaign…

    No, must be some other fictitious country you’re speaking of. I can’t recall any “largely peaceful” place called Iraq.

    Perhaps you weren’t paying attention.  You can find relevant information at http://icasualties.org/iraq/ByYear.aspx and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

    Iraqi civilian casualties were about 29,000 in 2006 and 25,000 in 2007, falling to about 9,000 in 2008, 5,000 in 2009, and 4,000 in 2010 and 2011.  Coalition military deaths were about 900/year from 2004 to 2007, falling to 322 in 2008, 150 in 2009, 60 in 2010, and 54 in 2011.  These figures show that Iraq was a “relatively peaceful” place after the success of the surge in 2007.

    I don’t know, but I’d certainly expect that Saddam Hussein’s government was killing more than 4,000 Iraqis a year before the war.  Thus, it seems likely to me that Iraq in 2009-2011 was more peaceful than it had been in decades.

    • #109
  20. AIG Inactive
    AIG
    @AIG

    Arizona Patriot:

    Perhaps you weren’t paying attention. You can find relevant information at http://icasualties.org/iraq/ByYear.aspx andhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War

    Iraqi civilian casualties were about 29,000 in 2006 and 25,000 in 2007, falling to about 9,000 in 2008, 5,000 in 2009, and 4,000 in 2010 and 2011. Coalition military deaths were about 900/year from 2004 to 2007, falling to 322 in 2008, 150 in 2009, 60 in 2010, and 54 in 2011. These figures show that Iraq was a “relatively peaceful” place after the success of the surge in 2007.

    I don’t know, but I’d certainly expect that Saddam Hussein’s government was killing more than 4,000 Iraqis a year before the war. Thus, it seems likely to me that Iraq in 2009-2011 was more peaceful than it had been in decades.

    Yeah! 4,000 deaths by terrorist a year sounds like a really peaceful place. Almost Switzerland levels.

    • #110
  21. Raw Prawn Member
    Raw Prawn
    @RawPrawn

    Tommy De Seno:

    Raw Prawn:

    Tommy De Seno:

    Islamo-fascist” keeps the focus on the political issue and away from the religious conflation problem.

    Is it official then? Fascist just means anything bad and when the word is used no further discussion is welcome. Just like racist.

    I’m not sure why you think an ISIS government is not a fascist one. Economic production is controlled by the state and their focus is not on classes within their own nation, rather a form of religious racism that puts them in conflict with other nations not like themselves.

    If not fascist, what are you calling that?

    It would be fine by me if you called them Islamic progressives or Islamic liberals, but seriously, I’m in two minds about the label Daesh. I know why Emperor Barak and John Kerry (who served in Vietnam) might prefer the label Daesh. To western ears it does not say Islam. However, if what I’ve read can be trusted, it’s the term of derision used by arabic speakers who do not love them and feel they are safely out of reach. Those within their reach do not because they are likely to have their tongues cut out.

    As for Islamic “moderates”, I think our understanding of their situation and their probable behaviour would be better if we referred to them as hostages.

    • #111
  22. Eric Hines Inactive
    Eric Hines
    @EricHines

    I’m in two minds about the label Daesh. I know why Emperor Barak and John Kerry (who served in Vietnam) might prefer the label Daesh.  … if what I’ve read can be trusted, it’s the term of derision used by arabic speakers who do not love them and feel they are safely out of reach.

    The stuff I’ve read is slightly different (I’ve seen only Kerry and not Obama use the term, and then only once, but that’s neither here nor there).  The Kurds use the term freely, including (especially?) the ones in frequent contact with Daesh, the Peshmerga.  The Kurds use the term for two reasons, apparently: it’s the acronym for the Arabic version of Islamic State in Iraq/the Levant, and the acronym is a rough homonym for a rude thing to call someone.

    I’m down with Daesh.  That it’s a homonym for an insult to these terrorists is just icing on the cake.

    Eric Hines

    • #112
Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.