Attention, Red State Knuckle Draggers: Surrender

 

You have to give this execrable Bloomberg editorial from earlier today points for candor:

The struggle to enact [the Manchin-Toomey plan] turned uphill this week, with nearly all Senate Republicans opposing it and even a few red-state Democrats running for cover. The proposal’s demise, in a 54-46 vote, is a testament to legislators’ continuing fear of the gun lobby. It also illuminates a political equation that grows more unbalanced, especially in the Senate, every year. The votes of Wyoming’s two senators, representing 580,000 citizens, effectively cancel the votes of California’s two senators, representing 38 million. The votes of Illinois, with a population of almost 13 million, are voided by those of Alaska, with little more than 700,000.

This is a problem for sensible gun legislation. It is also a problem for American democracy. If the nation’s laws fail to represent the views of the overwhelming majority of its people, representative democracy becomes a shallow and unsustainable exercise.

Maybe it’s just the editor in me, but do we generally use the word “unsustainable” for something that’s been functioning for well over two centuries?

Now, it’s not quite as bad as it sounds. This turns out to be an argument for abolishing the filibuster, not doing away with the Senate as we know it (not that we need any further proof that the left wouldn’t shed a single tear over the latter proposal). The reason? You damn rubes won’t put down the boomsticks:

Just as gun laws have failed to keep pace with the advance of technology — which puts ever greater firepower in the hands of virtually anyone who wants it — the Senate has failed to adapt to the urbanization and suburbanization of the nation, enabling rural representatives to veto the will of an increasingly metropolitan majority. The Senate cannot, and indeed does not, function if 60 votes are the threshold for every proposal.

Charles C.W. Cooke, over at NRO, gets it right:

National polls, cited as if they were argument-winners, are irrelevant — especially when it comes to the Senate. There is a touch of Pauline Kael about today’s progressive indignation. The population centers in California, Illinois, and New York may still be up in arms — your friends, too — but most other states probably do not have pro-gun-control majorities and, when it comes to regulating firearms, most Americans appear to err on the side of caution. Take a look at the Brady Campaign’s scorecard, which tracks the severity of gun laws across America:

Was a majority disenfranchised yesterday? Yes — a majority of elite opinion makers.

There are 29 comments.

  1. Xennady Inactive

    Over the years I’ve seen these folks bleat about Wyoming on multiple occasions.

    I don’t know why they’ve singled out that state for special animus but it just seems to be that way. Whatevs.

    But I’m wondering why no one on the right responds in kind- and asks why Delaware has two senators. Or Rhode Island. Or Connecticut.

    Or why millions of conservatives are yoked under the thumb of the left in states such as New york, California, Illinois, etc.

    Since it would be politically difficult to abolish Rhode Island and other historical anachronisms from the Revolutionary War era I propose a different course: We need more states.

    Dozens more, so the millions of Conservatives can breath free under their own rule, not groan under the weight of the endless incompetence and corruption of the democratic party.

    I have a dream…

    • #1
    • April 19, 2013, at 1:40 AM PDT
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  2. Crow's Nest Inactive
    Troy Senik, Ed.: Maybe it’s just the editor in me, but do we generally use the word “unsustainable” for something that’s been functioning for well over two centuries?

    Unsustainable is the new inconceivable.

    • #2
    • April 19, 2013, at 2:13 AM PDT
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  3. kylez Member

    The votes of two senators from Wyoming cancelling out the two from California is exactly the whole point of the system. 

    “progressives” are scary. 

    • #3
    • April 19, 2013, at 4:25 AM PDT
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  4. MACHO GRANDE' (aka - Chri… Coolidge

    I guess they’re going to overlook the BarryCare polls and how that got voted into law, too.

    There’s a reason for a House, a Senate, and Presidency. It’s so hothead opinion on a topical matter does not override the Constitution, or what is supposed to be calm deliberation of laws before they are enacted.

    As opposed to there being ham-handedly slapped together in a committee and voted in late in a session, and where a non-recess in the Senate was decided by President Constitution-Pants to be in recess.

    It’s funny how selective outrage can be.

    • #4
    • April 19, 2013, at 4:31 AM PDT
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  5. kylez Member

    check out the comments on that article, almost all hostile to the editorial. 

    from Mike Edwards: “in the struggle of whether you will live by my rules, or i will live by your rules, we both win when i win. your choice to live an anonymous existence in a filthy urban cesspool proves that you don’t have any business running anything.”

    • #5
    • April 19, 2013, at 4:35 AM PDT
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  6. kylez Member
    Chris Campion: I guess they’re going to overlook the BarryCare polls and how that got voted into law, too.

    There’s a reason for a House, a Senate, and Presidency. It’s so hothead opinion on a topical matter does not override the Constitution, or what is supposed to be calm deliberation of laws before they are enacted.

    As opposed to there being ham-handedly slapped together in a committee and voted in late in a session, and where a non-recess in the Senate was decided by President Constitution-Pants to be in recess.

    It’s funny how selective outrage can be. · 4 minutes ago

    it seems safe to assume that the writer of this sees no problem with say, 5 unelected judges dictating marriage policies or “abortion rights” for the whole nation. 

    “unsustainable” means they’re not getting their way, cuz you know, they have a divine right to get their way. they’re smart and stuff. 

    • #6
    • April 19, 2013, at 4:40 AM PDT
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  7. Hammer, The Member

    I guess that what this author sees as a problem with the senate is precisely what I view as it’s best feature. No, a majority of people in California should not be able to determine what happens to a minority of people in Wyoming. Obviously. This is why we have a senate – to preserve some semblance of state’s rights in a federal system that has run amok. Let California legislate California, Wyoming Wyoming, Alaska Alaska, and so forth… And let the federal government sit by doing nothing. This is by design; frankly, it has proven to be the best design to date.

    • #7
    • April 19, 2013, at 4:49 AM PDT
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  8. danys Thatcher

    Thank you, Wyoming! This Californian sleeps better knowing that your senators’ votes cancel my senators’ votes.

    Seems the editorial writer forgot why we have 2 houses in congress.

    • #8
    • April 19, 2013, at 5:29 AM PDT
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  9. Profile Photo Member

    1. The author doesn’t seem to understand the Constitution or checks and balances. Can we chalk this up as another failure of the public schools to teach the basics? Maybe we should send over copies of Federalist 10 and 51.

    2. Would we see a similar editorial if it were leftists blocking conservative legislation or are complaints about the structure of government strictly outcome based?

    • #9
    • April 19, 2013, at 5:30 AM PDT
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  10. M.D. Wenzel Member

    Liberals have a hard time understanding the concept of federalism. If Californians want “sensible” gun laws they can vote them in. Let the states decide on these issues and people will vote with their feet. I left Illinois for Texas largely because I was fed up with incompetence and abuse of the IL government.

    • #10
    • April 19, 2013, at 5:38 AM PDT
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  11. Fricosis Guy Listener

    Is the plural of dufus “dufuses” or “dufii?”

    • #11
    • April 19, 2013, at 6:09 AM PDT
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  12. Nick Stuart Inactive

    How the Brady map managed to put the kakistocratic People’s Republic of Illiniois in the center of the gamut of gun law severity boggles the mind. Illinois is the only state in the nation without a concealed carry law (thanks to RINO Jim Edgar who vetoed one when back in prehistory when the state had the semblance of a functioning Republican Party). 

    With Mark “Vote For Me, I’m Not A Crook Like Alexi” Kirk and the ever vile Dick Durbin as senators, thankfully there’s a brake on that institution. Hard to tell whether it is more or less corrupt now, or when senatorial seats were bought and sold in smoke-filled back rooms by the state legislature. Illinois’ most recent addition to the Illinois Governor’s Wing of the Federal Penitentiary Rob “The Hairbrush” Blagojevech had “this thing that’s [redacted] golden” on the block, with Jesse “Moosehead” Jackson Jr. as a prospective buyer. Jesse’s on his way to the slammer now too. The seat eventually ended up being warmed for some months by Roland “Tombstone” Burris.

    • #12
    • April 19, 2013, at 6:11 AM PDT
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  13. Blue State Blues Member
    Nick Stuart: How the Brady map managed to put the kakistocratic People’s Republic of Illiniois in the center of the gamut of gun law severity boggles the mind. Illinois is the only state in the nation without a concealed carry law (thanks to RINO Jim Edgar who vetoed one when back in prehistory when the state had the semblance of a functioning Republican Party). 

    Almost exactly what I was going to post. Illinois is Yellow??!! Illinois is the only state (AFAIK) that requires a Firearm Owner’s Identification Card (FOID). For you fortunate non-Illinoisans, this is a card you must apply and wait 2 months for; you must have one just to handle firearms and ammunition, let alone buy them. And of course, the card does not give you the right to carry a loaded gun anywhere outside your own property. Guns must be transported unloaded and in a case. And if your FOID expires and you forgot to apply for a new one, you have suddenly become a felon.

     Of course, we don’t have statewide gun registration; that’s the only thing I can think of that could be worse. We only register owners.

    • #13
    • April 19, 2013, at 6:34 AM PDT
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  14. Hartmann von Aue Member
    kylez: The votes of two senators from Wyoming cancelling out the two from California is exactly the whole point of the system. 

    “progressives” are scary. · 14 hours ago

    Indeed. It’s a sure sign the system is working as intended. And as for the opinions of the would-be-serfs, let them vote themselves out of the right to possess the effective means of self-defense, but in their own states and municipalities. I mean, it’s already working so brilliantly well in Chicago and D.C.

    • #14
    • April 19, 2013, at 6:51 AM PDT
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  15. SpinozaCarWash Inactive

    You all may thank me for making the motion that equal suffrage in the Senate cannot be subject to amendment!

    • #15
    • April 19, 2013, at 7:14 AM PDT
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  16. Neolibertarian Inactive

    Wasn’t the Senate originally appointed by the state legislatures?

    Yes. Which is how the Senate fits within the scheme of the Constitution in the first place. Senators were appointed to defend the interests of the states.

    Now that all 100 are elected by a simple majority of voters, Senators are unmoored from the interests of their home state’s government, which has surely helped bring about the end of federalism.

    With this change, the point of having a separate house in the legislature, called the Senate, vanished.

    The unnamed Bloomberg editors are pointing to a very real problem, though their unschooled opinions lead them to solutions which would only make the Constitution even more dysfunctional than it already is.

    • #16
    • April 19, 2013, at 7:26 AM PDT
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  17. David Knights Member

    Mad props for using “boomstick”. Shop smart, shop S-mart.

    • #17
    • April 19, 2013, at 7:36 AM PDT
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  18. Neolibertarian Inactive
    Nick Stuart: Illinois is the only state in the nation without a concealed carry law (thanks to RINO Jim Edgar who vetoed one when back in prehistory when the state had the semblance of a functioning Republican Party). 

    With Mark “Vote For Me, I’m Not A Crook Like Alexi” Kirk and the ever vile Dick Durbin as senators, thankfully there’s a brake on that institution. Hard to tell whether it is more or less corrupt now, or when senatorial seats were bought and sold in smoke-filled back rooms by the state legislature. Illinois’ most recent addition to the Illinois Governor’s Wing of the Federal Penitentiary Rob “The Hairbrush” Blagojevech had “this thing that’s [redacted] golden” on the block, with Jesse “Moosehead” Jackson Jr. as a prospective buyer. Jesse’s on his way to the slammer now too. The seat eventually ended up being warmed for some months by Roland “Tombstone” Burris. 

    All those references, yet no Mike Madigan?

    He’s the man who is the smoke in the smoke-filled back rooms of the once great state of Illinois.

    • #18
    • April 19, 2013, at 7:40 AM PDT
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  19. Lavaux Inactive

    The Founders designed the Senate to represent the states’ interests. The 17th Amendment complicated that design but did not entirely thwart it.

    What do we say to otherwise intelligent and knowledgeable citizens who ignore facts they should and probably do know to argue nonsense? Do we call them liars, cheats and demagogues, or do we patiently remind them of the facts they should and probably do know? 

    For my part, I just can’t respect someone who denies or ignores federalism or its limiting impact on federal power and politics. Imagine a provocatively clothed female porn star traveling to Saudi Arabia to do a feature on Mecca. So clueless as to be inconceivable, right? So why do we take anyone seriously who argues that the structure of the Senate unjustly thwarts proportional representation of the population, as if the mob were the only stakeholder recognized in the design of our constitutional republic?

    We can’t have civility in politics until we shun the liars, cheats and demagogues who pollute it.

    • #19
    • April 19, 2013, at 7:46 AM PDT
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  20. Randy Weivoda Moderator
    Percival

    John Kass ran a contest for a new state motto for Illinois.

    My favorite was “Our governors make our license plates.”

    That is beautiful.

    • #20
    • April 19, 2013, at 8:37 AM PDT
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  21. dittoheadadt Inactive
    Fricosis Guy: Is the plural of dufus “dufuses” or “dufii?”

    Neither. It’s “democrats.”

    • #21
    • April 19, 2013, at 8:58 AM PDT
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  22. KC Mulville Inactive

    They don’t seem to realize that their argument against the filibuster would also be the same logic against the Senate.

    If every issue was decided by national plebiscite, then there would be no purpose for having states. There would be no purpose for having local government, police, media, or anything tied to a locality. Everything would be governed by one, national majority.

    All that means, of course, is that swaying the majority through a national media would be easier. 

    • #22
    • April 19, 2013, at 10:00 AM PDT
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  23. DocJay Inactive

    Keene said that many lawmakers who voted against the background check expansion felt that if it passed, gun control advocates would simply return to the issue to chip away more at the Second Amendment, so they decided to “just stop it now.”

    In a way, Keene signaled that to the sponsors of the Senate compromise, Pennsylvania Republican Pat Toomey and West Virginia Democrat Joe Manchin. Keene recalled that he took a day off last week to fish for trout on the Missouri River in Montana. “Unfortunately, I took my cellphone with me and my cellphone rings in the midst of my float and it’s Joe Manchin, who’s talking about how reasonable his idea is. And finally I said, ‘Look, I’m in the middle of the Missouri River, I’ve got a trout on the line. I don’t agree, you will have to make your own decisions, and I hung up. You have to keep your priorities straight.”

    • #23
    • April 19, 2013, at 10:01 AM PDT
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  24. Blue State Blues Member
    Neolibertarian

    All those references, yet no Mike Madigan?

    He’s the man who is the smokein the smoke-filled back rooms of the once great state of Illinois. · 2 hours ago

    You’ve got to draw the line somewhere. You could probably go over the 200 word limit just listing all of the Illinois politicians who “served a term” in jail. Otto Kerner, Dan Walker, George Ryan, Dan Rostenkowski, Mel Reynolds among others.

    • #24
    • April 19, 2013, at 10:42 AM PDT
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  25. Percival Thatcher
    Blue State Blues
    Neolibertarian
     

    All those references, yet no Mike Madigan?

    He’s the man who is the smokein the smoke-filled back rooms of the once great state of Illinois. · 2 hours ago

    You’ve got to draw the line somewhere. You could probably go over the 200 word limit just listing all of the Illinois politicians who “served a term” in jail. Otto Kerner, Dan Walker, George Ryan, Dan Rostenkowski, Mel Reynolds among others. · 9 minutes ago

    The (much) shorter list would be the Illinois politicians that don’t deserve to.

    John Kass ran a contest for a new state motto for Illinois. The winner was “Illinois: Would the defendant please rise?”

    My favorite was “Our governors make our license plates.”

    • #25
    • April 19, 2013, at 11:21 AM PDT
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  26. C.J. Box Inactive
    Xennady: Over the years I’ve seen these folks bleat about Wyoming on multiple occasions.

    I don’t know why they’ve singled out that state for special animus but it just seems to be that way. Whatevs.

    The answer is pretty simple. Wyoming always ranks extremely high per capita in gun ownership, #1 in pickup trucks per capita, and has a Republican governor, legislature, two Republican senators, and all-R congresswoman (meaning one). 

    Plus, the red hordes were finally turned back in Wyoming in the movie Red Dawn (the good one, not the recent one).

    We drive them crazy.

    • #26
    • April 19, 2013, at 11:58 AM PDT
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  27. kylez Member

    Since it would be politically difficult to abolish Rhode Island and other historical anachronisms from the Revolutionary War era I propose a different course: We need more states.

    Dozens more, so the millions of Conservatives can breath free under their own rule, not groan under the weight of the endless incompetence and corruption of the democratic party.

    as a Southern Californian I am all for “North California” and “South California”, if there were ever any serious move to break it up. In fact, except for much of LA County, we would be pretty “red.”

    • #27
    • April 20, 2013, at 2:31 AM PDT
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  28. Xennady Inactive
    C.J. Box

    We drive them crazy. ·

    That must be it, because otherwise it makes no sense.

    But I don’t expect sense from those folks, anyway.

    • #28
    • April 20, 2013, at 2:33 AM PDT
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  29. Troy Senik Contributor
    Troy Senik Post author
    C.J. Box
    Xennady: Over the years I’ve seen these folks bleat about Wyoming on multiple occasions.

    I don’t know why they’ve singled out that state for special animus but it just seems to be that way. Whatevs.

    The answer is pretty simple. Wyoming always ranks extremely high per capita in gun ownership, #1 in pickup trucks per capita, and has a Republican governor, legislature, two Republican senators, and all-R congresswoman (meaning one). 

    Plus, the red hordes were finally turned back in Wyoming in the movieRed Dawn(the good one, not the recent one).

    We drive them crazy. · 2 hours ago

    You forgot one thing. Wyoming also has C.J. Box.

    • #29
    • April 20, 2013, at 2:37 AM PDT
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