How the Gulag Archipelago Influenced My Spiritual Life

 

A friend a while back wrote me to say he had just finished reading The Gulag Archipelago by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. The reading reminded him of me. I wrote back and said that it was my reading of Solzhenitsyn’s work when I was a teenager that helped form my religious-political positions today.

Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn was a Russian dissident, a man who stood up to the dictatorial beliefs of the then-powerful USSR. He was imprisoned by the “gulag” (the agency which forced people into labor detention camps) for his beliefs. His writings made it to the West, to free people who called for his release. 

But it was Solzhenitsyn’s prison experience that led him to belief in God. “Bless you, prison,” Solzhenitsyn wrote, “Thank you for being in my life.” It was behind bars that Solzhenitsyn found freedom in Christ. Receiving the Templeton Prize for promoting religion in atheist countries, Solzhenitsyn said that communism happened because people had forgotten God. 

My spiritual life was affected by the Gulag Archipelago in another way, by another famous statement in the book. The problem of humanity cannot be overcome by some human solution, some governmental edict. Why? Solzhenitsyn said it best: 

“The line separating good and evil passes not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either — but right through every human heart.”  

You see, I don’t believe that human government, its leaders, or programs can save us from our troubles. I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness. My friend was right. I believe what I do about politics and religion because of the writings of a Russian dissident. As the Bible says about us, “There is none righteous, no, not one.”

Afterword: I believe so strongly that history is the most important subject of study, that I spent a whole 40-minute teaching session on it at my church this past week (video here, Episode #4). Also found there is a handout chuck-full of biblical references to the importance of “remembrance” and “memory.” And for those who might question why I wouldn’t say “the Bible” is the most important subject of study, the Bible is based on space-time events in history.

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  1. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    I read it while I was sick in bed in 1979 or early 1980.  It put one in the proper state of mind for reading it. 

    • #1
  2. Percival Thatcher
    Percival
    @Percival

    The Gulag Archipelago was my beach book when I was 14. (Yeah, I was a weird kid.) It pretty much cemented my attitude towards Communism from that point on. Not only did I resist the feeble attempts at indoctrination that popped up during my college days, I mocked it until it went away. The Revolutionary Students Brigade was pretty lame at revolution, weren’t winning acclaim as students, and couldn’t scrape together a platoon on their best days. They also couldn’t handle being laughed at.

    • #2
  3. Mad Gerald Coolidge
    Mad Gerald
    @Jose

    Mark Eckel: I believe so strongly that history is the most important subject of study, that I spent a whole 40-minute teaching session on it at my church this past week (video here, Episode #4).

    Rom 15:4  For whatever was written in earlier times was written for our instruction, that through perseverance and the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope. 

    • #3
  4. Henry Castaigne Member
    Henry Castaigne
    @HenryCastaigne

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial. 

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    • #4
  5. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that. 

    • #5
  6. Henry Castaigne Member
    Henry Castaigne
    @HenryCastaigne

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered. 

    • #6
  7. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered.

    Go ahead and knock it down then. 

    • #7
  8. Henry Castaigne Member
    Henry Castaigne
    @HenryCastaigne

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered.

    Go ahead and knock it down then.

    I seem to have a tendency to insult offend religious people when I have no intention doing so.

    Yeshua Christ of Nazareth according to historians worth their salt was a living man. Who inspired many people to believe that he was the son of the Jewish G-d and preach his message even at the risk of death. 

    Later, those that followed his disciples wrote down his teachings. 

    Everyone should believe all of that because of overwhelming historical evidence.

    However, if I said that I know a guy who was born of a Virgin mother and he can do magic. You would believe that I wrote that but you would most likely disbelieve my story. And you would be right to disbelieve. 

    • #8
  9. Concretevol Thatcher
    Concretevol
    @Concretevol

    I don’t know for sure but assume there are other editions of the book out there but that picture is the exact cover of the copy I have.  It is at least top 3 most influential book I have read.  I don’t think it can be recommended or talked about enough.  Thank you for the post bringing to attention what this great book teaches about the spiritual nature of man.  

    • #9
  10. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered.

    Go ahead and knock it down then.

    I seem to have a tendency to insult offend religious people when I have no intention doing so.

    Don’t worry about offending me.  I might disagree with you on occasion, especially when you talk eugenics, but I don’t have a lot of experience at being offended. 

    Yeshua Christ of Nazareth according to historians worth their salt was a living man. Who inspired many people to believe that he was the son of the Jewish G-d and preach his message even at the risk of death.

    Later, those that followed his disciples wrote down his teachings.

    Everyone should believe all of that because of overwhelming historical evidence.

    I don’t know that I’ve ever encountered someone who says or implied that last statement. Or maybe I have and just ignored it.  I’d have to pay more attention.

    However, if I said that I know a guy who was born of a Virgin mother and he can do magic. You would believe that I wrote that but you would most likely disbelieve my story. And you would be right to disbelieve.

    Yes?

    • #10
  11. Mark Eckel Coolidge
    Mark Eckel
    @MarkEckel

    Concretevol (View Comment):

    I don’t know for sure but assume there are other editions of the book out there but that picture is the exact cover of the copy I have. It is at least top 3 most influential book I have read. I don’t think it can be recommended or talked about enough. Thank you for the post bringing to attention what this great book teaches about the spiritual nature of man.

    @concretevol I chose the cover because that is the one I read in high school! :) Glad to know it was true for you and others AND that the message resonated with you as it did with me!

    • #11
  12. Concretevol Thatcher
    Concretevol
    @Concretevol

    Mark Eckel (View Comment):

    Concretevol (View Comment):

    I don’t know for sure but assume there are other editions of the book out there but that picture is the exact cover of the copy I have. It is at least top 3 most influential book I have read. I don’t think it can be recommended or talked about enough. Thank you for the post bringing to attention what this great book teaches about the spiritual nature of man.

    @ concretevol I chose the cover because that is the one I read in high school! :) Glad to know it was true for you and others AND that the message resonated with you as it did with me!

    Yes sir….it’s the one I got in high school as well!  Still have it too!  It is definitely one of the GREAT books by one of the great men.  

    • #12
  13. Painter Jean Moderator
    Painter Jean
    @PainterJean

    Anytime I’m working in the garden and get some bug crawling on me, what comes instantly and unbidden to mind is the box that Gulag prisoners were put into that was full of lice. 

    • #13
  14. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    Your problem is you only want a religion that is worthy to you rather than you being worthy for the religion.

    • #14
  15. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered.

    Go ahead and knock it down then.

    I seem to have a tendency to insult offend religious people when I have no intention doing so.

    Yeshua Christ of Nazareth according to historians worth their salt was a living man. Who inspired many people to believe that he was the son of the Jewish G-d and preach his message even at the risk of death.

    Later, those that followed his disciples wrote down his teachings.

    Everyone should believe all of that because of overwhelming historical evidence.

    However, if I said that I know a guy who was born of a Virgin mother and he can do magic. You would believe that I wrote that but you would most likely disbelieve my story. And you would be right to disbelieve.

    Interesting approach to logic. You picked an argument that makes it impossible for you to believe in God. All you have left is imperfect mortals. Good luck in your pursuit of something outside your self.

    • #15
  16. CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill
    @CarolJoy

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered.

    Go ahead and knock it down then.

    I seem to have a tendency to insult offend religious people when I have no intention doing so.

    Yeshua Christ of Nazareth according to historians worth their salt was a living man. Who inspired many people to believe that he was the son of the Jewish G-d and preach his message even at the risk of death.

    Later, those that followed his disciples wrote down his teachings.

    Everyone should believe all of that because of overwhelming historical evidence.

    However, if I said that I know a guy who was born of a Virgin mother and he can do magic. You would believe that I wrote that but you would most likely disbelieve my story. And you would be right to disbelieve.

    Interesting approach to logic. You picked an argument that makes it impossible for you to believe in God. All you have left is imperfect mortals. Good luck in your pursuit of something outside your self.

    Are there arguments – logical or otherwise – which lead to a belief in God?

    If belief in God is a belief, then it exists in the heart and mind of the believer unrelated to any logical proof or indications, right?

    Although it can be interesting to debate the existence of God, in the end it is a matter of faith.

     

     

    • #16
  17. Henry Castaigne Member
    Henry Castaigne
    @HenryCastaigne

    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered.

    Go ahead and knock it down then.

    I seem to have a tendency to insult offend religious people when I have no intention doing so.

    Yeshua Christ of Nazareth according to historians worth their salt was a living man. Who inspired many people to believe that he was the son of the Jewish G-d and preach his message even at the risk of death.

    Later, those that followed his disciples wrote down his teachings.

    Everyone should believe all of that because of overwhelming historical evidence.

    However, if I said that I know a guy who was born of a Virgin mother and he can do magic. You would believe that I wrote that but you would most likely disbelieve my story. And you would be right to disbelieve.

    Interesting approach to logic. You picked an argument that makes it impossible for you to believe in God. All you have left is imperfect mortals. Good luck in your pursuit of something outside your self.

    Are there arguments – logical or otherwise – which lead to a belief in God?

    If belief in God is a belief, then it exists in the heart and mind of the believer unrelated to any logical proof or indications, right?

    Although it can be interesting to debate the existence of God, in the end it is a matter of faith.

    This is why I think Boss Mongo and Dr. Bastiat are the best theologians on Ricochet. They see the world and they see G-d. I see the world and I see Shubni-Gurrath of Lovecraftian lore.

    Belief or unbelief in G-d does not seem logical in the vast majority of humanity from what I have observed.

    I understand that red herring has a fine point about how atheists are often unhappy with this world so they demand that G-d be worthy of them. It is a totally legit point. I reference the youtube video below. 

    My disbelief in Christianity as far as I can tell is not based on my personal feelings. I just don’t see a persuasive argument for either Judaism or Christianity. 

    I genuinely wish I am wrong but that is the truth as best as can see it.

     

     

     

    • #17
  18. CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill
    @CarolJoy

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    I get it, Henry, I do.

    My dad, who was the most honorable, honest & moral of humans I have known, was a dedicated agnostic.(He was also a lot of fun – and especially good at poking fun at himself.)

    I wish I had asked him at what age he had decided not to be part of a church. (I never knew either of my paternal grandparents, as they died before I was born. But his mom sounds like she would have gone to church, if only for the social aspect of it and to help her raise her children right.)

    In my late teens, I had gone the agnostic route for a while. My thinking revolved around: “If there is a God, why then the wars and other horrendous  calamities of the 20th Century?”

    Then decades later, I began to do hospice work whenever I was asked to sit bedside of someone who was dying. At first, I thought my job entailed certain medical duties. But it also ended up being a situation that instructed me that something happens to everyone of us before we breathe our last.

    People who had been comatose would rally, to tell me or a co-worker that this loved one or that had given them directions on how to get to the “big picnic out at the park.” (Or to the wedding, or carnival. No speakeasies I heard of, though!)

    Often, regardless of how religious they were, they’d announce, “This dream I had is so fabulous. I never knew I’d see my wife” (or sibling, or parent) “ever again.”

    My non-hospice clients had similar experiences that taught me lessons as well. One client called me at home at 9Pm to tell me he had an upsettling experience.

    While taking his usual evening nap in the Lazy Boy in the LR, he woke to see all his departed family and friends sitting on the couch and chairs opposite him. “Why can’t you come over and sit with us right now?” they implored him.

    “I knew Carol, if I went and sat with them it would be curtains!! Maybe a few years from now, but not today. They’ll need to ask again.”

    There are now researchers who have visited large numbers of people in nursing homes and hospice settings. The pre-death dream of getting an invitation from loved ones some 18 months to six weeks prior to their departure is a common one.

    Some three years into this kind of experience, I became a believer again.

    • #18
  19. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    Mark Eckel: I believe as did Solzhenitsyn, that the problem is in me, in my refusal to believe in God and reject my own sinfulness.

    I have never understood Christians when they said that they refused to believe in G-d. I have never come across any compelling evidence to believe in any faith. Clever arguments to be sure but all circumstantial.

    What is this refusal you speak of?

    I refuse to believe you wrote that.

    That is among the strawiest of all strong man fallacies that I have ever encountered.

    Go ahead and knock it down then.

    I seem to have a tendency to insult offend religious people when I have no intention doing so.

    Yeshua Christ of Nazareth according to historians worth their salt was a living man. Who inspired many people to believe that he was the son of the Jewish G-d and preach his message even at the risk of death.

    Later, those that followed his disciples wrote down his teachings.

    Everyone should believe all of that because of overwhelming historical evidence.

    However, if I said that I know a guy who was born of a Virgin mother and he can do magic. You would believe that I wrote that but you would most likely disbelieve my story. And you would be right to disbelieve.

    Interesting approach to logic. You picked an argument that makes it impossible for you to believe in God. All you have left is imperfect mortals. Good luck in your pursuit of something outside your self.

    Are there arguments – logical or otherwise – which lead to a belief in God?

    If belief in God is a belief, then it exists in the heart and mind of the believer unrelated to any logical proof or indications, right?

    Although it can be interesting to debate the existence of God, in the end it is a matter of faith.

    This is why I think Boss Mongo and Dr. Bastiat are the best theologians on Ricochet. They see the world and they see G-d. I see the world and I see Shubni-Gurrath of Lovecraftian lore.

    Belief or unbelief in G-d does not seem logical in the vast majority of humanity from what I have observed.

    I understand that red herring has a fine point about how atheists are often unhappy with this world so they demand that G-d be worthy of them. It is a totally legit point. I reference the youtube video below.

    My disbelief in Christianity as far as I can tell is not based on my personal feelings. I just don’t see a persuasive argument for either Judaism or Christianity.

    I genuinely wish I am wrong but that is the truth as best as can see it.

     

     

     

    Read Andrew klavan’s book.

    • #19
  20. Henry Castaigne Member
    Henry Castaigne
    @HenryCastaigne

    I did read Andrew Klavan’s it was disappointing because there was not even a shadow of Yeshua Christ of Nazarath. There was  only a human of the Jewish  variety with a bunch of feelings that were fulfilled by the story of the New Testament. Just a Jewish dude with feelings and no proof. Times that by twelve (or eleven) and you get a religion that can supersede Rome.

    Still doesn’t make it real.

    • #20
  21. Henry Castaigne Member
    Henry Castaigne
    @HenryCastaigne

    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    I get it, Henry, I do.

    My dad, who was the most honorable, honest & moral of humans I have known, was a dedicated agnostic.(He was also a lot of fun – and especially good at poking fun at himself.)

    I wish I had asked him at what age he had decided not to be part of a church. (I never knew either of my paternal grandparents, as they died before I was born. But his mom sounds like she would have gone to church, if only for the social aspect of it and to help her raise her children right.)

    In my late teens, I had gone the agnostic route for a while. My thinking revolved around: “If there is a God, why then the wars and other horrendous calamities of the 20th Century?”

    Then decades later, I began to do hospice work whenever I was asked to sit bedside of someone who was dying. At first, I thought my job entailed certain medical duties. But it also ended up being a situation that instructed me that something happens to everyone of us before we breathe our last.

    People who had been comatose would rally, to tell me or a co-worker that this loved one or that had given them directions on how to get to the “big picnic out at the park.” (Or to the wedding, or carnival. No speakeasies I heard of, though!)

    Often, regardless of how religious they were, they’d announce, “This dream I had is so fabulous. I never knew I’d see my wife” (or sibling, or parent) “ever again.”

    My non-hospice clients had similar experiences that taught me lessons as well. One client called me at home at 9Pm to tell me he had an upsettling experience.

    While taking his usual evening nap in the Lazy Boy in the LR, he woke to see all his departed family and friends sitting on the couch and chairs opposite him. “Why can’t you come over and sit with us right now?” they implored him.

    “I knew Carol, if I went and sat with them it would be curtains!! Maybe a few years from now, but not today. They’ll need to ask again.”

    There are now researchers who have visited large numbers of people in nursing homes and hospice settings. The pre-death dream of getting an invitation from loved ones some 18 months to six weeks prior to their departure is a common one.

    Some three years into this kind of experience, I became a believer again.

    Did you or other people keep a journal? Was that journal reviewed by multiple people?

    • #21
  22. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    I did read Andrew Klavan’s it was disappointing because there was not even a shadow of Yeshua Christ of Nazarath. There was only a human of the Jewish variety with a bunch of feelings that were fulfilled by the story of the New Testament. Just a Jewish dude with feelings and no proof. Times that by twelve (or eleven) and you get a religion that can supersede Rome.

    Still doesn’t make it real.

    What meets your standard of proof?

    • #22
  23. CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill
    @CarolJoy

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill (View Comment):

    Henry Castaigne (View Comment):

    I get it, Henry, I do.

    SNIP

    Decades later, I began to do hospice work whenever I was asked to sit bedside of someone who was dying. At first, I thought my job entailed certain medical duties. But it also ended up being a situation that instructed me that something happens to everyone of us before we breathe our last.

    People who had been comatose would rally, to tell me or a co-worker that this loved one or that had given them directions on how to get to the “big picnic out at the park.” (Or to the wedding, or carnival. No speakeasies I heard of, though!)

    Often, regardless of how religious they were, they’d announce, “This dream I had is so fabulous. I never knew I’d see my wife” (or sibling, or parent) “ever again.”

    My non-hospice clients had similar experiences that taught me lessons as well. One client called me at home at 9Pm to tell me he had an upsettling experience.

    While taking his usual evening nap in the Lazy Boy in the LR, he woke to see all his departed family and friends sitting on the couch and chairs opposite him. “Why can’t you come over and sit with us right now?” they implored him.

    “I knew Carol, if I went and sat with them it would be curtains!! Maybe a few years from now, but not today. They’ll need to ask again.”

    There are now researchers who have visited large numbers of people in nursing homes and hospice settings. The pre-death dream of getting an invitation from loved ones some 18 months to six weeks prior to their departure is a common one.

    Some three years into this kind of experience, I became a believer again.

    Did you or other people keep a journal? Was that journal reviewed by multiple people?

    First of all, prior to answering yr excellent question, I relayed the above story as it demonstrates experiences I had that were powerful enough for me that they brought me back to a belief in God.
    As to your query: over past dozen years, there’ve been many researchers who have attempted to do a study of such experiences  had by those close to death and to do the study in terms of a science-based approach. As a result there are books & films on the subject.
    Again, this type of survey is hard to do according to hard science demands. & its effects have to do with religious beliefs, not science-based beliefs.
    You keep asking for some scientific approach to proof of existence of God. Except for Moses, Paul on the road to Damascus and great saints, that is not gonna happen.
    You either hold a religious belief or you do not.

    • #23
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