Another Mass Shooting in Texas

 

I have no idea what the solution is.

I mean, I do: intact Families and a culture that does not promote despair and rage.

But since that is not on the table, I have no idea. Taking away guns from citizens has never been shown to work in this nation. That seems to be all that is ever proposed.

Guns have always been in the hands of the people. Mass shootings are a sign of sickness in America as much as theft of AC parts. In the great depression, people did not rob infrastructure. We are sick and dying as a society.

Not enough people believe in anything but getting what is good for themselves or in hurting others because of their pain. It is the Republic of Rome in its last days.

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  1. Charles Mark Member
    Charles Mark
    @CharlesMark

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):
    If you fail to see a problem, you’re never going to solve it.

    Have you recommended how to solve it? I may have missed that.

     

    There’s an old joke in Ireland, about the tourist slowing down his hired car and asking a local man for directions to some destination. The local man says-

    Well if I was going there, I wouldn’t start from here”

     

    Maybe everyone here (with a very few exceptions) is happy with the prevalence of guns in their society and does not see any connection between that prevalence and any mass shootings – no problem no solution necessary.

    I’m addressing the very basic point that a society without guns is a better place – in that sense- than one where they are too prevalent. It follows that I believe that working towards a reduction of guns in America would be a good thing.

    Obviously my opinion is not too popular here. I’m happy to have expressed it anyway. It’s time for work now.

    Americans set a lot of store in guns and sell a lot of guns in stores.

    We like ’em. Cars too. And like cars they are freedom machines.

    I will grant that it might be lovely if people didn’t feel the need for guns – if we really were safe and really could trust government to be prompt and just. But even if that were the case, it wouldn’t last.

    Much as the US Navy and Coast Guard pilot armed boats so as to be ready to deal with armed smugglers and pirates, so do our citizens walk around strapped so as to be ready to deal with the same dangers (and worse) on a personal scale.

    I recognize that different States and people can thrive under completely different sets of rules than ours, and if what you have in Ireland is working for you I truly give you joy of it. Certainly the main antagonist of the Irish is out of that business these days.

    May you never have to reach for weapons you don’t have.

    Down side is he will never have the joy of shooting skeet (or in the general direction of the clays) and will miss out on a great pleasure, shooting targets at the range.

    I can do those things if I wish. I fired guns while in the Army Reserve here – I was quite a good shot. Lee-Enfield.303 as I recall. I can go to professional organised clay pigeon shooting if I want to, and I have standing invitations to go hunting with friends. 

    I didn’t say there were no guns in Ireland, just that it’s very hard to own one. 

    • #211
  2. Charles Mark Member
    Charles Mark
    @CharlesMark

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I detest the “not an inch” position of Democrats on abortion. I’m not a fan of the corresponding position of Republicans (whom I wholeheartedly support in every other respect, except maybe tort reform) when it comes to guns.I know that abortion always takes a life, whereas guns don’t. But the “cold dead hands” attitude leaves me cold.

    So you keep saying. We get it. You object. You will change zero minds here. Anything to add?

    With respect, I pay my subscription the same as anyone else, and I’ll comment away to my heart’s content, if I wish. 

    • #212
  3. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Gun grabbers don’t have any specific ideas 99% of the time. When they start talking, it tends to be really stupid or it’s something like a de facto gun registry. Just enforce the laws we have. We aren’t doing that.

    • #213
  4. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I detest the “not an inch” position of Democrats on abortion. I’m not a fan of the corresponding position of Republicans (whom I wholeheartedly support in every other respect, except maybe tort reform) when it comes to guns.I know that abortion always takes a life, whereas guns don’t. But the “cold dead hands” attitude leaves me cold.

    The reason for this is gun grabbers never say anything specific that is actually going to work.  Don’t give into anything. The only possible exception is a Republican candidate in a purple district, possibly.

    • #214
  5. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher
    Bryan G. Stephens
    @BryanGStephens

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    TBA (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):
    If you fail to see a problem, you’re never going to solve it.

    Have you recommended how to solve it? I may have missed that.

     

    There’s an old joke in Ireland, about the tourist slowing down his hired car and asking a local man for directions to some destination. The local man says-

    Well if I was going there, I wouldn’t start from here”

     

    Maybe everyone here (with a very few exceptions) is happy with the prevalence of guns in their society and does not see any connection between that prevalence and any mass shootings – no problem no solution necessary.

    I’m addressing the very basic point that a society without guns is a better place – in that sense- than one where they are too prevalent. It follows that I believe that working towards a reduction of guns in America would be a good thing.

    Obviously my opinion is not too popular here. I’m happy to have expressed it anyway. It’s time for work now.

    Americans set a lot of store in guns and sell a lot of guns in stores.

    We like ’em. Cars too. And like cars they are freedom machines.

    I will grant that it might be lovely if people didn’t feel the need for guns – if we really were safe and really could trust government to be prompt and just. But even if that were the case, it wouldn’t last.

    Much as the US Navy and Coast Guard pilot armed boats so as to be ready to deal with armed smugglers and pirates, so do our citizens walk around strapped so as to be ready to deal with the same dangers (and worse) on a personal scale.

    I recognize that different States and people can thrive under completely different sets of rules than ours, and if what you have in Ireland is working for you I truly give you joy of it. Certainly the main antagonist of the Irish is out of that business these days.

    May you never have to reach for weapons you don’t have.

    Down side is he will never have the joy of shooting skeet (or in the general direction of the clays) and will miss out on a great pleasure, shooting targets at the range.

    I can do those things if I wish. I fired guns while in the Army Reserve here – I was quite a good shot. Lee-Enfield.303 as I recall. I can go to professional organised clay pigeon shooting if I want to, and I have standing invitations to go hunting with friends.

    I didn’t say there were no guns in Ireland, just that it’s very hard to own one.

    And, Ireland, as we know, has long, long been known as a land of peace. 

    • #215
  6. BDB Inactive
    BDB
    @BDB

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I detest the “not an inch” position of Democrats on abortion. I’m not a fan of the corresponding position of Republicans (whom I wholeheartedly support in every other respect, except maybe tort reform) when it comes to guns.I know that abortion always takes a life, whereas guns don’t. But the “cold dead hands” attitude leaves me cold.

    So you keep saying. We get it. You object. You will change zero minds here. Anything to add?

    With respect, I pay my subscription the same as anyone else, and I’ll comment away to my heart’s content, if I wish.

    Absolutely.  I’m not talking about Ricochet.  I’m talking about you running your mouth about what rights Americans should have, which just between members in good standing, you can stow.

    • #216
  7. GlenEisenhardt Member
    GlenEisenhardt
    @

    Charles Mark (View Comment):
    I didn’t say there were no guns in Ireland, just that it’s very hard to own one.

    If you had them you might have gotten the English out like we did. The founding fathers didn’t have to resort to blowing up trash cans to get independence, and would have lost if they did. But the IRA had a hard stance that the English should get out of Ireland then just handed Ireland over to Muslim immigrants. Makes lots of sense. I’ll keep my rights to bear arms unimpeded.

    • #217
  8. Django Member
    Django
    @Django

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I live in a country where it is very hard to acquire a gun legally. If a constitutional amendment equivalent to the Second Amendment were to be proposed here, I would vote against it. I might even campaign for a No vote. Thankfully, one of the things I don’t have to worry about in any meaningful way, is a risk that my kids’ school or college, or workplaces (or my workplace) will be shot up by some freak. I like that.

    I agree with almost every GOP core principle. But the refusal to recognise the connection between ready access to guns and “mass shootings” (in the proper sense of the phrase) leaves me at a loss.

    I’ve lived in Japan for decades. Japanese gun laws work because they are in Japan. They also have an annual visit by the police to verify household lists, and they have the right to enter and look about as they please.

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    I never woke up in the morning wishing I owned a gun. I never went to bed at night worrying that some randomer might decide to empty his gun in a school or shopping mall. I wouldn’t want to change that.

    Different strokes and all that. I guess you’ve never had to use a gun in self-defense?

    I now live in a state where concealed carry is considered a constitutional right; no permit needed. I never worry about someone emptying his/her gun on strangers. An armed society is a polite society because potential aggressors never know when they might attack someone who is “walking heavy”.

    I hope our state passes that but I would still recommend the NRA class. I learned a lot about state laws from the cops and lawyers who taught portions of the class.

    I’ll take the course to get a concealed carry permit. Unless they’ve changed over the years, Kentucky’s self-defense laws governing the use of lethal force are pretty straightforward.

    Running, if you have that option, is still the best defense. Don’t take your ego into a fight. It’s just business, and the business is survival. 

    • #218
  9. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Django (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I live in a country where it is very hard to acquire a gun legally. If a constitutional amendment equivalent to the Second Amendment were to be proposed here, I would vote against it. I might even campaign for a No vote. Thankfully, one of the things I don’t have to worry about in any meaningful way, is a risk that my kids’ school or college, or workplaces (or my workplace) will be shot up by some freak. I like that.

    I agree with almost every GOP core principle. But the refusal to recognise the connection between ready access to guns and “mass shootings” (in the proper sense of the phrase) leaves me at a loss.

    I’ve lived in Japan for decades. Japanese gun laws work because they are in Japan. They also have an annual visit by the police to verify household lists, and they have the right to enter and look about as they please.

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    I never woke up in the morning wishing I owned a gun. I never went to bed at night worrying that some randomer might decide to empty his gun in a school or shopping mall. I wouldn’t want to change that.

    Different strokes and all that. I guess you’ve never had to use a gun in self-defense?

    I now live in a state where concealed carry is considered a constitutional right; no permit needed. I never worry about someone emptying his/her gun on strangers. An armed society is a polite society because potential aggressors never know when they might attack someone who is “walking heavy”.

    I hope our state passes that but I would still recommend the NRA class. I learned a lot about state laws from the cops and lawyers who taught portions of the class.

    I’ll take the course to get a concealed carry permit. Unless they’ve changed over the years, Kentucky’s self-defense laws governing the use of lethal force are pretty straightforward.

    Running, if you have that option, is still the best defense. Don’t take your ego into a fight. It’s just business, and the business is survival.

    Supposedly, if you shoot somebody, plan on a $30,000 lawyer bill no matter what.

    • #219
  10. Django Member
    Django
    @Django

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I live in a country where it is very hard to acquire a gun legally. If a constitutional amendment equivalent to the Second Amendment were to be proposed here, I would vote against it. I might even campaign for a No vote. Thankfully, one of the things I don’t have to worry about in any meaningful way, is a risk that my kids’ school or college, or workplaces (or my workplace) will be shot up by some freak. I like that.

    I agree with almost every GOP core principle. But the refusal to recognise the connection between ready access to guns and “mass shootings” (in the proper sense of the phrase) leaves me at a loss.

    I’ve lived in Japan for decades. Japanese gun laws work because they are in Japan. They also have an annual visit by the police to verify household lists, and they have the right to enter and look about as they please.

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    I never woke up in the morning wishing I owned a gun. I never went to bed at night worrying that some randomer might decide to empty his gun in a school or shopping mall. I wouldn’t want to change that.

    Different strokes and all that. I guess you’ve never had to use a gun in self-defense?

    I now live in a state where concealed carry is considered a constitutional right; no permit needed. I never worry about someone emptying his/her gun on strangers. An armed society is a polite society because potential aggressors never know when they might attack someone who is “walking heavy”.

    I hope our state passes that but I would still recommend the NRA class. I learned a lot about state laws from the cops and lawyers who taught portions of the class.

    I’ll take the course to get a concealed carry permit. Unless they’ve changed over the years, Kentucky’s self-defense laws governing the use of lethal force are pretty straightforward.

    Running, if you have that option, is still the best defense. Don’t take your ego into a fight. It’s just business, and the business is survival.

    Supposedly, if you shoot somebody, plan on a $30,000 lawyer bill no matter what.

    I think that depends a lot of where you live. Sadly, today it also depends on your race and the race of your target. 

     

    • #220
  11. BDB Inactive
    BDB
    @BDB

    Django (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I live in a country where it is very hard to acquire a gun legally. If a constitutional amendment equivalent to the Second Amendment were to be proposed here, I would vote against it. I might even campaign for a No vote. Thankfully, one of the things I don’t have to worry about in any meaningful way, is a risk that my kids’ school or college, or workplaces (or my workplace) will be shot up by some freak. I like that.

    I agree with almost every GOP core principle. But the refusal to recognise the connection between ready access to guns and “mass shootings” (in the proper sense of the phrase) leaves me at a loss.

    I’ve lived in Japan for decades. Japanese gun laws work because they are in Japan. They also have an annual visit by the police to verify household lists, and they have the right to enter and look about as they please.

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    I never woke up in the morning wishing I owned a gun. I never went to bed at night worrying that some randomer might decide to empty his gun in a school or shopping mall. I wouldn’t want to change that.

    Different strokes and all that. I guess you’ve never had to use a gun in self-defense?

    I now live in a state where concealed carry is considered a constitutional right; no permit needed. I never worry about someone emptying his/her gun on strangers. An armed society is a polite society because potential aggressors never know when they might attack someone who is “walking heavy”.

    I hope our state passes that but I would still recommend the NRA class. I learned a lot about state laws from the cops and lawyers who taught portions of the class.

    I’ll take the course to get a concealed carry permit. Unless they’ve changed over the years, Kentucky’s self-defense laws governing the use of lethal force are pretty straightforward.

    Running, if you have that option, is still the best defense. Don’t take your ego into a fight. It’s just business, and the business is survival.

    Yup.  My little pea-shooter is by no means a combat pistol.  It’s for breaking an engagement I did not successfully avoid or avert.

    • #221
  12. BDB Inactive
    BDB
    @BDB

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I live in a country where it is very hard to acquire a gun legally. If a constitutional amendment equivalent to the Second Amendment were to be proposed here, I would vote against it. I might even campaign for a No vote. Thankfully, one of the things I don’t have to worry about in any meaningful way, is a risk that my kids’ school or college, or workplaces (or my workplace) will be shot up by some freak. I like that.

    I agree with almost every GOP core principle. But the refusal to recognise the connection between ready access to guns and “mass shootings” (in the proper sense of the phrase) leaves me at a loss.

    I’ve lived in Japan for decades. Japanese gun laws work because they are in Japan. They also have an annual visit by the police to verify household lists, and they have the right to enter and look about as they please.

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    I never woke up in the morning wishing I owned a gun. I never went to bed at night worrying that some randomer might decide to empty his gun in a school or shopping mall. I wouldn’t want to change that.

    Different strokes and all that. I guess you’ve never had to use a gun in self-defense?

    I now live in a state where concealed carry is considered a constitutional right; no permit needed. I never worry about someone emptying his/her gun on strangers. An armed society is a polite society because potential aggressors never know when they might attack someone who is “walking heavy”.

    I hope our state passes that but I would still recommend the NRA class. I learned a lot about state laws from the cops and lawyers who taught portions of the class.

    I’ll take the course to get a concealed carry permit. Unless they’ve changed over the years, Kentucky’s self-defense laws governing the use of lethal force are pretty straightforward.

    Running, if you have that option, is still the best defense. Don’t take your ego into a fight. It’s just business, and the business is survival.

    Supposedly, if you shoot somebody, plan on a $30,000 lawyer bill no matter what.

    I’ll smile through my trial.  Alive.

    • #222
  13. DaveSchmidt Coolidge
    DaveSchmidt
    @DaveSchmidt

    I am aware that there are “Good Samaritan” laws offering some protection for those who voluntarily give aid.  I think there might also be legal consequences, though rarely enforced, in some jursidictions for not rendering aid.  Is that true?   

    • #223
  14. Django Member
    Django
    @Django

    DaveSchmidt (View Comment):

    I am aware that there are “Good Samaritan” laws offering some protection for those who voluntarily give aid. I think there might also be legal consequences, though rarely enforced, in some jursidictions for not rendering aid. Is that true?

    Years ago where I now live, one was required to stop at a traffic accident scene and offer assistance to the injured. That was the extent of one’s legal obligation, beyond notifying the authorities. Go beyond what was requested at your own risk. I assume, but can’t say for certain, that this applied to the first few to arrive after the accident. 

    • #224
  15. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Django (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I live in a country where it is very hard to acquire a gun legally. If a constitutional amendment equivalent to the Second Amendment were to be proposed here, I would vote against it. I might even campaign for a No vote. Thankfully, one of the things I don’t have to worry about in any meaningful way, is a risk that my kids’ school or college, or workplaces (or my workplace) will be shot up by some freak. I like that.

    I agree with almost every GOP core principle. But the refusal to recognise the connection between ready access to guns and “mass shootings” (in the proper sense of the phrase) leaves me at a loss.

    I’ve lived in Japan for decades. Japanese gun laws work because they are in Japan. They also have an annual visit by the police to verify household lists, and they have the right to enter and look about as they please.

    Thanks, but no thanks.

    I never woke up in the morning wishing I owned a gun. I never went to bed at night worrying that some randomer might decide to empty his gun in a school or shopping mall. I wouldn’t want to change that.

    Different strokes and all that. I guess you’ve never had to use a gun in self-defense?

    I now live in a state where concealed carry is considered a constitutional right; no permit needed. I never worry about someone emptying his/her gun on strangers. An armed society is a polite society because potential aggressors never know when they might attack someone who is “walking heavy”.

    I hope our state passes that but I would still recommend the NRA class. I learned a lot about state laws from the cops and lawyers who taught portions of the class.

    I’ll take the course to get a concealed carry permit. Unless they’ve changed over the years, Kentucky’s self-defense laws governing the use of lethal force are pretty straightforward.

    Running, if you have that option, is still the best defense. Don’t take your ego into a fight. It’s just business, and the business is survival.

    Supposedly, if you shoot somebody, plan on a $30,000 lawyer bill no matter what.

    I think that depends a lot of where you live. Sadly, today it also depends on your race and the race of your target.

     

    If you don’t pay a lawyer to defend you from the state, you’ll still pay a lawyer to defend you from the criminal’s relatives.

    • #225
  16. Charles Mark Member
    Charles Mark
    @CharlesMark

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I detest the “not an inch” position of Democrats on abortion. I’m not a fan of the corresponding position of Republicans (whom I wholeheartedly support in every other respect, except maybe tort reform) when it comes to guns.I know that abortion always takes a life, whereas guns don’t. But the “cold dead hands” attitude leaves me cold.

    So you keep saying. We get it. You object. You will change zero minds here. Anything to add?

    With respect, I pay my subscription the same as anyone else, and I’ll comment away to my heart’s content, if I wish.

    Absolutely. I’m not talking about Ricochet. I’m talking about you running your mouth about what rights Americans should have, which just between members in good standing, you can stow.

    You don’t get it, do you?  This is an open forum where members get to comment on whatever they like, subject only to the Code of Conduct. Telling an overseas member to “stow it” is extremely rude. Happily for you,  I’m overloaded with work, so this is my last contribution to this conversation. 

    • #226
  17. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I detest the “not an inch” position of Democrats on abortion. I’m not a fan of the corresponding position of Republicans (whom I wholeheartedly support in every other respect, except maybe tort reform) when it comes to guns.I know that abortion always takes a life, whereas guns don’t. But the “cold dead hands” attitude leaves me cold.

    So you keep saying. We get it. You object. You will change zero minds here. Anything to add?

    With respect, I pay my subscription the same as anyone else, and I’ll comment away to my heart’s content, if I wish.

    Absolutely. I’m not talking about Ricochet. I’m talking about you running your mouth about what rights Americans should have, which just between members in good standing, you can stow.

    You don’t get it, do you? This is an open forum where members get to comment on whatever they like, subject only to the Code of Conduct. Telling an overseas member to “stow it” is extremely rude. Happily for you, I’m overloaded with work, so this is my last contribution to this conversation.

    Oh, it’s “I have a full-time job” again.  :-)

    • #227
  18. BDB Inactive
    BDB
    @BDB

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I detest the “not an inch” position of Democrats on abortion. I’m not a fan of the corresponding position of Republicans (whom I wholeheartedly support in every other respect, except maybe tort reform) when it comes to guns.I know that abortion always takes a life, whereas guns don’t. But the “cold dead hands” attitude leaves me cold.

    So you keep saying. We get it. You object. You will change zero minds here. Anything to add?

    With respect, I pay my subscription the same as anyone else, and I’ll comment away to my heart’s content, if I wish.

    Absolutely. I’m not talking about Ricochet. I’m talking about you running your mouth about what rights Americans should have, which just between members in good standing, you can stow.

    You don’t get it, do you? This is an open forum where members get to comment on whatever they like, subject only to the Code of Conduct. Telling an overseas member to “stow it” is extremely rude. Happily for you, I’m overloaded with work, so this is my last contribution to this conversation.

    Almost as if somebody were pontificating about your rights.

    • #228
  19. Full Size Tabby Member
    Full Size Tabby
    @FullSizeTabby

    I think there is a legitimate argument that if there were drastically fewer guns in existence in the United States there would be fewer deaths from those guns (both homicide and suicide). Charles Mark is not arguing the irrational. 

    But the practical challenges of getting to drastically fewer guns are significant, and maybe even insurmountable. Who goes first in a disarmament process? How do we avoid a phase or even end result in which the remaining guns are disproportionately in the hands of bad guys? 

    Also, the United States also already has higher rates of violence using other types of weapons than the rates of violence in other countries, so it is likely that the people intent on violence will find a way to do so even if they cannot obtain a gun. So overall violence may not decrease,  and some people think an absence of guns might contribute to an increase in violence in the United States. 

    • #229
  20. kedavis Coolidge
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Full Size Tabby (View Comment):

    I think there is a legitimate argument that if there were drastically fewer guns in existence in the United States there would be fewer deaths from those guns (both homicide and suicide). Charles Mark is not arguing the irrational.

    But the practical challenges of getting to drastically fewer guns are significant, and maybe even insurmountable. Who goes first in a disarmament process? How do we avoid a phase or even end result in which the remaining guns are disproportionately in the hands of bad guys?

    Also, the United States also already has higher rates of violence using other types of weapons than the rates of violence in other countries, so it is likely that the people intent on violence will find a way to do so even if they cannot obtain a gun. So overall violence may not decrease, and some people think an absence of guns might contribute to an increase in violence in the United States.

    Women in particular benefit from being able to defend themselves with guns.

    • #230
  21. Django Member
    Django
    @Django

    Full Size Tabby (View Comment):

    I think there is a legitimate argument that if there were drastically fewer guns in existence in the United States there would be fewer deaths from those guns (both homicide and suicide). Charles Mark is not arguing the irrational.

    But the practical challenges of getting to drastically fewer guns are significant, and maybe even insurmountable. Who goes first in a disarmament process? How do we avoid a phase or even end result in which the remaining guns are disproportionately in the hands of bad guys?

    Also, the United States also already has higher rates of violence using other types of weapons than the rates of violence in other countries, so it is likely that the people intent on violence will find a way to do so even if they cannot obtain a gun. So overall violence may not decrease, and some people think an absence of guns might contribute to an increase in violence in the United States.

    If there were drastically fewer people, there would also be fewer deaths from guns, and no, I’m not being flippant. 

    Language matters and the debate is sometimes just plain stupid. “Killed by a gun” should be phrased accurately as “killed with a gun”. A small change in language, but a big change in perspective. I’ve yet to hear anyone say, “killed by a knife.” 

    But why bother? Most minds are made up already. 

    • #231
  22. Bryan G. Stephens Thatcher
    Bryan G. Stephens
    @BryanGStephens

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    BDB (View Comment):

    Charles Mark (View Comment):

    I detest the “not an inch” position of Democrats on abortion. I’m not a fan of the corresponding position of Republicans (whom I wholeheartedly support in every other respect, except maybe tort reform) when it comes to guns.I know that abortion always takes a life, whereas guns don’t. But the “cold dead hands” attitude leaves me cold.

    So you keep saying. We get it. You object. You will change zero minds here. Anything to add?

    With respect, I pay my subscription the same as anyone else, and I’ll comment away to my heart’s content, if I wish.

    Absolutely. I’m not talking about Ricochet. I’m talking about you running your mouth about what rights Americans should have, which just between members in good standing, you can stow.

    You don’t get it, do you? This is an open forum where members get to comment on whatever they like, subject only to the Code of Conduct. Telling an overseas member to “stow it” is extremely rude. Happily for you, I’m overloaded with work, so this is my last contribution to this conversation.

    Oh, it’s “I have a full-time job” again. :-)

    No mother to tend too?

    How many people are in the paradise if the Republic of Ireland anyway? 

     

    • #232
  23. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Full Size Tabby (View Comment):

    I think there is a legitimate argument that if there were drastically fewer guns in existence in the United States there would be fewer deaths from those guns (both homicide and suicide). Charles Mark is not arguing the irrational.

    But the practical challenges of getting to drastically fewer guns are significant, and maybe even insurmountable. Who goes first in a disarmament process? How do we avoid a phase or even end result in which the remaining guns are disproportionately in the hands of bad guys?

    Also, the United States also already has higher rates of violence using other types of weapons than the rates of violence in other countries, so it is likely that the people intent on violence will find a way to do so even if they cannot obtain a gun. So overall violence may not decrease, and some people think an absence of guns might contribute to an increase in violence in the United States.

    Exactly what do they mean when they say fewer guns?

     

    • #233
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