Ricochet is the best place on the internet to discuss the issues of the day, either through commenting on posts or writing your own for our active and dynamic community in a fully moderated environment. In addition, the Ricochet Audio Network offers over 50 original podcasts with new episodes released every day.
How White Men Fight: Tucker Carlson
It seems that Tucker Carlson is also accused (see long list of vapid complaints) of sending a text in which he describes a disturbing beating of a downed man as “not how white men fight.” He is right. He has a right to say it, he is right to say it, and in fact, we should say this sort of thing more often, not less.
What Tucker has not done: He has not “appropriated” anybody else’s culture, nor neo-colonized them with his expectations. He has committed no violence, neither encouraged nor condoned it. He made no remark on the conduct or culture of any group other than his own. He criticized three of his own stripe for their unacceptable behavior.
More groups should police their own, it’s true. Everybody except white men are allowed to describe the behavior and characteristics of white men. Now imagine the uproar if he had used the word “civilized” or some similar white patriarchal colonial term. Or if he had praised the behavior. In fact, he had caught himself rooting for the “our side” guys, three white Trump supporters beating a white Antifa lout, and realized to his horror that he was rooting for a barbarous beatdown. If it ever had been a fight, it certainly was no longer once the Antifa lout was on the ground.
According to the Penn Live site of the Pennsylvania Patriot-News, this is the entire text:
“A couple of weeks ago, I was watching video of people fighting on the street in Washington. A group of Trump guys surrounded an Antifa kid and started pounding the living [REDACTED] out of him. It was three against one, at least.
“Jumping a guy like that is dishonorable obviously. It’s not how white men fight. Yet suddenly I found myself rooting for the mob against the man, hoping they’d hit him harder, kill him. I really wanted them to hurt the kid. I could taste it.
“Then somewhere deep in my brain, an alarm went off: this isn’t good for me. I’m becoming something I don’t want to be. The Antifa creep is a human being. Much as I despise what he says and does, much as I’m sure I’d hate him personally if I knew him, I shouldn’t gloat over his suffering. I should be bothered by it.
“I should remember that somewhere somebody probably loves this kid, and would be crushed if he was killed. If I don’t care about those things, if I reduce people to their politics, how am I better than he is?
You Monster.
Published in General
Agreed with all of it. However, an alarm is going off somewhere deep in my brain. Back before PCU became reality I would have said that’s not how men fight or maybe that’s not how American men fight. Now I can understand why Tucker might be pulled onto an identitarian team; sides are forming up whether we want them to or not. The racialization of things that aren’t genetic or even deeply cultural aren’t good for me, and they aren’t good for us.
Human frailty and glory are not permitted any more. There is only “humanity”, divided by progressives into identities, that is recognized. The story is about bully fascists against heroic anti-fascist, don’t you see? Not about individual honor and responsibility. Not in upside down world.
Not kicking a man when he’s down is entirely cultural.
I’ve become comfortable with the prevailing view that there is such a thing as white culture*, and frankly, anybody is welcome to join it — that’s one of its features. But “white” it is, and here we are. Start crapping on it, however, and you’re my opponent.
* EDIT: It didn’t come from Africa, it didn’t come from the Americas, and it didn’t come from Asia. Those large and “diverse” groups may have aspects which overlap, but that’s not where we got it, “we” being white men (and our awesome babes).
Clearly what Tucker saw was not how to MAGA. In this sound-bite edited world, we need to be careful to speak with wisdom. What people will hear is ”White man”. This puts people to thinking that this is meant to contrast with “Black man” or POC to use the term popular today in some circles. They will never hear or read the rest of the story.
Tucker kinda messed up here, as we all do, but we should not take it as a biggie, though I am sure that some will.
While I take your point (and considered addressing it in the post from the get-go), I find that I disagree about the trap of contrast-by-omission. Unapologetically speak your mind, and when people choose to twist your words, tell them that they are wrong, but that they are free to think whatever they want.
Never apologize if you’re not sorry — say your piece in simple declarative sentences and don’t try to convince those who are already hostile of the finer points. They’re going to misrepresent you anyway, and if the alternative is to shut up, then we have already lost.
Do not be cowed into non-existence. That’s what’s happening in the big picture.
This exchange highlights a problem today. Cancel culture says “one data point and you’re done”. One data point can cause suspicion and a desire to inquire further, but is never “case closed.” We used to know that. It was so commonsensical that it didn’t warrant discussion.
It’s been said many times, but if the Marxists keep insisting on subdividing humanity into racial identity groups, and in particular on singling out “whiteness” as the source of everything bad, then we shouldn’t be surprised by the appearance of White Identity groups forming for power and self-protection.
I don’t like it. I’ve warned against it. But the Marxists keep doing it. And here we are.
The culture isn’t “white.” It’s “western.” Ahem.
Western culture has three legs — Jerusalem, Athens, and Rome. Lots of people prefer to leave off that last one due to anti-Catholic bigotry, but I just don’t see how we can, given the history of the Roman Empire and Christianity (St. Peter and St. Paul in Rome, anyone?).
Take note, though, for a long while neither Greeks nor Jews were considered “white” — nor even Italians for that matter! It’s not the “whiteness” that makes us westerners. It’s the ideas — from Moses, to Isaiah, to Hillel, to Jesus, to the Gospel writers, to the Doctors of the Church (especially Aquinas), to Socrates, Aristotle, and Plato. . . (I may have things out of order, but you get the point).
I see it as caving to the Left’s manipulative and divisive definitions to say, “It’s not how white men fight.” It’s not how westerners fight. It violates Jewish and Christian ethics, for starters.
Exactly. Well said.
There are plenty of white men who fight & have fought that way. A lot of Antifa members are white, I believe. Nazis were quite white. Too many examples to list.
A much better response would have been ‘civilized men’ or ‘honorable men.’ Or ‘American men’.
I suppose that Tucker, in his role as a news commentator, is far more immersed in the racial identify language and conflicts than I am. Seeing it day after day may have affected the way he thinks about things.
Bdb, I really do agree with everything you say. However that alarm Bell is still going off in my head and it’s not good for us. I don’t see any other way out of it though. I hope and pray that the world wakes up to what is happening before it’s too late.
I’m hardly hostile to your point of view, yet:
Substitute “Western” for “civilized” in the above, as alternatives to “white”.
“What do you mean Western, bigot? Is [group x] not western? Define your terms! You equate [non-group-x] with non-western? No place in your “civilization” for [non-group-x] after all!”
So there’s no perception profit in changing terms there. We’re already doing the time, crime or no.
I understand that you are arguing on grounds of fact and principle, not perception. I of course agree with most of what you say, because I am not stupid. And I’m glad you’ve said it.
But:
Whitey needs some good PR. If I’m attacked or “merely” mobbed it won’t be because I’m western.
I very much appreciate when black leaders stand up and say “We are better than this!” The boldest of these men and women will speak frankly and directly to blacks about their responsibility as ambassadors of their own people, and I would like to use this tool for curbing the behavior of wayward whites.
Colorblindness, while noble and true with regard to many facts, is a thing of the past. You can not generate a groundswell of civilization-restoring manners by appealing to “Western Civilization,” — we’ve tried and I admit that we have failed — although it is the thing most needing restoration. But speaking directly to people about their failure to live up to their very DNA, the stuff their ancestry literally created them of — that’s powerful.
Perhaps someday our children can grow up in a world in which their whiteness no longer matters, where their standards of behavior will be set not by the color of their skin, but by the demands of their culture. Until then, I at least support whitey policing whitey in accordance with our culture — and in opposition to the western, progressive denunciation of innocents for their “privilege”.
With malice for none.
Which is ironic given how many black leaders of the past — even the recent past — saw colorblindness as a goal, especially with regard to application of the law. If you want equality under the law, you want colorblindness.
The Woke don’t want equality under the law. They want different treatments for different racial identity groups.
Now, of course, colorblindness is a bad thing.
Jesus wept.
Jesus whipped. There’s a time to fight, when the talking is done and all that’s left is intransigence.
It think it was completely predictable that the statement would get him bad press, rightly or wrongly. Are you being a racist for using the word “niggardly”? No. Do you use the word publicly if you don’t want bad press? No.
And Tucker didn’t even publish it. That was somebody who received his private text.
I’m just saying that he didn’t say anything wrong anyway.
“You’d shoot a man in the back?” – Odo
“Well it’s the safest way, isn’t it?” – Mr Garak
ABC New’s version of the text:
How ill my fear they by my mercy scan,Beware the fury of a patient man.
Again I recommend Claire Lehmann’s video: Nationalism is the antidote to racism.
Although I think ‘AN antidote’ would have been better than ‘THE antidote’.
Does she mean nation-state-ism, or nation-people-ism? Important distinction.
(Anyway, going over there to check).
I haven’t seen the video. Based on Carlson’s description, it’s not clear what he’s complaining about. He doesn’t mention hitting anyone while he is down. He mentions it being 3-on-1, and he mentions the assailants having “surrounded” the man who was beaten.
What’s wrong with any of that?
This is exactly how we fight wars, isn’t it? We don’t insist on having equal numbers. We take advantage of having greater numbers. We don’t give warning. We ambush our enemies if we can. Heck, we blow up the entire building in which they’re hiding with a smart bomb or a missile.
For that matter, particularly in WWII but also in Vietnam, we carpet-bombed civilian areas.
The police do the same, when they can. They call for backup, and bring overwhelming force.
It may have been wrong to beat this particular Antifa guy. If it was warranted, then I don’t see any problem in taking advantage of superior numbers.
I also see no problem with continuing to hit or kick someone when he’s down, if he’s trying to get up, or if it’s just not clear whether he’s been knocked out of the fight.
Again, though, I can’t comment on the specific video in question, which I haven’t seen.
Western has been classified as White.
Yes, and it’s wrong. There are many unique aspects of western civilization and none of them have anything to do with skin color.
I don’t object to the idea that whites should call each other out for bad behavior (it tends to lend credibility to the group), but I’m hesitant when I see what’s happening in Democrat controlled cities and virtually no prominent blacks will talk about it except in the context of blaming whitey.
Maybe POC should go first. It’s only polite.
Not a video — it’s a text message, reproduced in the OP in whole.
When they try, they get attacked too. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t wait for them to do it. Anything else would just be more “oppression.”
OK, white men do fight like that. From gang warfare (which happened in our past between different white gangs, often along ethnic lines), to lynching and riots, individuals get set upon by groups.
It is definitely considered wrong, and often assumed to be something those people do. I recall the phrase ‘if you fight one bean, you fight the whole burrito’ growing up.
I would also point out – at the risk of sounding like some kinda libtard – that minority groups are, in a sense, always surrounded. Were I a member of a minority group, and believed everything was set up against me, I might see ganging up on someone as less evil than I currently do.
Not in a hurry to find out.
I fought the burrito. I lost.