How Republicans Will Elect Biden 2.0 in 2024

 

“Biden 2.0” is a stand-in for some Democrat figurehead of the Party of Death and Destruction (D). It could be Biden (D). It could be Harris (D). Maybe gruesome Newsome (D). Doesn’t matter, I predict we’ll have one of them, and it will be because “a majority [or, at least, a plurality] of Republicans want Trump, but the Republican Party says we can’t have him.” 

This is a similar dynamic to the Republican’s Taft-Roosevelt split that produced probably the most destructive presidency of the 20th century — Woodrow Wilson (D) — followed closely by FDR (D) and LBJ (D) (notice a pattern?).

Dan Gelernter spelled it out masterfully earlier in the month in Trump Was a Mistake, and now speaks for me in The Coming Split.

But, despite the obvious differences, we’re heading for a 1912-repeat, in which the Republican Party ignores its own voters. The Republican machine has no intention of letting us choose Trump again: He is not a uniparty team player. They’d rather lose an election to the Democrats, their brothers in crime, than win with Trump.

I especially appreciate his points here [emphasis mine]:

I’m sure I’ll be accused of being a shill for the Democrats here, and as far as I’m concerned that’s as credible as being accused of shilling for Russia these days. I’m not suggesting you have to do what I do, either. But I have no intention of supporting a Republican Party that manifestly contravenes the desires of its voters. The RNC can pretend Trump isn’t loved by the base anymore, that he doesn’t have packed rallies everywhere he goes. But I’m not buying it: Talk to Republican voters anywhere outside the Beltway, and it is obvious that he is admired and even loved by those who consider themselves “ordinary” Americans.

Mitch McConnell put cement boots on the Republican party and pushed it into the Potomac with this line: “providing assistance for Ukrainians to defeat the Russians is the number one priority for the United States right now, according to most Republicans.”

In response, I’ll quote a different Mc: “Nuts!” — General McAuliffe

Trump may be our General Patton and the Third Army of his voters the only force that can save America from Biden 2.0.

MAGA!

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  1. Stina Member
    Stina
    @CM

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Stina (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    What’s the difference between indoctrination and socialization? I think there is a shade subtle difference that one could express, but it doesn’t seem worth it to try to find the perfect words. The difference is in connotation and attitude to what you’re referring to. I would say they are pretty much synonymous.

    So the left has discovered they can indoctrinate children through education. You can shape their developing values when they are most absorbing of social ideas. Until recently my perception has been that schools respected most of the parents wishes when it came to k-12 children. Something in the last say fifteen years has changed. (Why does it always feel this downward trend started with Obama?) Most teachers seem to accepted the left side the US values system. And for some reason they now feel compelled to push it on the kids. I think we need to be vigilant with the education system.

    I will also say that I don’t think that whatever the kids pick up has to be permanent. Go spend a little time in a foreign country and you almost start forgetting your Americanism. Those socialization values are fluid. We have to educate the public constantly and stand up for our values.

    This also substantiates my belief that laws instill values. Abortion is immoral, any way you look at it, especially from natural law and science, but the legalization of abortion over time has instilled a different value, making it appear moral. Gay marriage is not normal. No one believed it for thousands of years. Make it legal and it now seems to be normal. Same thing with transgenderism.

    Anyway, I’m under the weather tonight, so I’m going to call it an early night.

    It feels like it started with Obama because that’s when Millenials started coming of age. I was 24 in 2008. That’s when the social pathologies of my generation started exiting universities and entered the “real world”.

    It started over 100 years ago.

    It really feels like the millenials were the harvest.

    • #541
  2. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    So, all of us, religious and non-religious people, can celebrate those traditions that are good while rejecting those traditions that are bad.

    Once traditions are separated from their source, they become personal preferences. Determining the good and bad becomes subjective. We see that now from the secular cultural Marxists. The party in power determines the good and bad. Like it or not, the secular Marxists are in power. No. Society must have values that transcend the party in power. There is a reason they are hostile towards religion and seek to separate us from our western Judeo-Christian past. Atheist don’t see it, don’t understand it. They can’t see past Trump’s tweets and personality. They think all will be fine if we elect DeSantis. Some think we are a cult. We aren’t. We know God picked imperfect men to save his people. We know we picked an imperfect man but he had great instincts.

    • #542
  3. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Stina (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Stina (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    What’s the difference between indoctrination and socialization? I think there is a shade subtle difference that one could express, but it doesn’t seem worth it to try to find the perfect words. The difference is in connotation and attitude to what you’re referring to. I would say they are pretty much synonymous.

    So the left has discovered they can indoctrinate children through education. You can shape their developing values when they are most absorbing of social ideas. Until recently my perception has been that schools respected most of the parents wishes when it came to k-12 children. Something in the last say fifteen years has changed. (Why does it always feel this downward trend started with Obama?) Most teachers seem to accepted the left side the US values system. And for some reason they now feel compelled to push it on the kids. I think we need to be vigilant with the education system.

    I will also say that I don’t think that whatever the kids pick up has to be permanent. Go spend a little time in a foreign country and you almost start forgetting your Americanism. Those socialization values are fluid. We have to educate the public constantly and stand up for our values.

    This also substantiates my belief that laws instill values. Abortion is immoral, any way you look at it, especially from natural law and science, but the legalization of abortion over time has instilled a different value, making it appear moral. Gay marriage is not normal. No one believed it for thousands of years. Make it legal and it now seems to be normal. Same thing with transgenderism.

    Anyway, I’m under the weather tonight, so I’m going to call it an early night.

    It feels like it started with Obama because that’s when Millenials started coming of age. I was 24 in 2008. That’s when the social pathologies of my generation started exiting universities and entered the “real world”.

    It started over 100 years ago.

    It really feels like the millenials were the harvest.

    No, they were harvesting for years. Their earlier harvests write education theories, teach future teachers in schools of education, teach college courses in other fields, run the College Board, and write the textbooks. That is why even “Christian” private schools didn’t escape this. Their teachers were trained in the lefty teacher mills, too.

    • #543
  4. Stina Member
    Stina
    @CM

    The nice thing is is I’m not done yet. I can offer to homeschool my grandkids.

    • #544
  5. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Stina (View Comment):

    The nice thing is is I’m not done yet. I can offer to homeschool my grandkids.

    Abeka offers great materials.

    • #545
  6. Django Member
    Django
    @Django

    HeavyWater (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    HeavyWater (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    kedavis (View Comment):

    They point to “natural law”. Some of them do anyway.

    “Natural law” seems to be more along the lines of “kill or be killed.”

    I haven’t given it much thought for years, so I am hesitant to run my keyboard on the subject now, but that’s not the philosophical meaning of “natural law”.

    If you talk to an atheist scientist and ask him, “Where do our moral come from?” his response is likely to be, “Much of our pro-social behavior is adaptive. The saying, ‘I’ll scratch your back if you scratch mine’ might give us a hint as to why human beings tend to cooperate with each other in many circumstances. Evolution through natural selection has given us a mixed bag of behaviors ranging from vengeance to generosity.”

    The real problem with atheism and morality was highlighted in a debate between Berlinski and Hitchens. Hitchens was offended by the implication that an atheist couldn’t distinguish between right and wrong. Berlinski nailed it when he said, “That’s hardly the point, is it? . . . You may know what is right and we may agree, but what compels you to choose right over wrong?”

    I probably misquoted, but the content is correct.

    But if Berlinski had elaborated a bit further, he would have to admit that religious people often do the wrong thing even when they know better.

    So, Hitchens was right. Religious people don’t always know what is the right thing to do and religous people don’t always do the right thing. Same for atheists.

    Human beings, be they religious or not, are morally and intellectually imperfect.

    You missed Berlinski’s point completely. He did elaborate and said that for most religious people it is the fear of divine punishment that compels them to do right, or at least refrain from doing wrong. The question of whether “Religious people don’t always know what is the right thing ” is irrelevant to his point that atheists have nothing compelling them to refrain from doing wrong even when they know their actions are wrong. 

    He went on to discuss the parallel between divine punishment and civil punishment, but I don’t have the book handy and can’t be sure I got his points correct. 

    • #546
  7. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Stina (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    What’s the difference between indoctrination and socialization? I think there is a shade subtle difference that one could express, but it doesn’t seem worth it to try to find the perfect words. The difference is in connotation and attitude to what you’re referring to. I would say they are pretty much synonymous.

    So the left has discovered they can indoctrinate children through education. You can shape their developing values when they are most absorbing of social ideas. Until recently my perception has been that schools respected most of the parents wishes when it came to k-12 children. Something in the last say fifteen years has changed. (Why does it always feel this downward trend started with Obama?) Most teachers seem to accepted the left side the US values system. And for some reason they now feel compelled to push it on the kids. I think we need to be vigilant with the education system.

    I will also say that I don’t think that whatever the kids pick up has to be permanent. Go spend a little time in a foreign country and you almost start forgetting your Americanism. Those socialization values are fluid. We have to educate the public constantly and stand up for our values.

    This also substantiates my belief that laws instill values. Abortion is immoral, any way you look at it, especially from natural law and science, but the legalization of abortion over time has instilled a different value, making it appear moral. Gay marriage is not normal. No one believed it for thousands of years. Make it legal and it now seems to be normal. Same thing with transgenderism.

    Anyway, I’m under the weather tonight, so I’m going to call it an early night.

    It feels like it started with Obama because that’s when Millenials started coming of age. I was 24 in 2008. That’s when the social pathologies of my generation started exiting universities and entered the “real world”.

    Oh you’re young!  Why did I picture you as old like me. LOL.  Good point. It may have to with that generation coming of age. I had not thought of that. 

    • #547
  8. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    So, all of us, religious and non-religious people, can celebrate those traditions that are good while rejecting those traditions that are bad.

    Once traditions are separated from their source, they become personal preferences. Determining the good and bad becomes subjective. We see that now from the secular cultural Marxists. The party in power determines the good and bad. Like it or not, the secular Marxists are in power. No. Society must have values that transcend the party in power. There is a reason they are hostile towards religion and seek to separate us from our western Judeo-Christian past. Atheist don’t see it, don’t understand it. They can’t see past Trump’s tweets and personality. They think all will be fine if we elect DeSantis. Some think we are a cult. We aren’t. We know God picked imperfect men to save his people. We know we picked an imperfect man but he had great instincts.

    I hit the like button because I liked the first couple of sentences. As I’ve written before I don’t subscribe to Trump as the only possible leader. I know there are more effective leaders. The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out. 

    • #548
  9. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Django (View Comment):

    You missed Berlinski’s point completely. He did elaborate and said that for most religious people it is the fear of divine punishment that compels them to do right, or at least refrain from doing wrong. The question of whether “Religious people don’t always know what is the right thing ” is irrelevant to his point that atheists have nothing compelling them to refrain from doing wrong even when they know their actions are wrong. 

    He went on to discuss the parallel between divine punishment and civil punishment, but I don’t have the book handy and can’t be sure I got his points correct.

    I haven’t read Berlinski, but I did write a post along these lines:

    https://ricochet.com/1334430/what-we-need-right-now-is-some-more-hellfire-and-damnation/

    The goal for Catholics is to increasingly do right to please God and less to avoid punishment, but fear of punishment is always there. As it should be.

    • #549
  10. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out. 

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first). 

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State. 

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    • #550
  11. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    So, all of us, religious and non-religious people, can celebrate those traditions that are good while rejecting those traditions that are bad.

    Once traditions are separated from their source, they become personal preferences. Determining the good and bad becomes subjective. We see that now from the secular cultural Marxists. The party in power determines the good and bad. Like it or not, the secular Marxists are in power. No. Society must have values that transcend the party in power. There is a reason they are hostile towards religion and seek to separate us from our western Judeo-Christian past. Atheist don’t see it, don’t understand it. They can’t see past Trump’s tweets and personality. They think all will be fine if we elect DeSantis. Some think we are a cult. We aren’t. We know God picked imperfect men to save his people. We know we picked an imperfect man but he had great instincts.

    From The Federalist:

    This was important, Benedict said, because if ultimate questions about human origins and destiny — the sort of questions raised by religion — have no place in the modern world’s view of what constitutes legitimate or scientific knowledge, then those questions “must thus be relegated to the realm of the subjective.” The problem, he argued, is that if each person’s subjective conscience becomes the arbiter of right and wrong, 

    ethics and religion lose their power to create a community and become a completely personal matter. This is a dangerous state of affairs for humanity, as we see from the disturbing pathologies of religion and reason which necessarily erupt when reason is so reduced that questions of religion and ethics no longer concern it. Attempts to construct an ethic from the rules of evolution or from psychology and sociology, end up being simply inadequate.

    Read the whole thing: 

    https://thefederalist.com/2023/01/02/amid-the-ruin-of-modernity-pope-benedict-xvi-championed-a-restoration-of-reason-and-faith/

    • #551
  12. Django Member
    Django
    @Django

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    You missed Berlinski’s point completely. He did elaborate and said that for most religious people it is the fear of divine punishment that compels them to do right, or at least refrain from doing wrong. The question of whether “Religious people don’t always know what is the right thing ” is irrelevant to his point that atheists have nothing compelling them to refrain from doing wrong even when they know their actions are wrong.

    He went on to discuss the parallel between divine punishment and civil punishment, but I don’t have the book handy and can’t be sure I got his points correct.

    I haven’t read Berlinski, but I did write a post along these lines:

    https://ricochet.com/1334430/what-we-need-right-now-is-some-more-hellfire-and-damnation/

    The goal for Catholics is to increasingly do right to please God and less to avoid punishment, but fear of punishment is always there. As it should be.

    For a believing Christian who has read about the nature of the punishment(s) Jesus suffered for us the fear of disappointing Him is probably paramount. 

    • #552
  13. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Manny (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    So, all of us, religious and non-religious people, can celebrate those traditions that are good while rejecting those traditions that are bad.

    Once traditions are separated from their source, they become personal preferences. Determining the good and bad becomes subjective. We see that now from the secular cultural Marxists. The party in power determines the good and bad. Like it or not, the secular Marxists are in power. No. Society must have values that transcend the party in power. There is a reason they are hostile towards religion and seek to separate us from our western Judeo-Christian past. Atheist don’t see it, don’t understand it. They can’t see past Trump’s tweets and personality. They think all will be fine if we elect DeSantis. Some think we are a cult. We aren’t. We know God picked imperfect men to save his people. We know we picked an imperfect man but he had great instincts.

    I hit the like button because I liked the first couple of sentences. As I’ve written before I don’t subscribe to Trump as the only possible leader. I know there are more effective leaders. The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, I don’t frame him as a cult leader but the imperfect leader who fights off the bad guys then must leave because he isn’t pure enough for the people he saved. That idea is borrowed from VDH. Unlike Shane, he wasn’t allowed to finish the job before the purist people wanted to be rid of him. Big mistake. 

    I also have admitted we have other strong leaders and I don’t want to sacrifice them to the predictable lefty assault as long as we have an unworthy populace willing to fall for the left’s propaganda. The 2022 election sealed it for me. All I see is those on my side chasing the next shiny object with no proof they recognize the real threat.

    • #553
  14. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first).

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State.

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    After this last election I question whether his instincts are very good. After his last election and the fallout certainly makes me question his instincts. You seem to be blind to some of his bad decisions. That tells me people follow him as a cult leader. 

    • #554
  15. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    I don’t believe in brainwashing period.

    You really think advertisers pay premiums for product placement just so people know they exist, and not to subtly influence their unconscious perceptions and impulses? That repeated exposure to monolithic viewpoints and shibboleths do not lead to unconsidered assumptions, or social coercion does not lead to rationalizations to deal with the cognitive dissonance of speaking and behaving contrary to what you believe?

    Good points.

    Maybe so, but what does it have to do with brainwashing?

    What is your definition? I regard understanding how the human mind works, and deliberately influencing the minds and perceptions of others based on that knowledge by controlling their freedom and stimuli, to constitute ‘brainwashing’-all else is a matter of degrees of subtly and control.

    I don’t have a good definition for brainwashing. That’s why I asked. 

    • #555
  16. Red Herring Coolidge
    Red Herring
    @EHerring

    Manny (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first).

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State.

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    After this last election I question whether his instincts are very good. After his last election and the fallout certainly makes me question his instincts. You seem to be blind to some of his bad decisions. That tells me people follow him as a cult leader.

    Kevin Hassett, in The Drift, provides plenty of examples of Trump’s instincts as president. He has endured more than most of us have endured since 2015. If it has finally taken its toll, then that would be a shame for him and a damning testimony to our worthless party. 

    • #556
  17. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Red Herring (View Comment):

    So, all of us, religious and non-religious people, can celebrate those traditions that are good while rejecting those traditions that are bad.

    Once traditions are separated from their source, they become personal preferences. Determining the good and bad becomes subjective. We see that now from the secular cultural Marxists. The party in power determines the good and bad. Like it or not, the secular Marxists are in power. No. Society must have values that transcend the party in power. There is a reason they are hostile towards religion and seek to separate us from our western Judeo-Christian past. Atheist don’t see it, don’t understand it. They can’t see past Trump’s tweets and personality. They think all will be fine if we elect DeSantis. Some think we are a cult. We aren’t. We know God picked imperfect men to save his people. We know we picked an imperfect man but he had great instincts.

    I hit the like button because I liked the first couple of sentences. As I’ve written before I don’t subscribe to Trump as the only possible leader. I know there are more effective leaders. The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, I don’t frame him as a cult leader but the imperfect leader who fights off the bad guys then must leave because he isn’t pure enough for the people he saved. That idea is borrowed from VDH. Unlike Shane, he wasn’t allowed to finish the job before the purist people wanted to be rid of him. Big mistake.

    LOL, and this is not cult leader language?  

    • #557
  18. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Manny (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first).

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State.

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    After this last election I question whether his instincts are very good. After his last election and the fallout certainly makes me question his instincts. You seem to be blind to some of his bad decisions. That tells me people follow him as a cult leader.

    You know if you’re serious about Trumpers making Trump into a cult leader, you’re wrong and really crazy.  If you aren’t then you are wrong and being really insulting.

    • #558
  19. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Ex-Cosmo magazine writer: “Propaganda is half-truth, selective truth, and truth out of context.  It isn’t just a bunch of lies.  And one thing that people don’t recognize about propaganda, when they look at it, look for the things that aren’t there; the things that are invisible.  The mother, and the child, was invisible in the Cosmo Girl philosophy  ”

    This sort of goes to the discussion on this  thread, what is the difference between brainwashing, indoctrination, socialization, and propaganda?

    • #559
  20. Stina Member
    Stina
    @CM

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Ex-Cosmo magazine writer: “Propaganda is half-truth, selective truth, and truth out of context. It isn’t just a bunch of lies. And one thing that people doesn’t recognize about propaganda, when they look at it, look for the things that aren’t there; the things that are invisible. The mother, and the child, was invisible in the Cosmo Girl philosophy ”

    This sort of goes to the discussion on this thread, what is the difference between brainwashing, indoctrination, socialization, and propaganda?


    Django (View Comment)
    :

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Django (View Comment):

    You missed Berlinski’s point completely. He did elaborate and said that for most religious people it is the fear of divine punishment that compels them to do right, or at least refrain from doing wrong. The question of whether “Religious people don’t always know what is the right thing ” is irrelevant to his point that atheists have nothing compelling them to refrain from doing wrong even when they know their actions are wrong.

    He went on to discuss the parallel between divine punishment and civil punishment, but I don’t have the book handy and can’t be sure I got his points correct.

    I haven’t read Berlinski, but I did write a post along these lines:

    https://ricochet.com/1334430/what-we-need-right-now-is-some-more-hellfire-and-damnation/

    The goal for Catholics is to increasingly do right to please God and less to avoid punishment, but fear of punishment is always there. As it should be.

    For a believing Christian who has read about the nature of the punishment(s) Jesus suffered for us the fear of disappointing Him is probably paramount.

    Given that quote, I’d pose that healthy socialization/indoctrination seeks to provide honest answers where possible and appropriate*. Peter claims we are all believers part of the royal priesthood, Paul exhorts us to study and show ourselves approved. Those really stood out when I was learning a little about Druidism, because Druidism hides things from their followers – only the high priests have access to hidden knowledge.

    Unhealthy seeks to trick or manipulate by hiding information or outright lying.

    Now an honest person is not going to be perfect and will have moments of wrong. And even a loving parent will choose manipulation over honesty out of fear. But I think in raising children, we should aim for as honest about things as we can. The euphemisms used for age appropriateness (like birds and the bees) should be solid enough that they can be built on without fixing or unlearning things.

     

    * I do sometimes work with my kids doing the right thing without all the information because that is true to real life. We don’t always have the luxury of making perfectly informed decisions. Everything always comes with some amount of trust.

    • #560
  21. Stina Member
    Stina
    @CM
    • #561
  22. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first).

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State.

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    After this last election I question whether his instincts are very good. After his last election and the fallout certainly makes me question his instincts. You seem to be blind to some of his bad decisions. That tells me people follow him as a cult leader.

    You know if you’re serious about Trumpers making Trump into a cult leader, you’re wrong and really crazy. If you aren’t then you are wrong and being really insulting.

    Ok, sorry.  I’ll back off.

    • #562
  23. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Manny (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first).

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State.

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    After this last election I question whether his instincts are very good. After his last election and the fallout certainly makes me question his instincts. You seem to be blind to some of his bad decisions. That tells me people follow him as a cult leader.

    You know if you’re serious about Trumpers making Trump into a cult leader, you’re wrong and really crazy. If you aren’t then you are wrong and being really insulting.

    Ok, sorry. I’ll back off.

    Sorry.  I probably shouldn’t have said anything.  But I just got pissed off.

    • #563
  24. DrewInWisconsin, Oik Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oik
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Sorry. I probably shouldn’t have said anything. But I just got pissed off.

    Righteous pissed-offedness is okay.

    • #564
  25. Manny Coolidge
    Manny
    @Manny

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first).

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State.

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    After this last election I question whether his instincts are very good. After his last election and the fallout certainly makes me question his instincts. You seem to be blind to some of his bad decisions. That tells me people follow him as a cult leader.

    You know if you’re serious about Trumpers making Trump into a cult leader, you’re wrong and really crazy. If you aren’t then you are wrong and being really insulting.

    Ok, sorry. I’ll back off.

    Sorry. I probably shouldn’t have said anything. But I just got pissed off.

    It’s ok. I don’t want our disagreement to be personal. 

    • #565
  26. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Manny (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):
    The way you frame it, you’ve made him out to a cult figure, and that will never work out.

    No, this is an easy dismissal that misses the point. Sometimes you need an a-hole like Trump when at war with demons the Left. And his instincts are very, very good and he’s shown that he’s on our side (thus, MAGA and America(ns) first).

    Apparently Ron DeSantis looked like a deer in the headlights in his debate with Charlie Crist (I didn’t watch it myself). He’s proven to be a good governor, but on the national stage he’s an unknown and could be susceptible to the malign influences of the Deep State.

    Put not your faith in princes, but judge leaders by their fruits, not their style. Trump accomplished things I never thought I see in my lifetime despite the calumnies and bipartisan forces arrayed against him. I’m not sure DeSantis (or anyone else for that matter) would hold up as well.

    After this last election I question whether his instincts are very good. After his last election and the fallout certainly makes me question his instincts. You seem to be blind to some of his bad decisions. That tells me people follow him as a cult leader.

    You know if you’re serious about Trumpers making Trump into a cult leader, you’re wrong and really crazy. If you aren’t then you are wrong and being really insulting.

    Ok, sorry. I’ll back off.

    Sorry. I probably shouldn’t have said anything. But I just got pissed off.

    It’s ok. I don’t want our disagreement to be personal.

    Good.  Thanks.

    • #566
  27. lowtech redneck Coolidge
    lowtech redneck
    @lowtech redneck

    Manny (View Comment):

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    lowtech redneck (View Comment):

    Manny (View Comment):

    I don’t believe in brainwashing period.

    You really think advertisers pay premiums for product placement just so people know they exist, and not to subtly influence their unconscious perceptions and impulses? That repeated exposure to monolithic viewpoints and shibboleths do not lead to unconsidered assumptions, or social coercion does not lead to rationalizations to deal with the cognitive dissonance of speaking and behaving contrary to what you believe?

     

    I think what they do is give you their facts, and if you don’t explore the full facts your free decision is based on limited data. I haven’t bought a new car in twelve years. I’m in need of one now, so auto advertising is registering on my radar. But in the twelve years I didn’t need one, all the auto advertising in the world did not make me buy a new car.

    How is a millisecond of exposure to a coke can a fact? Unless one consciously notices and decides to resist, your mind makes the the connection between that coke can and the protagonist you identify with and root for, making you more likely to purchase coke in the event that your preference for non-cola products, or a specific type of cola, is not already firmly established. Do you really think that preferences for different foods and flavors is decided at birth, free of subtle influences as one grows and socializes within their family and society? The human mind is far more malleable, irrational, and delicate than you suppose. And if not, why do you suppose that preferences in terms of ideas are different from that same dynamic? Logical reasoning and the ‘examined life’ are things that must be taught, not instincts that most humans will adopt on their own.

    So, you believe in that one millisecond of a flash of a can of coke where the eye doesn’t even see it and the brain doesn’t even process it, and you will have a desire for coke? That’s a theory I heard as a kid. It’s bogus. Otherwise we’d all be running out to buy coke and whatever else they micro-flash in front of you. I would say 90% of pop psychology is bogus, starting with Freud. Freud was a fraud.

    And yet advertisers have been paying premiums to do this since the dawn of television; one would think they would have noticed a distinct lack of impact by now.  Its a factor, one that is enhanced through repeated exposure, not a deterministic variable that hypnotizes people.

    You also seem to believe the entire notion of totalitarianism (as opposed to authoritarianism) and its inherent dangers is also bunk, as it rests on the same underlying characteristics of the human mind and how it is influenced over time through coercion, saturation, and narrative control.

    • #567
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