Polio Is Back

 

Polio is back, despite being nearly eradicated since a safe effective vaccine was developed in the 1950s and been given to school children ever since.

New York state health officials have found indications of additional cases of polio virus in wastewater samples from two different counties, leading them to warn that hundreds of people may be infected with the potentially serious virus.

Just two weeks ago, the New York Health Department reported the nation’s first case of polio in almost a decade, in Rockland County, north of New York City. Officials said that case occurred in a previously healthy young adult who was unvaccinated and developed paralysis in their legs. Since then, three positive wastewater samples from Rockland County and four from neighboring Orange County were discovered and genetically linked to the first case, the health department said in a press release on Thursday, suggesting that the polio virus is being spread within local communities. The newest samples were taken from two locations in Orange County in June and July and one location in Rockland County in July.

“Based on earlier polio outbreaks, New Yorkers should know that for every one case of paralytic polio observed, there may be hundreds of other people infected,” State Health Commissioner Dr. Mary T. Bassett said. “Coupled with the latest wastewater findings, the Department is treating the single case of polio as just the tip of the iceberg of much greater potential spread. As we learn more, what we do know is clear: the danger of polio is present in New York today.”

I don’t object to vaccines, I objected to the Covid vaccine. Most vaccines have a long track record of safe use, and are actually effective. The Covid vaccine was rushed through development, with minimal clinical trials. The data from those trials is still being withheld from publication.

I think it’s reasonable to question the safety of the Covid “vaccine” — the effectiveness is certainly not in doubt. It’s clearly ineffective — it does not prevent the spread of the illness or the infection.  Perhaps “Preventative therapeutic” is a better description for it instead of “vaccine.”

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  1. Tedley Member
    Tedley
    @Tedley

    Open the border and look what happens!  I could be wrong, but let’s look at some facts.  Biden gets into office in Jan 2021, after stating during the election that he basically didn’t plan to enforce border controls.  After a surge of illegal immigrants began around that time and unprecedented numbers have crossed illegally over the last 18 months, we’re seeing diseases that only exist in the countries from which these people came.  I’m reminded of that Crash Test Dummies song, Mmmm mmmm mmmm.

    • #1
  2. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    I wonder what the odds are that the anonymous polio victim was an immigrant whose immunization status was not checked upon entry into the US.

    Added: Oh, I see this point has already been raised.

    • #2
  3. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    Good points. I hadnt thought of that angle. I was thinking that it was anti-vax hippies that are getting it.

    • #3
  4. RushBabe49 Thatcher
    RushBabe49
    @RushBabe49

    There are two contiguous countries where polio is still endemic.  Pakistan and Afghanistan.  What do these countries have in common?  They are Muslim.  The Muslims have rejected vaccinators, killing some and driving the rest out.  Gee, I wonder where those illegal aliens might have come from?  We old folks are most likely to have been vaccinated in childhood with the original injectable vaccine, which means we are not susceptible, but the young are.  Especially those who were prevented from getting their normal childhood vaccines while everyone was “locked down” at home to “stop the spread” of Covid.

    • #4
  5. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    RushBabe49 (View Comment):

    There are two contiguous countries where polio is still endemic. Pakistan and Afghanistan. What do these countries have in common? They are Muslim. The Muslims have rejected vaccinators, killing some and driving the rest out. Gee, I wonder where those illegal aliens might have come from? We old folks are most likely to have been vaccinated in childhood with the original injectable vaccine, which means we are not susceptible, but the young are. Especially those who were prevented from getting their normal childhood vaccines while everyone was “locked down” at home to “stop the spread” of Covid.

    Well, we don’t know he or she is an immigrant.  But it was the first thing that occurred to me.  I sort of thought that he could have come from central America, but you’re right, it could more easily have come with the Afghani refugees.

    • #5
  6. kedavis Inactive
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    • #6
  7. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    RushBabe49 (View Comment):
    There are two contiguous countries where polio is still endemic.  Pakistan and Afghanistan.  What do these countries have in common?  They are Muslim.  The Muslims have rejected vaccinators, killing some and driving the rest out.

    Maybe because the CIA ran a fake vaccination program to try to find Osama bin Laden?

    • #7
  8. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    RushBabe49 (View Comment):

    There are two contiguous countries where polio is still endemic. Pakistan and Afghanistan. What do these countries have in common? They are Muslim. The Muslims have rejected vaccinators, killing some and driving the rest out. Gee, I wonder where those illegal aliens might have come from? We old folks are most likely to have been vaccinated in childhood with the original injectable vaccine, which means we are not susceptible, but the young are. Especially those who were prevented from getting their normal childhood vaccines while everyone was “locked down” at home to “stop the spread” of Covid.

    Taliban.

    Polio is not much of a thing, if any of a thing, in Lahore or Islamabad or Karachi. Just the regions where Taliban have some power.

    Pakistan sends out polio vaccinators to do their best. Sometimes they’ve been martyred by the Taliban.

    • #8
  9. I Walton Member
    I Walton
    @IWalton

    Just another small downside blip from our wonderful government that is going to save us all from global warming  that could cause some unfortunate adjustments over the next century.  We don’t have to worry about any of these things because we’ll lose our savior in about three years.  We’ll still be around, the Chinese who run him won’t use his four years to damage the US.   Why would they do that?  So relax.  Nothing to worry about. 

    • #9
  10. Illiniguy Member
    Illiniguy
    @Illiniguy

    Among its many other humanitarian efforts, Rotary International has for years been distributing vaccines worldwide to stop the spread of polio. Every Rotary club is committed to that cause. If you want to make a difference, contact your local Rotary and ask how you can help.

    • #10
  11. W Bob Member
    W Bob
    @WBob

    I thought I read recently that this polio is being spread from people who were vaccinated with foreign vaccines not authorized in the US. So the vaccine gave them the virus and they spread it to others.

    Here it is from the article above.

     

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/polio-case-new-york-rockland-county/

     

     

    • #11
  12. iWe Coolidge
    iWe
    @iWe

    Some of my older kids were vaccinated with the oral vaccine, which is not as effective. We have suggested they all get re-upped.

    • #12
  13. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    OccupantCDN: I think it’s reasonable to question the safety of the Covid “vaccine” — the effectiveness is certainly not in doubt. It’s clearly ineffective — it does not prevent the spread of the illness or the infection. 

    It’s been shown to be very effective, but it does not eliminate the spread of the illness or infection on the part of those who have received it.  Not only that, but it doesn’t eliminate the possibility of infection.  So in that sense, you are giving the vaccine too much credit.  But it is very effective.  

    Perhaps “Preventative therapeutic” is a better description for it instead of “vaccine.”

    I’m not sure what the precise definition of “preventative therapeutic” is, but therapeutics are generally for the treatment of disease. The covid vaccine does nothing of the sort, unless there is some great discovery that I haven’t heard about.  So it would be false to label it as such.  

    It does what vaccines do.

    It’s always reasonable to question the safety of all vaccines.  

    • #13
  14. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    But it is very effective.

    At money transfers from taxpayers to pharmaceutical companies.

    • #14
  15. Saint Augustine Member
    Saint Augustine
    @SaintAugustine

    Arahant (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    But it is very effective.

    At money transfers from [future] taxpayers to pharmaceutical companies.

    FIFY, as the kids say.

    • #15
  16. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    Arahant (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    But it is very effective.

    At money transfers from taxpayers to pharmaceutical companies.

    I wouldn’t credit the vaccine with the method of paying for it. 

    • #16
  17. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    OccupantCDN: I think it’s reasonable to question the safety of the Covid “vaccine” — the effectiveness is certainly not in doubt. It’s clearly ineffective — it does not prevent the spread of the illness or the infection.

    It’s been shown to be very effective, but it does not eliminate the spread of the illness or infection on the part of those who have received it. Not only that, but it doesn’t eliminate the possibility of infection. So in that sense, you are giving the vaccine too much credit. But it is very effective.

    Perhaps “Preventative therapeutic” is a better description for it instead of “vaccine.”

    I’m not sure what the precise definition of “preventative therapeutic” is, but therapeutics are generally for the treatment of disease. The covid vaccine does nothing of the sort, unless there is some great discovery that I haven’t heard about. So it would be false to label it as such.

    It does what vaccines do.

    It’s always reasonable to question the safety of all vaccines.

    I have to strongly disagree here. If you look up the definition of the word vaccine (quick before they change it!):

    a substance used to stimulate the production of antibodies and provide immunity against one or several diseases, prepared from the causative agent of a disease, its products, or a synthetic substitute, treated to act as an antigen without inducing the disease.

    A vaccine prevents the infection, and thus prevents spreading of an infectious disease.  The term “Preventative Therapeutic” comes from the Canadian (or Ontario) government to describe the covid vaccine – which does not vaccinate the vaccinated against the covid illness. Its simply not effective in preventing covid, the data to judge its safety is being withheld which leads to great concern that its as safe as it is effective. Particularly given the grant of immunity granted from lawsuits that the developers received on this vaccine. 

    • #17
  18. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    OccupantCDN: I think it’s reasonable to question the safety of the Covid “vaccine” — the effectiveness is certainly not in doubt. It’s clearly ineffective — it does not prevent the spread of the illness or the infection.

    It’s been shown to be very effective, but it does not eliminate the spread of the illness or infection on the part of those who have received it. Not only that, but it doesn’t eliminate the possibility of infection. So in that sense, you are giving the vaccine too much credit. But it is very effective.

    Perhaps “Preventative therapeutic” is a better description for it instead of “vaccine.”

    I’m not sure what the precise definition of “preventative therapeutic” is, but therapeutics are generally for the treatment of disease. The covid vaccine does nothing of the sort, unless there is some great discovery that I haven’t heard about. So it would be false to label it as such.

    It does what vaccines do.

    It’s always reasonable to question the safety of all vaccines.

    I have to strongly disagree here. If you look up the definition of the word vaccine (quick before they change it!):

    a substance used to stimulate the production of antibodies and provide immunity against one or several diseases, prepared from the causative agent of a disease, its products, or a synthetic substitute, treated to act as an antigen without inducing the disease.

    A vaccine prevents the infection, and thus prevents spreading of an infectious disease. The term “Preventative Therapeutic” comes from the Canadian (or Ontario) government to describe the covid vaccine – which does not vaccinate the vaccinated against the covid illness. Its simply not effective in preventing covid, the data to judge its safety is being withheld which leads to great concern that its as safe as it is effective. Particularly given the grant of immunity granted from lawsuits that the developers received on this vaccine.

    I would need to see exactly how anyone uses the term preventative therapeutic to describe it. It sounds like misinformation to me.  And trusting governments to define these terms is not really the way to go.  

    But the covid vaccine does prevent infection, in that it prevents it from infecting your lungs and other dangerous places, and sometimes even prevents you from getting any symptomatic infection at all.  In that way it’s effective like the influenza vaccines. Doesn’t work all the time, but it works often enough to be worth having.  

    So when you say it doesn’t prevent the spread of a disease, it really depends on what kind of word games you’re playing with the term “prevent.”  There are very few vaccines, probably none, that work all the time, so if that’s your standard, maybe we don’t have any vaccines at all, not even against smallpox. 

    The covid vaccine is closer in efficacy to the flu vaccine in that the record against stopping infection, period, is not so great, but the record in stopping serious, life-threatening infections in the lungs is a lot better.  (There are some charlatans who go around saying we never called the flu vaccine a vaccine until covid came along. Those people are liars who take advantage of gullible people who won’t bother to check the newspaper archives for how the term has been used over the years.  I don’t trust liars.) 

    That grants of immunity have to do with adverse effects, not efficacy (as far as I know).  Conservatives were calling for those for years to make it possible for pharmaceutical companies to develop drugs and treatments, period.

     

    • #18
  19. kedavis Inactive
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    The covid vaccine is closer in efficacy to the flu vaccine in that the record against stopping infection, period, is not so great, but the record in stopping serious, life-threatening infections in the lungs is a lot better.  (There are some charlatans who go around saying we never called the flu vaccine a vaccine until covid came along. Those people are liars who take advantage of gullible people who won’t bother to check the newspaper archives for how the term has been used over the years.  I don’t trust liars.) 

    I’ve only ever gotten a “flu shot,” never a “flu vaccine.”

    • #19
  20. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    kedavis (View Comment):

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    The covid vaccine is closer in efficacy to the flu vaccine in that the record against stopping infection, period, is not so great, but the record in stopping serious, life-threatening infections in the lungs is a lot better. (There are some charlatans who go around saying we never called the flu vaccine a vaccine until covid came along. Those people are liars who take advantage of gullible people who won’t bother to check the newspaper archives for how the term has been used over the years. I don’t trust liars.)

    I’ve only ever gotten a “flu shot,” never a “flu vaccine.”

    They are the same thing and always have been. Those who say otherwise are liars, or are repeating what liars told them. 

    • #20
  21. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    I would need to see exactly how anyone uses the term preventative therapeutic to describe it. It sounds like misinformation to me.  And trusting governments to define these terms is not really the way to go.So when you say it doesn’t prevent the spread of a disease, it really depends on what kind of word games you’re playing with the term “prevent.”  There are very few vaccines, probably none, that work all the time, so if that’s your standard, maybe we don’t have any vaccines at all, not even against smallpox. 

    I only heard the term once. I think it was a trial balloon, looking for a description to avoid the term vaccine.

    So when you say it doesn’t prevent the spread of a disease, it really depends on what kind of word games you’re playing with the term “prevent.” There are very few vaccines, probably none, that work all the time, so if that’s your standard, maybe we don’t have any vaccines at all, not even against smallpox.

    I dont have any independent research, I only know what is permitted on the media and internet. I know that the vaccine is ineffective at stopping the spread of the disease, because I heard it on the internet – the media has even admitted that the vaccine is ineffective at stopping the infection. So why is it mandatory?

    The covid vaccine is closer in efficacy to the flu vaccine in that the record against stopping infection, period, is not so great, but the record in stopping serious, life-threatening infections in the lungs is a lot better. (There are some charlatans who go around saying we never called the flu vaccine a vaccine until covid came along. Those people are liars who take advantage of gullible people who won’t bother to check the newspaper archives for how the term has been used over the years. I don’t trust liars.)

    No, the flu shot is a vaccine – anyone who claimed otherwise would instantly loose credibility to me, and would be tuned out.  The real difference is that the flu shot is not mandatory.

     

    • #21
  22. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):
    The real difference is that the flu shot is not mandatory.

    An important distinction, indeed. 

    • #22
  23. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    OccupantCDN (View Comment):
    I dont have any independent research, I only know what is permitted on the media and internet. I know that the vaccine is ineffective at stopping the spread of the disease, because I heard it on the internet – the media has even admitted that the vaccine is ineffective at stopping the infection. So why is it mandatory?

    The vaccine is effective at stopping serious infection; however, it has turned out to be of hardly any use as a public health tool. For my personal health I definitely want the vaccine, but whether or not I get vaccinated is not going to do much, if anything, to protect public health.  Most vaccinated people still are likely to get enough of an infection to spread it, and the good the vaccine does against that is very low. Maybe it does some measurable good, but I haven’t seen where anyone has tried to make those measurements, and when we’re in that kind of territory, it is completely bonkers for it to be mandated. 

    Testing, on the other hand, can do some good as as public health tool. There are some people who are against mandated testing, too, and I kind of sympathize in that it is scary how attached some people get to their mandates.  We should not let these people get in the habit.  But when done right (they are usually not done right) mandated tests can do some good for public health. 

    So I can’t cross the border into Canada without getting vaccinated, which makes no sense at all. A rapid test at the border would at least make some sense, though whether it would be good policy can be debated on other grounds.

    For a few years now I’ve wanted to do a long, nearly 2000 mile bike ride that would end in southeast Saskatchewan, but the requirements for getting across the border kind of put me off. I’m vaccinated, but still. The other day I heard from a friend about her experience going across the border this summer (at a location much further east) and that put me off even more. I wouldn’t rule it out on account of that, but I also had an alternative bike tour in mind that would not involve any border crossing, and a few days ago my wife and I decided on that instead.  Maybe next year we’ll do the trip to Saskatchewan.

    • #23
  24. Bishop Wash Member
    Bishop Wash
    @BishopWash

    Arahant (View Comment):

    RushBabe49 (View Comment):
    There are two contiguous countries where polio is still endemic. Pakistan and Afghanistan. What do these countries have in common? They are Muslim. The Muslims have rejected vaccinators, killing some and driving the rest out.

    Maybe because the CIA ran a fake vaccination program to try to find Osama bin Laden?

    Was going to say the same. Also, didn’t Barry open his mouth and expose that secret so that he could appear tough and take credit for getting rid of bin Laden?

    • #24
  25. OccupantCDN Coolidge
    OccupantCDN
    @OccupantCDN

    The Reticulator (View Comment):
    So I can’t cross the border into Canada without getting vaccinated, which makes no sense at all. A rapid test at the border would at least make some sense, though whether it would be good policy can be debated on other grounds.

    Canadians can’t travel on any federally regulated transport service (Air/Rail) without being vaccinated – international travel is off limits…Which has made no sense from the get go – as foreign travelers and workers have not been restricted at all. Canadians are still subject to testing and isolation when they return.

    Its not about controlling the virus its about controlling the people.

    The entire response to this epidemic was about economic and political control of the population. the upcoming economic contraction, stagflation  and food shortages will be far deadlier than the actual pandemic.

    This is easily the worst public policy failure since world war 1.

    • #25
  26. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Come on guys.  Stop splitting hairs about what a vaccine does or doesn’t do, or should do but doesn’t need to.  There is a common understanding about vaccines and the results from the NIH:

     History of Smallpox | Smallpox | CDCcdc.gov› smallpox › history › history.html

    February 20, 2021 – The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox.

    ***

    The milkmaids didn’t get smallpox.  That was the greatness of vaccination.  To say that a vaccine merely lessens the effects of infection goes against the historical understanding and purpose of vaccination.

    • #26
  27. Arahant Member
    Arahant
    @Arahant

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Come on guys. Stop splitting hairs about what a vaccine does or doesn’t do, or should do but doesn’t need to. There is a common understanding about vaccines and the results from the NIH:

    History of Smallpox | Smallpox | CDCcdc.gov› smallpox › history › history.html

    February 20, 2021 – The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox.

    ***

    The milkmaids didn’t get smallpox. That was the greatness of vaccination. To say that a vaccine merely lessens the effects of infection goes against the historical understanding and purpose of vaccination.

    That’s right, and “Vaccine” comes from the word for cow, as in cowpox, “vacca.” These aren’t vaccinations. They are oviumations.

    • #27
  28. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Come on guys. Stop splitting hairs about what a vaccine does or doesn’t do, or should do but doesn’t need to. There is a common understanding about vaccines and the results from the NIH:

    History of Smallpox | Smallpox | CDCcdc.gov› smallpox › history › history.html

    February 20, 2021 – The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox.

    ***

    The milkmaids didn’t get smallpox. That was the greatness of vaccination. To say that a vaccine merely lessens the effects of infection goes against the historical understanding and purpose of vaccination.

    You neglected to provide a basis for making that last statement. Maybe you were typing too fast and forgot?  

    • #28
  29. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    The Reticulator (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Come on guys. Stop splitting hairs about what a vaccine does or doesn’t do, or should do but doesn’t need to. There is a common understanding about vaccines and the results from the NIH:

    History of Smallpox | Smallpox | CDCcdc.gov› smallpox › history › history.html

    February 20, 2021 – The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox.

    ***

    The milkmaids didn’t get smallpox. That was the greatness of vaccination. To say that a vaccine merely lessens the effects of infection goes against the historical understanding and purpose of vaccination.

    You neglected to provide a basis for making that last statement. Maybe you were typing too fast and forgot?

    Which words exactly?  You didn’t specify.  Maybe you forgot?

    • #29
  30. Charlotte Member
    Charlotte
    @Charlotte

    Arahant (View Comment):
    That’s right, and “Vaccine” comes from the word for cow, as in cowpox, “vacca.” These aren’t vaccinations. They are oviumations.

    Perfect! This is just the clarification we were looking for. 

    • #30
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