‘Politics is Downstream of Culture’

 

The late great Andrew Breitbart said that, and he was absolutely right.

In America, there are two political parties — two parties capable of winning national elections. In local elections, the situation is more fluid and uncertain and party affiliation is less important but at the national level, there are Republicans and Democrats. Efforts to create a third viable party come at the expense of one of those, and essentially assure the victory of the other.

America appears equally divided politically, but it really isn’t. Our national elections are virtual ties because the culture skews strongly to the left. Absent the nearly universal leftward cant of news, entertainment, and education, America would be unambiguously to the right politically.

The culture, in turn, leans left not because Americans lean left, but rather because those institutions that for better or worse represent our cultural touchstones lean left: those institutions of news, entertainment, and education mentioned above.

Those institutions are out of touch with the public. How do we know that? We know that because they are terrified of the possibility that the cultural playing field might be leveled — as recent stories about a threatened shift toward free speech at Twitter reveal. People secure in their command of the culture wouldn’t be horrified by the thought that their ability to censor dissent might be compromised. That isn’t how secure people think. That isn’t how power thinks.

One institution that understands the cultural reality is The Babylon Bee. Another is The Daily Wire. Both of these get it. They know that the way to win the culture war is to speak to America around the filters of Google and Twitter and George Washington Middle School and MSNBC — and not to give a damn what those erstwhile guardians of the public information trust have to say.

Ricochet is doing its part as well, providing a platform for a growing number of right-of-center podcasts that appeal to normal Americans tired of the left’s strident and humorless and terrified talking heads.

We don’t have to “win back the culture.” We haven’t lost the culture. We’ve merely allowed a minority of counter-cultural nutjobs to cow us into silence.

The left is stupid: it dominates through intimidation and volume, rather than facts and substance. That’s why the left demands that contrary thoughts be censored. That’s weakness. That’s an implicit admission that they live in a fantasy world that can’t survive sober scrutiny.

I’m a man. If someone calls me a woman, I don’t care: I’m a man. And that’s the difference: I can’t be “misgendered” because my sexual identity isn’t a tenuous fiction. That’s the advantage we on the right have: truth.

Normal Americans know that. They know you shouldn’t talk about sex to six-year-olds. They know purple hair looks silly. They know boys can’t have babies.

Political reality is that there is a party on the left and a party on the right, and that they’re roughly equally balanced. Cultural reality is that the left acts in secret and requires censorship because it knows America doesn’t like what the left is pushing.

Our job is to speak up. So speak up. Use your own voice. Use your own name. Say the things the left wants you to think nice people don’t — can’t — say.

Give the real culture its voice. Be that voice. Say the things the left is afraid to hear. And offend people, if you have to.

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  1. TheRightNurse Member
    TheRightNurse
    @TheRightNurse

    No.

    We lost the “culture” a long time ago. 

    We did not lose the common operation and behavior.  We are *losing* them.  Call yourself what you like,  claim inoffense.

    It makes no matter.

    The world continues despite whatever natterings you have in front of your TV.

    Unfortunately, censorship *is* power. It is not TRUTH.  While words are censored and silenced, the truth rings as it does.  We would like to think we’re the majority, but the world is silenced by nice and fear of offense. Combined with boldness or violence, everyone else is cowed.

    • #1
  2. GlenEisenhardt Coolidge
    GlenEisenhardt
    @GlenEisenhardt

    If conservatives really are the majority, it is more proof of what a failed movement it is that it can’t stop kids from getting hormone treatments and being castrated while being the majority. The America you think you’re conserving is long gone. Why? You conserved nothing. You voted for slogans instead of results. And you still don’t care about results. You just care about Dems temporarily being held on abeyance. And even then they aren’t held in abeyance because as soon as they’re out of Congress they get everything they want through the courts. They got gay marriage. They got Obamacare. They weren’t even in power and they got a special counsel launched against Trump that derailed him for years. If they’re stupid what are you?

    • #2
  3. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    An excellent post. Much to think about.

    Republicans are up against a formidable force in that the Democrats seem to operate as Democrats wherever they are.  They are always promoting their ideas and proposals. Proselytizing is part of their ordinary day. Everything for them is a holy nonstop mission.

    Republicans tend to argue constantly, but they are not proactive. Republicans are not trying to convert people, just persuade them. Republicans tend to not wake up each day being angry at the guy next door. We probably don’t even notice him.

    If I could present this visually, I’d picture the Republican just trying to live his life somehow with the Democrats all around him hammering at him from all sides.

    • #3
  4. Columbo Member
    Columbo
    @Columbo

    And offend people, if you have to.

    There is no IF. The culture, now manufactured, by the education, media and technology complex, is all about victimhood and taking offense at anyone who does not abide by their atheistic dogmas.  Just being male and white, or just white and straight is an offense, without saying or doing anything. These snowflakes alternate between being the victim and the aggressor. And they can turn into little Hitlers at the drop of a hat.

    • #4
  5. DonG (CAGW is a Hoax) Coolidge
    DonG (CAGW is a Hoax)
    @DonG

    Speak TRUTH to power. 

    • #5
  6. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Henry Racette: We don’t have to “win back the culture.” We haven’t lost the culture. We’ve merely allowed a minority of counter-cultural nutjobs to cow us into silence.

    Strongly disagree. We (especially religious traditionalists) are the counter-culture and have been for some time. The culture is a toxic combo of godless relativism (what Pope Benedict called the dictatorship of relativism), sexual license (this began with the sexual revolution waaayy back), the will to power, and victim-status hierarchy climbing. I’ve been calling myself a resident alien in the land of my birth for at least ten years now. 

    The Left made the long march through the institutions, as you already noted Henry. It owns the culture and all its perversions and malignancy. And it’s presumptuous of you to assume that we’re not speaking out and fighting the good fight in our little corner of the world. Christians, particularly, are called to be salt and light. The people around me know where I stand. And some of them don’t like it at all. I’ve even confronted the progs in my parish when the opportunity presents itself. Just a couple of weeks ago, as a matter of fact.

    • #6
  7. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    And I’ll add, Christians expect to be hated. Jesus told us we would be. America was exceptionally welcoming of Christians up until the mid-twentieth century, when progressives started capitalizing (yes, irony alert) on their prolonged efforts to “fundamentally transform” the nation. It’s been all downhill from there.

    • #7
  8. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    And I’ll add, Christians expect to be hated. Jesus told us we would be. America was exceptionally welcoming of Christians up until the mid-twentieth century, when progressives started capitalizing (yes, irony alert) on their prolonged efforts to “fundamentally transform” the nation. It’s been all downhill from there.

    And then there’s this example: “He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.”

    We are different in the United States.  We are supposed to be the government, and we technically are the government.  This puts an historically and spiritually new onus on us.  And our culture goes back hundreds of years, at least, as a people.  How many generations does it take to wipe this out?  I would think more than just three (which I would say is the current count).  But this doesn’t mean we may not have to suffer.

    But more fundamentally we are people, created, not omnipotent.  And suffering and suffering under evil is the way of the earth.  And yet, God controls everything.  So we are commanded both to do and to work to further truth, justice, peace and righteousness, but we are not guaranteed fulfillment of this in this life.

    Whatever the circumstances we are firstly to follow Jesus’ example.  If we do, then being the government works.  If we don’t, then it doesn’t.

    • #8
  9. Jim McConnell Member
    Jim McConnell
    @JimMcConnell

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    And I’ll add, Christians expect to be hated. Jesus told us we would be. America was exceptionally welcoming of Christians up until the mid-twentieth century, when progressives started capitalizing (yes, irony alert) on their prolonged efforts to “fundamentally transform” the nation. It’s been all downhill from there.

    And then there’s this example: “He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.”

    We are different in the United States. We are supposed to be the government, and we technically are the government. This puts an historically and spiritually new onus on us. And our culture goes back hundreds of years, at least, as a people. How many generations does it take to wipe this out? I would think more than just three (which I would say is the current count). But this doesn’t mean we may not have to suffer.

    But more fundamentally we are people, created, not omnipotent. And suffering and suffering under evil is the way of the earth. And yet, God controls everything. So we are commanded both to do and to work to further truth, justice, peace and righteousness, but we are not guaranteed fulfillment of this in this life.

    Whatever the circumstances we are firstly to follow Jesus’ example. If we do, then being the government works. If we don’t, then it doesn’t.

    Very well said.

    • #9
  10. Chuck Thatcher
    Chuck
    @Chuckles

    Henry Racette: They know purple hair looks silly.

    And that pants worn with the belt below the crotch is silly.

    • #10
  11. Chuck Thatcher
    Chuck
    @Chuckles

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    And I’ll add, Christians expect to be hated. Jesus told us we would be. America was exceptionally welcoming of Christians up until the mid-twentieth century, when progressives started capitalizing (yes, irony alert) on their prolonged efforts to “fundamentally transform” the nation. It’s been all downhill from there.

    You mean like, “In this world ye shall have tribulation”?  Or “..they will put some of you to death. And you will be hated by all for My name’s sake?”

     

    • #11
  12. DrewInWisconsin, Oik! Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oik!
    @DrewInWisconsin

    I’m told we can no longer afford to be respectable.

    But then everyone here gets mad at me when I put it into practice.

     

    • #12
  13. hoowitts Coolidge
    hoowitts
    @hoowitts

    TheRightNurse (View Comment):
    We lost the “culture” a long time ago. 

    MarciN (View Comment):
    Republicans tend to argue constantly, but they are not proactive. Republicans are not trying to convert people, just persuade them. Republicans tend to not wake up each day being angry at the guy next door. We probably don’t even notice him.

    Columbo (View Comment):

    And offend people, if you have to.

    There is no IF. The culture, now manufactured, by the education, media and technology complex, is all about victimhood and taking offense at anyone who does not abide by their atheistic dogmas.  Just being male and white, or just white and straight is an offense, without saying or doing anything. These snowflakes alternate between being the victim and the aggressor. And they can turn into little Hitlers at the drop of a hat.

    DonG (CAGW is a Hoax) (View Comment):

    Speak TRUTH to power.

    Don’t these directly correlate to Henry’s point:

    Henry Racette:

    Our job is to speak up. So speak up. Use your own voice. Use your own name. Say the things the left wants you to think nice people don’t — can’t — say.

    Give the real culture its voice. Be that voice. Say the things the left is afraid to hear. And offend people, if you have to.

    Is it possible we only lost the culture because we “lost our voice”? Meaning, choosing not to speak often enough or strongly enough because of the perceived cost of speaking up? And just to be clear, Reagan was better at this than Trump: speaking truth to power. 

    Is it possible we win it back again by boldly expressing what most already know to be true, regardless the cost? Or are we already past the Rubicon? (I don’t think this is the case)

    Two quotes come to mind that exemplify this. Surprisingly, one is from Hollywood (Rob Reiner, the Meathead of all meatheads) and Eric Metaxas from his unparalleled Bonhoeffer biography:

    “People want leadership. And in the absence of genuine leadership, they will listen to anyone who steps up to the microphone.” ~The American President

    “Silence in the face of evil is itself evil. God will not hold us guiltless. Not to speak is to speak. Not to act is to act.” Eric Metaxas, Bonhoeffer: Pastor, Martyr, Prophet, Spy. 

    • #13
  14. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Henry Racette: We don’t have to “win back the culture.” We haven’t lost the culture. We’ve merely allowed a minority of counter-cultural nutjobs to cow us into silence.

    Strongly disagree. We (especially religious traditionalists) are the counter-culture and have been for some time. The culture is a toxic combo of godless relativism (what Pope Benedict called the dictatorship of relativism), sexual license (this began with the sexual revolution waaayy back), the will to power, and victim-status hierarchy climbing. I’ve been calling myself a resident alien in the land of my birth for at least ten years now.

    Okay, now I’m going to strongly disagree with you (respectfully).  Despite what it seems like when you hear all the news, 75% of Americans affiliate with a religious group and a good 83 – 90% still believe in God.  Among industrialized nations, the U.S. has traditionally been either the top nation or nearly the top nation in religious belief and I don’t think that has changed recently.  Ireland used to give us competition but they have had a serious religious slide in recent years.

    https://www.prri.org/research/2020-census-of-american-religion/

    https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/religious-landscape-study/belief-in-god/

    The Left made the long march through the institutions, as you already noted Henry. It owns the culture and all its perversions and malignancy. And it’s presumptuous of you to assume that we’re not speaking out and fighting the good fight in our little corner of the world. Christians, particularly, are called to be salt and light. The people around me know where I stand. And some of them don’t like it at all. I’ve even confronted the progs in my parish when the opportunity presents itself. Just a couple of weeks ago, as a matter of fact.

    I think it is somewhat illusory that the left controls everything and that we have “lost” the culture.  We get that notion constantly from the 24 hour news cycle combined with social media platforms like Twitter and Facebook, but those are not trusted sources of information.  Despite all the bruhaha, a sizable majority of Americans still believe in 2nd Amendment gun rights and freedom of Speech, and lower taxes, and a whole host of conservative notions.  Surveys constantly show that nearly all these woke ideas like defunding police, white racism, transgender perversions, racial quotas, getting rid of voter I.D. and such, have very little support, even among democrats and minorities.

    I agree whole-heartedly that it has been moving in the wrong direction for a number of decades, but we are currently in the midst of the greatest push-back and conservative revival that I have seen in my lifetime.

    • #14
  15. hoowitts Coolidge
    hoowitts
    @hoowitts

    Steven Seward (View Comment):
    I think it is somewhat illusory that the left controls everything and that we have “lost” the culture.  We get that notion constantly from the 24 hour news cycle combined with social media platforms like Twitter and Facebook, but those are not trusted sources of information.  Despite all the bruhaha, a sizable majority of Americans still believe in 2nd Amendment gun rights and freedom of Speech, and lower taxes, and a whole host of conservative notions.  Surveys constantly show that nearly all these woke ideas like defunding police, white racism, transgender perversions, racial quotas, getting rid of voter I.D. and such, have very little support, even among democrats and minorities.

    I agree. So the big question…why do the continue to get elected? Is the cultural persuasion that great? Or are they that good at cheating – or are we just terrible at catching cheaters?

    • #15
  16. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Steven Seward (View Comment):
    Okay, now I’m going to strongly disagree with you (respectfully).  Despite what it seems like when you hear all the news, 75% of Americans affiliate with a religious group and a good 83 – 90% still believe in God.  Among industrialized nations, the U.S. has traditionally been either the top nation or nearly the top nation in religious belief and I don’t think that has changed recently.  Ireland used to give us competition but they have had a serious religious slide in recent years.

    I don’t know where these people are getting their stats, but the fastest growing affiliation among young people is “Nones.” Catholics write books about trying to keep kids in the church, and my own family is an example of my failure to do so. Secular culture is dominant in a way made possible by technology (addictive social media and internet). And even young men who show up at daily Mass are addicted to porn (I know this through adherent friends’ adult daughter looking for a Catholic man to marry). 

    I think that a “majority” of people believe in God (which God are we talking about?) isn’t relevant when people are still entrusting their children to the state indoctrination system because both parents have to work to sustain the lifestyle to which the family has become accustomed and they don’t want to take on the responsibility of homeschooling. I often wonder what it would take for people to get their kids out of the toxic public education system. My own kids are in their 20’s and I was already dealing with the sickness in the system when they were young. It’s only gotten worse. Even private schools are woke, but parents still pay a lot of money to send their kids there (I know of an example of a student getting in trouble for asking his biology teacher if flowers get to pick their sex. Free thinkers not permitted). And then they pay a lot of money (or go in debt) to send their kids to university where the brainwashing is completed. 

    No, any culture that kills a million babies every year and mutilates and sterilizes children in the name of gender ideology is a goner. As I’ve repeated many times, at the height of the Soviet Union, only 10% of the population belonged to the communist party. It doesn’t take a majority to be culturally dominant. 

    • #16
  17. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    I hope everyone had a wonderful Easter Sunday. I’m not a person of faith, but I come out of the Catholic tradition and Easter is still a holiday I enjoy.

    I’ve read all the comments above and I stand by the post I wrote. I’ll offer just a couple of responses to what’s been written here so far.

    When I say “the culture,” I don’t mean what Hollywood wants us to think the culture is. I mean what most Americans live, what they value and what they teach their children.

    That isn’t CRT. The left teaches that in secret, denying that they teach it at all — because they know it’s anathema to what most Americans believe. The same is true of the trans garbage: they have to keep deviant sexual instruction a secret because, when people find out about it, they start showing up at school board meetings, voting out radical school board members, and passing bills against it.

    The culture isn’t what we see on television. And people who are more aligned with actual American culture are, finally, getting upset. They’ll be voting in November, and I think they’re going to send a message.

    Regarding politics: I think the call to abandon the Republican Party is foolish, based on an obviously mistaken belief that Republicans and Democrats are the same. It takes a willful disregard of the evidence to hold to that view, and I’m not going to waste my time arguing with people who are unwilling to look at the voting records and acknowledge the incontrovertible truth that the parties are really quite different.

    Similarly, folks who think, as one guy put it a couple of days ago, that America is a “Marxist hellhole,” are demonstrating a profound lack of perspective. It’s hard to have a productive discussion with people who speak in hyperbole, and I’m disinclined to spend time trying. I’ll engage people who speak more sensibly.

    As for those people who imagine that we can create a viable third party more conservative than the Republican party and do it without handing government over to a Democratic Party poised to ravage our institutions and undermine the electoral process (no hyperbole there, as packing the court, abolishing the electoral college, and federalizing election law are already on their to-do list)…

    I’m reminded of the guy who takes his last fifty thousand dollars to the tracks and bets on the horses, because he needs three times as much to make a big business deal. That could work, but it’s a crazy, irresponsible gamble. I’ve explained my reasoning as to why a third party is almost certain to fail. I hope those explanations make sense to people who care about making sense; I know those who don’t care about making sense will keep saying it.

    We are a big country full of sensible people, and I remain optimistic.

    • #17
  18. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    hoowitts (View Comment):

    Steven Seward (View Comment):
    I think it is somewhat illusory that the left controls everything and that we have “lost” the culture. We get that notion constantly from the 24 hour news cycle combined with social media platforms like Twitter and Facebook, but those are not trusted sources of information. Despite all the bruhaha, a sizable majority of Americans still believe in 2nd Amendment gun rights and freedom of Speech, and lower taxes, and a whole host of conservative notions. Surveys constantly show that nearly all these woke ideas like defunding police, white racism, transgender perversions, racial quotas, getting rid of voter I.D. and such, have very little support, even among democrats and minorities.

    I agree. So the big question…why do the continue to get elected? Is the cultural persuasion that great? Or are they that good at cheating – or are we just terrible at catching cheaters?

    Don’t forget that the majority of elected officials in this country are still Republican.  The democrats may have the White House, but the senate is completely split 50-50 and the dems are ahead in the House of Representatives by four or five seats, and its only been that way for the last year.  On the State level republicans still hold a sizable majority in governorships, state-wide offices such as lieutenant governors and treasurers, and statehouse seats.  If I’m not mistaken, an overwhelming number of mayors in the U.S. are republicans by virtue of the fact that democrats tend to gather in the largest cities under a small number of democrat mayors while republicans are spread out all over the place with thousands of republican mayors.

    Don’t forget what happened in Virginia five months ago.  They flipped the governorship, lieutenant governorship, attorney general, and the statehouse into republican hands.  We forget about those because the likes of AOC and Nancy Pelosi getting re-elected clogs up our brains with righteous anger.

    • #18
  19. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Steven Seward (View Comment):
    Okay, now I’m going to strongly disagree with you (respectfully). Despite what it seems like when you hear all the news, 75% of Americans affiliate with a religious group and a good 83 – 90% still believe in God. Among industrialized nations, the U.S. has traditionally been either the top nation or nearly the top nation in religious belief and I don’t think that has changed recently. Ireland used to give us competition but they have had a serious religious slide in recent years.

    I don’t know where these people are getting their stats, but the fastest growing affiliation among young people is “Nones.” Catholics write books about trying to keep kids in the church, and my own family is an example of my failure to do so. Secular culture is dominant in a way made possible by technology (addictive social media and internet). And even young men who show up at daily Mass are addicted to porn (I know this through adherent friends’ adult daughter looking for a Catholic man to marry).

    Religious belief has been eroding, but the decline, in America at least, is very slow and gradual.  I just saw a survey that said religious belief actually increased in the last couple years (due to Covid? Or the election of Brandon??).   Actual church attendance has been down more so than religious belief, but I think some of it must have to do with technology – people can watch services or sermons on their TV’s, computers, or smart phones.  I know that in the small Jewish community that I frequent, they utilized podcasting and zoom attendance to the max all through the pandemic.

     

    • #19
  20. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    I think that a “majority” of people believe in God (which God are we talking about?) isn’t relevant when people are still entrusting their children to the state indoctrination system because both parents have to work to sustain the lifestyle to which the family has become accustomed and they don’t want to take on the responsibility of homeschooling. I often wonder what it would take for people to get their kids out of the toxic public education system. My own kids are in their 20’s and I was already dealing with the sickness in the system when they were young. It’s only gotten worse. Even private schools are woke, but parents still pay a lot of money to send their kids there (I know of an example of a student getting in trouble for asking his biology teacher if flowers get to pick their sex. Free thinkers not permitted). And then they pay a lot of money (or go in debt) to send their kids to university where the brainwashing is completed.

    Agree.  I think schools are the primary concern of where the leftists hold sway.  Adults have the capacity to reject silly leftist thought, but kids are naive and impressionable.

    • #20
  21. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Henry Racette (View Comment):
    The culture isn’t what we see on television. And people who are more aligned with actual American culture are, finally, getting upset. They’ll be voting in November, and I think they’re going to send a message.

    Who is making the argument that culture is what we see on television? Not me.

    I’ll believe people are getting upset when they start emptying the public schools en masse. It’s shocking to me that, knowing what we know about how public education operates/indoctrinates people are still sending their young, vulnerable, impressionable children into that environment, let alone to university which is the best way to turn your kid into a lefty (unless they go to Hillsdale, but no guarantee there either). 

    I have a neighbor who’s been a respected public school teacher for many decades and when I told her I was going to homeschool my daughter in 6th grade (due to bullying and her declining health) she said the most hateful things to me without even an attempt to understand our situation. She’s an unremitting lefty (as is her husband, an elementary school principle). As I recall, Henry, you homeschooled your kids, so maybe you really don’t know what’s happening in the public schools and just how bad the condition of our culture really is. 

    When Matt Walsh shows up at school board meetings, good for him! But, he’s protected his kids from the system he’s criticizing. Until more parents do likewise, I’m not all that impressed with their commitment to their children’s wellbeing or education. Until there’s a sense of urgency about protecting kids’ innocence and teaching and modeling the virtues, no one should entrust their children to this system.

    • #21
  22. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Steven Seward (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Steven Seward (View Comment):
    Okay, now I’m going to strongly disagree with you (respectfully). Despite what it seems like when you hear all the news, 75% of Americans affiliate with a religious group and a good 83 – 90% still believe in God. Among industrialized nations, the U.S. has traditionally been either the top nation or nearly the top nation in religious belief and I don’t think that has changed recently. Ireland used to give us competition but they have had a serious religious slide in recent years.

    I don’t know where these people are getting their stats, but the fastest growing affiliation among young people is “Nones.” Catholics write books about trying to keep kids in the church, and my own family is an example of my failure to do so. Secular culture is dominant in a way made possible by technology (addictive social media and internet). And even young men who show up at daily Mass are addicted to porn (I know this through adherent friends’ adult daughter looking for a Catholic man to marry).

    Religious belief has been eroding, but the decline, in America at least, is very slow and gradual. I just saw a survey that said religious belief actually increased in the last couple years (due to Covid? Or the election of Brandon??). Actual church attendance has been down more so than religious belief, but I think some of it must have to do with technology – people can watch services or sermons on their TV’s, computers, or smart phones. I know that in the small Jewish community that I frequent, they utilized podcasting and zoom attendance to the max all through the pandemic.

    It’s possible colloquially to be “spiritual” but not to believe in God.  Or to “believe in god” but not be spiritual.  I think there’s a difference between belief in a higher power or the god of your own understanding, and religious belief, and devotion to God.

    This is a year or two ago, but I read that for the first time, less than half of Americans said they believed in god.

    • #22
  23. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):
    As I recall, Henry, you homeschooled your kids, so maybe you really don’t know what’s happening in the public schools and just how bad the condition of our culture really is.

    Good recollection, WC. Yes, we did. And then, as a single father, I put the younger three into a small Catholic school for their high school years.

    But I do know what goes on in the public schools. A lot of people do, which may explain the dramatic increase in home-schooling in recent years — including pre-COVID years. When my kids started home-schooling, in the early 1990s, it was fairly rare and resources were scarce. Fewer than 300,000 children, it’s estimated, were homeschooled in 1990.

    Today that number is probably (hard statistics are scarce) approaching four million.


    I think a lot of people don’t understand the cultural shift that is occurring right now. The left is moving “forward” at an ever-increasing rate, widening the gap between what normal people believe and what the left is willing to present as true and good. The result is that we’re seeing a growing awareness of just how messed up the progressive program really is. The trans movement and CRT are big parts of that: both of these have exploded since, and largely thanks to, Obama.

    We are reaching, if not a tipping point, at least a point of widespread awareness that the left is crazy. I think we will see a pretty rapid push-back against it, beginning just in the past couple of years.

    • #23
  24. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Steven Seward (View Comment):

    Western Chauvinist (View Comment):

    Steven Seward (View Comment):
    Okay, now I’m going to strongly disagree with you (respectfully). Despite what it seems like when you hear all the news, 75% of Americans affiliate with a religious group and a good 83 – 90% still believe in God. Among industrialized nations, the U.S. has traditionally been either the top nation or nearly the top nation in religious belief and I don’t think that has changed recently. Ireland used to give us competition but they have had a serious religious slide in recent years.

    I don’t know where these people are getting their stats, but the fastest growing affiliation among young people is “Nones.” Catholics write books about trying to keep kids in the church, and my own family is an example of my failure to do so. Secular culture is dominant in a way made possible by technology (addictive social media and internet). And even young men who show up at daily Mass are addicted to porn (I know this through adherent friends’ adult daughter looking for a Catholic man to marry).

    Religious belief has been eroding, but the decline, in America at least, is very slow and gradual. I just saw a survey that said religious belief actually increased in the last couple years (due to Covid? Or the election of Brandon??). Actual church attendance has been down more so than religious belief, but I think some of it must have to do with technology – people can watch services or sermons on their TV’s, computers, or smart phones. I know that in the small Jewish community that I frequent, they utilized podcasting and zoom attendance to the max all through the pandemic.

    It’s possible colloquially to be “spiritual” but not to believe in God. Or to “believe in god” but not be spiritual. I think there’s a difference between belief in a higher power or the god of your own understanding, and religious belief, and devotion to God.

    Sure, all that is possible, but it would be a nightmare for pollsters to try and quantify that.

    This is a year or two ago, but I read that for the first time, less than half of Americans said they believed in god.

    I don’t believe that is anywhere close to being true.  I’ve looked at religious surveys for probably three decades and Atheism or Atheism+Agnosticism has never registered anywhere near half of the country.  It is true in most of Western Europe.

    • #24
  25. Flicker Coolidge
    Flicker
    @Flicker

    Steven Seward (View Comment):

    Sure, all that is possible, but it would be a nightmare for pollsters to try and quantify that.

    This is a year or two ago, but I read that for the first time, less than half of Americans said they believed in god.

    I don’t believe that is anywhere close to being true.  I’ve looked at religious surveys for probably three decades and Atheism or Atheism+Agnosticism has never registered anywhere near half of the country.  It is true in most of Western Europe.

    Yup, you’re right.  For the first time less that half go to church or believe in organized religion.

    As for believing in god, I guess you’ve seen this, but anyway,

    The highest level of belief (87%) comes from a simple yes/no question, “Do you believe in God?” which Gallup last asked in 2017.

    Belief drops to 79% when respondents are given three options, one being God is something they believe in. The rest are either not sure whether they believe in God or firmly say they do not believe in God.

    • #25
  26. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Steven Seward (View Comment):

    Sure, all that is possible, but it would be a nightmare for pollsters to try and quantify that.

    This is a year or two ago, but I read that for the first time, less than half of Americans said they believed in god.

    I don’t believe that is anywhere close to being true. I’ve looked at religious surveys for probably three decades and Atheism or Atheism+Agnosticism has never registered anywhere near half of the country. It is true in most of Western Europe.

    Yup, you’re right. For the first time less that half go to church or believe in organized religion.

    I think the last figure I saw was 40% of Americans attended church, but that doesn’t mean every Sunday, I think that is for the entire year.

    • #26
  27. GlenEisenhardt Coolidge
    GlenEisenhardt
    @GlenEisenhardt

    DrewInWisconsin, Oik! (View Comment):

    I’m told we can no longer afford to be respectable.

    But then everyone here gets mad at me when I put it into practice.

     

    Just don’t disrespect people on your side who don’t score points or keep their word. 

    • #27
  28. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Flicker (View Comment):
    Yup, you’re right.  For the first time less that half go to church or believe in organized religion.

    So, practical atheists, like my kids and their contemporaries.

    • #28
  29. Western Chauvinist Member
    Western Chauvinist
    @WesternChauvinist

    Steven Seward (View Comment):

    Flicker (View Comment):

    Steven Seward (View Comment):

    Sure, all that is possible, but it would be a nightmare for pollsters to try and quantify that.

    This is a year or two ago, but I read that for the first time, less than half of Americans said they believed in god.

    I don’t believe that is anywhere close to being true. I’ve looked at religious surveys for probably three decades and Atheism or Atheism+Agnosticism has never registered anywhere near half of the country. It is true in most of Western Europe.

    Yup, you’re right. For the first time less that half go to church or believe in organized religion.

    I think the last figure I saw was 40% of Americans attended church, but that doesn’t mean every Sunday, I think that is for the entire year.

    So, practical atheists, like my kids and their contemporaries. But, I repeat.

    • #29
  30. DrewInWisconsin, Oik! Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oik!
    @DrewInWisconsin

    GlenEisenhardt (View Comment):

    DrewInWisconsin, Oik! (View Comment):

    I’m told we can no longer afford to be respectable.

    But then everyone here gets mad at me when I put it into practice.

    Just don’t disrespect people on your side who don’t score points or keep their word.

    Wait. Why should I respect people who don’t keep their word?

    • #30
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