Sen. Tom Cotton Hits the Right Chord on Ukraine

 

It’s been interesting to hear pundits argue various interpretations and strategies about the situation between Ukraine and Russia. For sure, no serious person thinks the U.S. should go to war with Russia over Ukraine. Bolstering the U.S. and NATO presence near Russia’s border (think Poland and the Baltic countries of Estonia, Latvia, and Lithuania) is another matter, along with helping Ukraine defend itself. Those efforts are underway, albeit belatedly.

On one end, you have former President George W. Bush and Sen. Marco Rubio adviser Max Boot. He’s now a Washington Post columnist and a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. Boot thinks we should supply Ukraine’s army and, when it loses to Russia, support a guerrilla war not unlike “Charlie Wilson’s War” in Soviet-occupied Afghanistan.

Don’t underestimate Ukraine’s willingness to fight Russia. After all, it has a long and not very pleasant history with its bad neighbors, starting with the Holodomor, where Soviet dictator Josef Stalin literally starved almost as many millions of Ukrainians from 1932-33 as German dictator Adolf Hitler exterminated Jews during World War II. And remember that Chernobyl, the worst nuclear disaster in world history thanks to the Soviets, is located in northern Ukraine. Memories are long. Maybe Ukraine could offer Russian troops a chance to encamp there for the winter.

NATO bases in Eastern Europe

On the other hand, you have Fox News host Tucker Carlson, who is strictly neutral and practically noninterventionist, a classic libertarian position. He strikes some as sympathetic to Russian President Vladimir Putin, which frankly isn’t fair. After all, Ukraine isn’t part of NATO (or likely to be anytime soon), and the U.S. arguably has no vital interests in the region — just moral issues, like respecting the territorial integrity of a democratic republic. He thinks all our attention on Ukraine is driving Putin into Chinese President Xi Jinping’s ever-loving Poohlike hands. He’s been there for a while now.

Where’s Richard Nixon when you need him?

But U.S. Senator Tom Cotton, R-Ark., an Afghan war veteran and national security expert, beautifully if briefly outlined this morning on Hugh Hewitt’s morning radio show and podcast why we’re in this mess and how the U.S. should respond. Hewitt’s terrific program provides a helpful transcript of their key interviews. This one is worth your time.

Senator Cotton: Why has Vladimir Putin stationed 135,000 troops on Ukraine’s border? What he’s been saying for the last two months as a pretext, it’s red herrings. He says that he cannot tolerate Ukraine in NATO. Well, Ukraine’s not in NATO. Ukraine doesn’t have a plan to join NATO. No NATO leaders have said they want Ukraine in NATO in any kind of immediate or medium-term fashion. He said he can’t tolerate large scale military exercises in Ukraine. Well, we don’t have large scale military exercises in Ukraine. It’s like what we do in our NATO ally such as Poland. We have a few advisors there from time to time, but we have those in countries around the world. Those are all red herrings, Hugh. The real reason that Vladimir Putin has postured these troops in Ukraine is that he wants to reassemble the greater Russian empire, not just back from the Soviet Russia days, but all the way back to the czarist days. And there cannot be a Russian empire without Ukraine, in Vladimir Putin’s mind. Second, he wants a ring of non-democratic states surrounding Russia as buffers. And third, he does not want anything like democratic or representative governments in Slavic lands like Ukraine or Belarus. The reason for that is he doesn’t want his own people to look towards a democratic government in a place like Belarus or Ukraine and think well, gosh, if it works there for them, it should work for us here in Russia. Those are the main reasons that Vladimir Putin is doing this.

But Hugh, those reasons have been the case forever. Vladimir Putin has always wanted to reassemble greater Russia. He’s always wanted buffer zones. He’s always worried about democratic movements in Russia. So what is it now that is causing him to move? Well, there are some factors that are not related to the United States like the new coalition government in Germany, or the president of France’s reelection campaign coming up. But at root, it’s that Joe Biden has appeased Vladimir Putin for a year. He’s made him think he can get away with it. First thing he did when he came into office was a no-strings-attached extension of a badly one-sided nuclear arms control treaty for Russia – Vladimir Putin’s number one priority, something that Donald Trump refused to do. Then, he waived sanctions on the NordStream2 gas pipeline into Germany, which was Vladimir Putin’s second-highest foreign policy priority. He basically looked the other way when Russia either sanctioned or at least didn’t object to the Colonial Pipeline Act. And then, of course,

Vladimir Putin saw, like the rest of the world, the debacle in Afghanistan in August. So Joe Biden’s weakness and appeasement over the last year is in no small part the reason Vladimir Putin has chosen now, not last year, not five years ago or any other time, to go for the jugular. And I think the lesson from that is we need to be much tougher right now. We need to make sure that the Ukrainian Army has the weapons it needs to defend itself. We should impose sanctions on the NordStream2 pipeline right now. We should be very clear about the kind of sanctions that Russia would face if they invade Ukraine – cutting them off from the international banking system, sanctioning their oil and gas and their minerals and mining industries. These all have to be very clear right now, because the only thing that Vladimir Putin will respond to is strength and toughness. He will not respond to appeasement and conciliation. That’s what actually has gotten us to where we are.

HH: Now Senator, when Donald Trump had rules of engagement in Syria, and little green Russian men came over the hill, they were all killed. And American troops did that, and it did not lead to an international confrontation, because Putin simply, the blade hit steel, and he withdrew. My question is should American forces be involved in any way in responding to a Russian attack, whether it is from sea or by air, or from CIA paramilitaries on the ground? If Putin rolls into [Ukraine], do you rule anything out?

TC: Hugh, we do not have a military alliance with Ukraine the way we do with NATO partners like Poland or the Baltic states. And at this point, I think it’s too late to be deploying troops to Ukraine to try to deter Vladimir Putin. However, we need to ensure that our European partners are doing everything they can to help shore up NATO’s eastern flank just as we need to cooperate with those partners to provide as much weaponry to the Ukrainian Army as we can to help protect their own territory. Now if Vladimir Putin takes steps like trying to close the Black Sea to American naval vessels, or tries to interfere with the free flow of international air travel, that’s a horse of a different color.

HH: Let me stay on Ukraine for a second, though, Senator. Ukraine’s only hope may be asymmetrical response. Have we given them the means of an asymmetrical response, for example, a land to sea cruise missile that will threaten the Russian fleet, because that inflict costs that Vladimir Putin may be unwilling to absorb?

TC: Hugh, I don’t want to speak specifically about the kind of weapons we may have provided. There’s been a lot of public reports about what we have provided and what other NATO nations have provided. I will tell you a story, though, about the time I was in Ukraine. This was in the middle of 2015. John McCain and I went to Dnipropetrovsk, as it was then called. We met with a lot of Ukrainian soldiers, in some cases, volunteer militia men who were just back from the Eastern front fighting the Russian troops in the Donbass region. And we met a burly battalion commander. He’d been a young lieutenant commanding a tank platoon in the last days of the Red Army, and he said to us. Mr. Senators, we do not need 100 Javelin missiles to blow up 100 Russian tanks. We only need 1 Javelin missile to blow up 1 Russian tank, his point being that Vladimir Putin was invading Ukraine then in part because he thought he could get away with it. And when he first took casualties, it would present him with a whole new cost calculus, and it would strike fear into the heart of every one of those other tanks. So the weapons that we provide are not necessarily going to help the Ukrainian Army defeat the Red Army, but it severely alters their cost-benefit calculus, and hopefully will cause Vladimir Putin to back down. I mean, the ultimate result we want here is a peaceable outcome in which concessions are not granted to Russia, but rather American and Western strength deters Vladimir Putin.

HH: Do you know, Senator Cotton, we’ve talked about Putin’s assets and his oligarchs’ assets before. This week, or last week, actually, one of our business accounts got blinked out a significant sum of money. Someone just hacked into the bank and took money. We’ll get it back. I’m not worried about that. But it certainly is a message that you know, take banking very seriously. Should we not be doing the same thing as a deterrent for Putin right now? I mean, now, not after he invades, but right now, going in and blinking out some of his money and his oligarchs’ money?

TC: Yes, Hugh. In fact, I’ve long argued that we should be more aggressive in trying to expose and seize the ill-gotten gains of the class of oligarchs who both benefit from and prop up Vladimir Putin’s rule. We can also take steps to expose the crimes they have committed against the Russian people by looting and pilfering the Russian state.

HH: Okay, my last question, has anything about the Biden response been other than hapless? And that is a very intentional term. They are simply hapless. They do not appear to know what they’re doing, Senator.

TC: It’s hard to think of anything, Hugh. Even when they’re taking the right steps now, those rights steps tend to be half measures, and they’re certainly much too late. You know, the time to deter Vladimir Putin was not when he added 130,000 troops to the border of Ukraine. It was three months ago before he started this buildup. More to the point, it was a year ago when Joe Biden came into office acting like so many other Democrats had for four years, like a latter day Jack Ryan in a Tom Clancy novel beating their chest about standing up to Russia. But as soon as Joe Biden took office, he reverted back to his old dovish, Cold War ways.

You know, isn’t it telling, Hugh, that the last time a Democratic president was in the White House, Vladimir Putin invaded Ukraine. Now, a Democratic president is in the White House, it appears that Vladimir Putin is preparing to invade Ukraine. But for four years, when Donald Trump was in the White House, and the Democrats were screaming Russia, Russia, Russia, surprisingly, Vladimir Putin did not invade Ukraine. That should tell you how you approach Russia and Vladimir Putin – from a position of strength and deterrence. You mentioned the killing of all those Russian paramilitaries in Syria. Remember, too, that Donald Trump killed Qasem Soleimani, somewhat out of the blue. There was not a big buildup. We got a shot and we took it, as we should have. Or when Xi Jinping was eating chocolate cake at dessert at their summit in Mar-A-Lago, and Donald Trump looked at him and said I just ordered air strikes in Syria. That’s just the kind of thing that Ronald Reagan did as well. We have to confront our adversaries from a position of strength to deter their aggression. Any kind of appeasement or conciliation simply rewards them and encourages more aggression.

HH: Senator Cotton, thank you. I know they listen. I hope they heard, and I hope they do it. Senator Tom Cotton, thank you.

For another historical perspective, I recommend futurist George Friedman, founder of Geopolitical Futures, also insightful and helpful. I don’t fully subscribe to his analysis — he suggests there will be no war. I’m not so sure, but he makes a good case. The last two paragraphs provide an interesting summary.

The Eastern European borderland lacks the ability to, as Charles de Gaulle said, at least tear an arm off. Russia cannot live with a U.S.-occupied Ukraine. The U.S. cannot live with Russia that far into Eastern Europe. Russia is not ready for a war, and the U.S. might be ready but doesn’t want it. The Russians will fight for Ukraine if terms are not reached. The Americans may fight but only through air power for the eastern borderland as it will be much cheaper now than later. The Eastern Europeans will fight, too little, too late and too disorganized. The British will be there, but I have no idea what each NATO country will do.

It is clear that there will be no war now. It is equally clear that this is the festering world of Europe. The borderlands will be perpetually contentious, and the balance of forces will shift over time, as they always do. Which way they will shift is, of course, less clear. But the old distrust between the U.S. and Russia remains, and that makes any lasting settlement impossible, because any settlement requires a degree of trust. The formation of the Intermarium alliance, which might include Belarus and Ukraine but which would exclude NATO and Russia, would work but won’t be tried. Everyone is waiting for the great powers, never believing that they might have other things to do with their time.

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  1. Dbroussa Coolidge
    Dbroussa
    @Dbroussa

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Dbroussa (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):
    The real question: What’s Tom Cotton’s agenda?

    To deter Russian expansion since it is counter to US interests. I know that neither of his son’s are working for any Russian, Chinese, Ukrainian, or any other foreign companies.

    Well they haven’t hit high school yet, it’s an unreasonable expectation.

    Hey, do you think that stopped Hunter?  

    • #31
  2. Instugator Thatcher
    Instugator
    @Instugator

    GlennAmurgis (View Comment):

    Ukraine spent a lot a money on Biden Inc and it does not seem to be paying off for them

    Xi spent more and seems to be getting his money’s worth.

    • #32
  3. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    GlennAmurgis (View Comment):

    Ukraine spent a lot a money on Biden Inc and it does not seem to be paying off for them

    Ukraine, or Burisma?

    Perhaps what’s going on is the Ukrainian crooks who are in with the Bidens don’t want to be replaced by the crooks who are in with Putin, and Biden plans on spending American blood and treasure to prop up his crooks.

    • #33
  4. Zafar Member
    Zafar
    @Zafar

    Dbroussa (View Comment):

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Dbroussa (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):
    The real question: What’s Tom Cotton’s agenda?

    To deter Russian expansion since it is counter to US interests. I know that neither of his son’s are working for any Russian, Chinese, Ukrainian, or any other foreign companies.

    Well they haven’t hit high school yet, it’s an unreasonable expectation.

    Hey, do you think that stopped Hunter?

    When he was ten years old? You tell me. 

    • #34
  5. MiMac Thatcher
    MiMac
    @MiMac

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Kelly D Johnston: Ukraine doesn’t have a plan to join NATO.

    Oh; really?

    Ukraine’s president Volodymyr Zelensky said Monday he wanted some “specifics” on whether his country can join NATO.

    “We have an ongoing war and it’s proof if we are ready to join,” he said in an interview with The Associated Press and other foreign news agencies.

    And:

    Kelly D Johnston: No NATO leaders have said they want Ukraine in NATO in any kind of immediate or medium-term fashion.

    Not exactly true.

    While the NYT Fourth Branch of the US Government’s official publication is now saying

    If Ukraine were a NATO member, the alliance would be obligated to defend it against Russia and other adversaries. U.S. officials say they will not appease President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia by undermining a policy enshrined in NATO’s original 1949 treaty that grants any European nation the right to ask to join.

    “Together, the United States and our NATO allies made clear we will not slam the door shut on NATO’s open door policy — a policy that has always been central to the NATO alliance,” Wendy R. Sherman, the deputy secretary of state, said on Wednesday.

    But France and Germany have in the past opposed Ukraine’s inclusion, and other European members are wary — a deal breaker for an alliance that grants membership only by unanimous consent. American and Russian leaders know this. With Russian troops amassed on Ukraine’s eastern border, some current and former American and European officials say Mr. Putin might just be raising the NATO issue as a pretext for an invasion.

    What NATO has to say is:

    • In June 2017, the Ukrainian Parliament adopted legislation reinstating membership in NATO as a strategic foreign and security policy objective. In 2019, a corresponding amendment to Ukraine’s Constitution entered into force.
    • In September 2020, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy approved Ukraine’s new National Security Strategy, which provides for the development of the distinctive partnership with NATO with the aim of membership in NATO.

    And the Atlantic Council (remember them from Trumpeachment? and their ties to Kerry, Biden, and others?)

    In a recent interview with Axios on HBO, Ukraine’s President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said he would like to ask US President Joe Biden, “Why is Ukraine still not in NATO?”

    President Zelenskyy’s question generated a lot of debate and ended up reaching a wide audience. Ever since, Ukrainian journalists have been asking me, “So why is Ukraine still not in NATO?” As I answered this question for the third or fourth time, I realized how satisfied I actually was with the way this discussion is evolving.

    Why, indeed, is Ukraine not in NATO?

    Courtesy of Matt Bracken:

     

    The real question: What’s Tom Cotton’s agenda?

    Protecting the USA.

    • #35
  6. Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patriot) Member
    Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patriot)
    @ArizonaPatriot

    MiMac (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Kelly D Johnston: Ukraine doesn’t have a plan to join NATO.

    Oh; really?

    Ukraine’s president Volodymyr Zelensky said Monday he wanted some “specifics” on whether his country can join NATO.

    “We have an ongoing war and it’s proof if we are ready to join,” he said in an interview with The Associated Press and other foreign news agencies.

    And:

    Kelly D Johnston: No NATO leaders have said they want Ukraine in NATO in any kind of immediate or medium-term fashion.

    Not exactly true.

    While the NYT Fourth Branch of the US Government’s official publication is now saying

    If Ukraine were a NATO member, the alliance would be obligated to defend it against Russia and other adversaries. U.S. officials say they will not appease President Vladimir V. Putin of Russia by undermining a policy enshrined in NATO’s original 1949 treaty that grants any European nation the right to ask to join.

    “Together, the United States and our NATO allies made clear we will not slam the door shut on NATO’s open door policy — a policy that has always been central to the NATO alliance,” Wendy R. Sherman, the deputy secretary of state, said on Wednesday.

    But France and Germany have in the past opposed Ukraine’s inclusion, and other European members are wary — a deal breaker for an alliance that grants membership only by unanimous consent. American and Russian leaders know this. With Russian troops amassed on Ukraine’s eastern border, some current and former American and European officials say Mr. Putin might just be raising the NATO issue as a pretext for an invasion.

    What NATO has to say is:

    • In June 2017, the Ukrainian Parliament adopted legislation reinstating membership in NATO as a strategic foreign and security policy objective. In 2019, a corresponding amendment to Ukraine’s Constitution entered into force.
    • In September 2020, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy approved Ukraine’s new National Security Strategy, which provides for the development of the distinctive partnership with NATO with the aim of membership in NATO.

    And the Atlantic Council (remember them from Trumpeachment? and their ties to Kerry, Biden, and others?)

    In a recent interview with Axios on HBO, Ukraine’s President Volodymyr Zelenskyy said he would like to ask US President Joe Biden, “Why is Ukraine still not in NATO?”

    President Zelenskyy’s question generated a lot of debate and ended up reaching a wide audience. Ever since, Ukrainian journalists have been asking me, “So why is Ukraine still not in NATO?” As I answered this question for the third or fourth time, I realized how satisfied I actually was with the way this discussion is evolving.

    Why, indeed, is Ukraine not in NATO?

    Courtesy of Matt Bracken:

     

    The real question: What’s Tom Cotton’s agenda?

    Protecting the USA.

    I don’t see how anything Cotton proposes protects us.   It puts us at risk to protect others, I think.

    • #36
  7. Zafar Member
    Zafar
    @Zafar

    It keeps Russia edgy which keeps the EU edgy which keeps the US central.

    • #37
  8. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    MiMac (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    The real question: What’s Tom Cotton’s agenda?

    Protecting the USA.

    Sorry, I can’t apply that description to anyone who is backed by the Club for Growth and supported TPP. That makes me suspect that his areas of opposition to the tranzi progs make him part of the controlled opposition. With the significant exceptions of immigration and abortion, Cotton tends to vote with the globalists and the Fourth Branch. The Fourth Branch is not motivated by protecting the same USA that elected Tom Cotton. 

    My best guess is that the prog foreign policy and defense policy are set by the Obama machine. They are strong supporters of the Marine Corpses. And the Army, Navy, and Air Force corpses. They hate the actual warfighters and want to see them dead (along with the “white supremacists” who like and support them, and from whose ranks they are disproportionately drawn—and the race traitors adjacent to the white supremacists who have been seduced by that rhetoric.)

    For the progs, wars are a means to several ends:

    • the old school (and bipartisan) enrichment of self, friends and family

    • busting the defense budget and attriting personnel and materiel (Cloward Piven writ large, with the added fillip that the top Pentagon ranks are heavily woke and hostile to the brand of military in which Sen. Cotton served;) see under “hate them and want them dead and/or ruined.)

    • killing off and embittering the remaining warfighters in order to replace them with the Woke and divert military readiness funding to “infrastructure,” the “Green military” and social justice. Failed operations are fantastic for that in the long run, while providing graft from the military-industrial complex in the short run.

     

    • #38
  9. Chris O Coolidge
    Chris O
    @ChrisO

    Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… (View Comment):

    Ukraine’s problems with their neighbors did not start with the Holodomor. They go back at least as far as a Mongol invasion in the 13th Century.

    As usual, the history is complicated. At the time, both Kiev and Moscow were part of the Kievan Rus. This is one of the reasons that the Russians also fear foreign invasion, and want buffer zones.

    The Russian core territory lacks natural defenses.

    We faced the same problem. We solved it through conquest.

    Hmm, except the original states are all bordered by the Appalachians, which proved a formidable barrier just for crossing. Once we expanded west of those, there was the Mississippi River; west again, the Rockies, the Sierra Nevadas, etc.

    I don’t think you meant we expanded chasing some elusive defense, but your wording makes it sound so.

    • #39
  10. Hang On Member
    Hang On
    @HangOn

    Chris O (View Comment):

    Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… (View Comment):

    Ukraine’s problems with their neighbors did not start with the Holodomor. They go back at least as far as a Mongol invasion in the 13th Century.

    As usual, the history is complicated. At the time, both Kiev and Moscow were part of the Kievan Rus. This is one of the reasons that the Russians also fear foreign invasion, and want buffer zones.

    The Russian core territory lacks natural defenses.

    We faced the same problem. We solved it through conquest.

    Hmm, except the original states are all bordered by the Appalachians, which proved a formidable barrier just for crossing. Once we expanded west of those, there was the Mississippi River; west again, the Rockies, the Sierra Nevadas, etc.

    I don’t think you meant we expanded chasing some elusive defense, but your wording makes it sound so.

    We very much expanded with defense in mind. That’s what Manifest Destiny is about in part. It was with an idea of keeping European powers out and Mexico down. We purchased land from France. We tried pushing the British out of Canada and failed. The Lewis and Clark Expedition. Wars with Mexico and purchase of land with a desert buffer. France takes over Mexico and we push back. The Civil War and policy to keep France and Britain from meddling with the Russian navy’s help. The purchase of Alaska from Russia pushing Russia out of North America. Taking Hawaii to keep Europeans from having a naval base so close to us. 

    • #40
  11. Chris O Coolidge
    Chris O
    @ChrisO

    Kelly D Johnston: On the other hand, you have Fox News host Tucker Carlson, who is strictly neutral and practically noninterventionist, a classic libertarian position.

    It is also the classic realist position. I’m not in that camp (I don’t think), but there is a point to be made: does it serve our interests to get involved? I cannot see that it does beyond the restraining of an illiberal Russia. Actually, the realists might consider that a good reason for involvement. Maybe so.

    Putin, Xi, et. al. constantly promote imaginary and exaggerated conflicts, partly to increase their standing with the public, and also to distract their citizens from their every day circumstances, something needed particularly when things are not well. Do I believe Putin intends/intended this one to go hot? Yes. The use of arms to expand territory is a notion worthy of our attention and our efforts to prevent. Do we go so far as opposing him militarily?

    Also, if we keep him out of Ukraine, what happens next? I suspect he won’t accept it and will continue to focus efforts there. Still, keeping his attention there and his forces out of there is a useful thing. We know what he’s after and we know where. Now we have to consider the man. If he does annex or otherwise subjugate Ukraine, does he repeat this elsewhere? If so, is it better to stop him now? How much of this is fueled by Putin/Russia’s distrust of the West?

    If the Baltic nations were any priority, they’d already be gone. Russia’s bizarre landing craft incursion into Danish territorial waters is a mystery, and the Scandinavian countries are showing their concern with more than words. He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Even so, and even with the lessons of 1938, I’m unsure. I do think the West could restrain him with sanctions, etc., but the current leadership doesn’t have the will to do it. If Putin/Russia continues to act as it currently does, the next situation will likely be more difficult and more dangerous…and more necessary. I pray we don’t get there.

    • #41
  12. Instugator Thatcher
    Instugator
    @Instugator

    Chris O (View Comment):
    Also, if we keep him out of Ukraine, what happens next? I suspect he won’t accept it and will continue to focus efforts there. 

    He is kept out of Ukraine, what does he do next?

    A couple of things come to mind – Loss of Ukraine, does not mean that he loses Crimea – so he can focus more attention there.

    Continue his disruption of Georgia.

    Demand a more robust access corridor to Kaliningrad.

    Lots of ways he can continue to disrupt things.

    It would be better for him if he focused on exploiting the territory he already has as opposed to taking it from others.

    Remember, Russia is the largest country in the world.

    • #42
  13. Chris O Coolidge
    Chris O
    @ChrisO

    Instugator (View Comment):
    Remember, Russia is the largest country in the world.

    With natural resources the envy of the world in Siberia, however, as one expert put it:

    The Siberian dilemma is that, while Siberia has more natural wealth than any other place in the world, it also has unequaled disadvantages of cold and remoteness.

    Don’t misunderstand, I know there are plenty of things that can or will happen “next,” I mentioned a few possibilities. I like your thoughts on it as well. Well, I don’t like as in enjoy them, but you know what I mean.

    • #43
  14. The Reticulator Member
    The Reticulator
    @TheReticulator

    Chris O (View Comment):

    Jerry Giordano (Arizona Patrio… (View Comment):

    Ukraine’s problems with their neighbors did not start with the Holodomor. They go back at least as far as a Mongol invasion in the 13th Century.

    As usual, the history is complicated. At the time, both Kiev and Moscow were part of the Kievan Rus. This is one of the reasons that the Russians also fear foreign invasion, and want buffer zones.

    The Russian core territory lacks natural defenses.

    We faced the same problem. We solved it through conquest.

    Hmm, except the original states are all bordered by the Appalachians, which proved a formidable barrier just for crossing. Once we expanded west of those, there was the Mississippi River; west again, the Rockies, the Sierra Nevadas, etc.

    I don’t think you meant we expanded chasing some elusive defense, but your wording makes it sound so.

    George Washington and others had a very justified concern that the Americans who were settling across the Appalachians would not have strong loyalty to the United States (which just barely existed then) and could easily ally with some other power, such as Spain, which would constrain and could even be a threat to the United States. In fact, some of the settlers did ally with Spain, and a few high officials even conspired together with Spain. But their loyalties to Spain weren’t very strong, either, and we “conquered” those territories to remove any threat of that happening, and also to keep our own country’s options for expansion open. Motives and actions were mixed.  

    • #44
  15. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    Chris O (View Comment):

    Instugator (View Comment):
    Remember, Russia is the largest country in the world.

    With natural resources the envy of the world in Siberia, however, as one expert put it:

    The Siberian dilemma is that, while Siberia has more natural wealth than any other place in the world, it also has unequaled disadvantages of cold and remoteness.

    Not to mention that the portion of Siberia in the Russian Far East borders China and North Korea, and that to the west, there’s a long border with Mongolia . . . and that Mongolia’s southern border is with. . . China.

    • #45
  16. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    Chris O (View Comment):
    He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Yes, indeed, we should project American force to protect Poland’s and Ukraine’s borders, just like we do with our own southern border.

    • #46
  17. Zafar Member
    Zafar
    @Zafar

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Chris O (View Comment):
    He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Yes, indeed, we should project American force to protect Poland’s and Ukraine’s borders, just like we do with our own southern border.

    For Russia (and perhaps Ukraine) it’s arguably existential.  For the US, not.

    • #47
  18. philo Member
    philo
    @philo

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Chris O (View Comment):
    He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Yes, indeed, we should project American force to protect Poland’s and Ukraine’s borders, just like we do with our own southern border.

    For Russia (and perhaps Ukraine) it’s arguably existential. For the US, not.

    By the modern definition…most recently popularized by the local NT crowd…everything is existential here.

    • #48
  19. Zafar Member
    Zafar
    @Zafar

    philo (View Comment):

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Chris O (View Comment):
    He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Yes, indeed, we should project American force to protect Poland’s and Ukraine’s borders, just like we do with our own southern border.

    For Russia (and perhaps Ukraine) it’s arguably existential. For the US, not.

    By the modern definition…most recently popularized by the local NT crowd…everything is existential here.

    To be fair we hear that about progressives and the 2024 elections too.

    • #49
  20. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Chris O (View Comment):
    He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Yes, indeed, we should project American force to protect Poland’s and Ukraine’s borders, just like we do with our own southern border.

    For Russia (and perhaps Ukraine) it’s arguably existential. For the US, not.

    Security of the US southern border is not existential for the US?

    • #50
  21. Zafar Member
    Zafar
    @Zafar

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Chris O (View Comment):
    He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Yes, indeed, we should project American force to protect Poland’s and Ukraine’s borders, just like we do with our own southern border.

    For Russia (and perhaps Ukraine) it’s arguably existential. For the US, not.

    Security of the US southern border is not existential for the US?

    Sure, but the security of Ukraine’s border isn’t. 

    • #51
  22. Ontheleftcoast Inactive
    Ontheleftcoast
    @Ontheleftcoast

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Zafar (View Comment):

    Ontheleftcoast (View Comment):

    Chris O (View Comment):
    He is also flooding Poland with refugees from the Middle East, an overt attempt at destabilization. Any way and any direction we look, Putin/Russia is a bad actor.

    Yes, indeed, we should project American force to protect Poland’s and Ukraine’s borders, just like we do with our own southern border.

    For Russia (and perhaps Ukraine) it’s arguably existential. For the US, not.

    Security of the US southern border is not existential for the US?

    Sure, but the security of Ukraine’s border isn’t.

    Absolutely right.

    • #52
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