Biden Might Rescind Vaccine Mandate. It’s Still Bad.

 

President Joe Biden and his communist handlers have hinted that they would rescind their “mandate” for even federal employees to be vaccinated. Many people might be hollering “Yippee! Yahoo!” Not me.

They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they did. They proved to everyone that they could force us to get vaccinated, and companies across this country would scrape and bow and enforce their distinctly un-American dictates.

This was an escalation of the “Dear Colleague letter” that former President Barack Obama’s administration sent out, requiring by unofficial correspondence that universities establish kangaroo courts to persecute men who are accused of assault by (mostly) politically inspired women. We are learning that our institutions, our employers, and our fellow countrymen no longer share our American values that laws should be enacted by due process, even if not by legislation.

The Republican Party needs to campaign on this. The GOP needs the people to understand it. We need to change this. We need to make it a cause of action to sue in court when someone issues such a threatening mandate, and when someone obeys such a threatening mandate.

I doubt the party will. The GOP is probably wondering how it can use that tactic.

Published in Law
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  1. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    Skyler: They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about.  It was about wielding power, and they did.  They proved to everyone that they could force us to get vaccinated, and companies across this country would scrape and bow and enforce their distinctly unamerican dictates.

    Well, I guess that’s one way to look at it. But here is what I think is a more accurate description of what happened:

    They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about.  It was about wielding power, and they tried.  They tried to force everyone to get vaccinated, and some people complied, but so many people across so many industries and demographics pushed back, so many law suits were filed, so many judgments went against them, and the public backlash against their abuse of authority was so great, that they backed down. They caved in. They discovered that the nation wasn’t having it.

    Frankly, I think that’s what really happened.

     

    • #1
  2. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Skyler: They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they did. They proved to everyone that they could force us to get vaccinated, and companies across this country would scrape and bow and enforce their distinctly unamerican dictates.

    Well, I guess that’s one way to look at it. But here is what I think is a more accurate description of what happened:

    They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they tried. They tried to force everyone to get vaccinated, and some people complied, but so many people across so many industries and demographics pushed back, so many law suits were filed, so many judgments went against them, and the public backlash against their abuse of authority was so great, that they backed down. They caved in. They discovered that the nation wasn’t having it.

    Frankly, I think that’s what really happened.

    Perhaps our first major victory against the Biden regime.

     

    • #2
  3. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge
    Fake John/Jane Galt
    @FakeJohnJaneGalt

    doesn’t really matter if the force the mandate or not.  Everybody I know have been forced to get vaccinated and to present that info to their employers to maintain their job.  In the end they exercised government power without law.
    also they have now broke HIPPA.  Effectively any company can require you to turn over your medical history so they can assess risk.  It is now established government supported pratice.

    • #3
  4. Captain French Moderator
    Captain French
    @AlFrench

    Oregon has its own vaccine mandate for health care workers and public employees. I haven’t seen any evidence of Kate (the least popular governor in the country) backing down.

    • #4
  5. kedavis Member
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Captain French (View Comment):

    Oregon has its own vaccine mandate for health care workers and public employees. I haven’t seen any evidence of Kate (the least popular governor in the country) backing down.

    Some would argue that states have that kind of power while the federal government doesn’t.  But I think it’s still BS.

    • #5
  6. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):
    Everybody I know have been forced to get vaccinated….

    And yet so many people resisted that the administration is backing down.

    I know quite a few people who are not vaccinated. Some are self-employed, others are just too valuable to fire, others are working for employers who keep threatening but haven’t taken action. Now that a federal judge has suspended mandatory vaccines in 19 10 [corrected] states and President* Brandon is caving in, I suspect quite a few of those employers will quietly relax their own mandates.

    This is a victory. But maybe it’s a glass-half-full thing.

    • #6
  7. kedavis Member
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):
    Everybody I know have been forced to get vaccinated….

    And yet so many people resisted that the administration is backing down.

    I know quite a few people who are not vaccinated. Some are self-employed, others are just too valuable to fire, others are working for employers who keep threatening but haven’t taken action. Now that a federal judge has suspended mandatory vaccines in 19 states and President* Brandon is caving in, I suspect quite a few of those employers will quietly relax their own mandates.

    This is a victory. But maybe it’s a glass-half-full thing.

    The too-valuable-to-fire may only exist in rather small businesses.  Larger businesses get pretty easily wrapped up in bureaucracy, regulation…

    In my programming days even though the places I worked for were on the smaller side, they always seemed to be convinced that they could easily hire someone else to replace me.  They didn’t realize how wrong they were, until I was gone.  They’d end up with people who couldn’t even comprehend what I had left behind, much less be able to produce anything of similar sophistication themselves.

    One time that happened, I had gone from working for an end-user company to working for the company they bought their system from.  I wound up still supporting their software – that I had written – from the supplier company, because the people they tried to replace me with couldn’t code their way out of a wet paper bag.  The main difference was they were paying a lot more for my work.

    • #7
  8. Henry Racette Member
    Henry Racette
    @HenryRacette

    kedavis (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):
    Everybody I know have been forced to get vaccinated….

    And yet so many people resisted that the administration is backing down.

    I know quite a few people who are not vaccinated. Some are self-employed, others are just too valuable to fire, others are working for employers who keep threatening but haven’t taken action. Now that a federal judge has suspended mandatory vaccines in 19 states and President* Brandon is caving in, I suspect quite a few of those employers will quietly relax their own mandates.

    This is a victory. But maybe it’s a glass-half-full thing.

    The too-valuable-to-fire may only exist in rather small businesses. Larger businesses get pretty easily wrapped up in bureaucracy, regulation…

    In my programming days even though the places I worked for were on the smaller side, they always seemed to be convinced that they could easily hire someone else to replace me. They didn’t realize how wrong they were, until I was gone. They’d end up with people who couldn’t even comprehend what I had left behind, much less be able to produce anything of similar sophistication themselves.

    One time that happened, I had gone from working for an end-user company to working for the company they bought their system from. I wound up still supporting their software – that I had written – from the supplier company, because the people they tried to replace me with couldn’t code their way out of a wet paper bag. The main difference was they were paying a lot more for my work.

    Yes, you’re right about the too-valuable-to-fire point: that’s rarely true, and very rarely in big companies — and never absolutely true.

    But I know at least one big company that is dragging its feet, because too many of its young medical technicians are unvaccinated and digging in their heels. I assume it’s because they know it’s going to hurt to lose several valuable people in this job market. Maybe, if the administration kept the pressure on, they’d eventually get around to sacking a bunch of people and living with the consequences.

    But the administration is losing this fight.

    • #8
  9. James Lileks Contributor
    James Lileks
    @jameslileks

    Wielding power? Eh. Maybe.  I think they thought it would be popular,  and would show they cared, and were decisive in that stirring “West Wing” TV show style. They’re shallow people of middling intelligence who live in a culture where optics are supreme and “doing a government thing” plays to the worldview of their media stenographers. 

    • #9
  10. kedavis Member
    kedavis
    @kedavis

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Yes, you’re right about the too-valuable-to-fire point: that’s rarely true, and very rarely in big companies — and never absolutely true.

    In terms of “absolutely true,” maybe not.  Maybe if they’d waited 10 or 15 or 20 years (this was the early 80s) they could have found someone in India or China who could do what I did; but they didn’t have the option to wait that long, nor were they likely to have had the access to labor pools in India or China, especially since those same people would have been sought by much larger companies and even the respective governments.

     

    But I know at least one big company that is dragging its feet, because too many of its young medical technicians are unvaccinated and digging in their heels. I assume it’s because they know it’s going to hurt to lose several valuable people in this job market. Maybe, if the administration kept the pressure on, they’d eventually get around to sacking a bunch of people and living with the consequences.

    Or dying (in business terms) with the consequences.

    • #10
  11. E. Kent Golding Member
    E. Kent Golding
    @EKentGolding

    Captain French (View Comment):

    Oregon has its own vaccine mandate for health care workers and public employees. I haven’t seen any evidence of Kate (the least popular governor in the country) backing down.

    I have compassion for the people of Oregon who vote against tyrannical democrats,  but the democrats are going to win no matter what.   Maybe it is time they moved?  I am leaving Michigan when I leave my current employer or my current employer leaves me.

    • #11
  12. CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill Coolidge
    CarolJoy, Not So Easy To Kill
    @CarolJoy

    It is most likely that Biden realizes that there are at least 12 to 15 states setting things up to require vaccine passports. The state of Washington is calling for the passports as I type this.

    The governor of Massachusetts is planning on this  as well, noting that other states’ governors have indicated they are willing to join him. We all know what actions  Gov Newsom of Calif will be taking.

    So he no longer needs to sit tight and dictate an unpopular mandate, as it appears many states will be  doing this on their own.

     

    • #12
  13. Buckpasser Member
    Buckpasser
    @Buckpasser

    Pres. Brandon Bidenstan now knows that he can make business’ and private organizations do whatever he says.  Mandates, “show me your papers”…..I mean passports, requirements for entering restaurants etc.  Watch what happens now that the deadline for armed forces being vaccinated is up.

    • #13
  14. Steven Seward Member
    Steven Seward
    @StevenSeward

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Yes, you’re right about the too-valuable-to-fire point: that’s rarely true, and very rarely in big companies — and never absolutely true.

    But I know at least one big company that is dragging its feet, because too many of its young medical technicians are unvaccinated and digging in their heels. I assume it’s because they know it’s going to hurt to lose several valuable people in this job market. Maybe, if the administration kept the pressure on, they’d eventually get around to sacking a bunch of people and living with the consequences.

    But the administration is losing this fight.

    My wife works for the third largest hospital system which is the 31st largest employer in Ohio.  Despite the fact that they have supported the Black Lives Matter movement and put in diversity officers and LGTB promoters, and proudly boasted of transgender surgeries, etc…, -they have held off on vaccine mandates for their employees.  On the other hand they have just instituted a vaccine mandate for flu shots!

    • #14
  15. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    They’re considering rescinding mandates for federal employees. While that’s an awful lot of people, there were already federal employees that weren’t being required to be vaxxed. Postal workers, for example. Employees at the CDC for some curious reason. I’m pretty sure nobody on Capitol Hill was required either.

    But even though OSHA has pulled back, because the government has threatened businesses with enormous fines, businesses are going forward with it. Especially hospitals.

    Really, all that was ever needed was the threat. Biden’s puppet masters probably knew this was unconstitutional from the start, but figured that a nice threat would be enough to get compliance.

    The question I have, now, is whether the pause in the federal push gives employees more grounds to sue employers who try to force the issue.

    • #15
  16. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Steven Seward (View Comment):
    My wife works for the third largest hospital system which is the 31st largest employer in Ohio.  Despite the fact that they have supported the Black Lives Matter movement and put in diversity officers and LGTB promoters, and proudly boasted of transgender surgeries, etc…, -they have held off on vaccine mandates for their employees.  On the other hand they have just instituted a vaccine mandate for flu shots!

    Just make sure it’s really a flu shot and they’re not secretly jabbing them with the WuFlu shot!

    My co-worker’s daughter will be fired from Mayo by the end of the year if she doesn’t comply. She already had COVID, and then had a very bad reaction to the first shot, and doesn’t want the second one. (She didn’t even want the first, and didn’t need it either.) Her doctor will not sign a waiver for her.

    • #16
  17. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    I think it is important to stick to principles when arguing against the vaccine mandates. We are arguing with people who thought the “individual mandate” in the ObamaCare and RomneyCare health insurance reform laws were morally justified. We should have said that the individual mandate amounted to a tax on a person’s life itself. A person is born with it. 

    There are so many principles worth upholding in the arguments to be made against forced vaccination. 

    For starters, it is forced if you cannot have gainful employment without it. When the choice is homelessness for you or your family if you don’t get the vaccine, that’s about as forceful as life gets. It is morally wrong and unacceptable for any government to force any medical procedure or medicine on its citizens. 

     Second, every person has a sovereign authority over his or her body. That’s why hospitals need someone’s permission to do anything. 

    We have to argue the case on principles, not specifics related to the vaccines. 

    • #17
  18. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    MarciN (View Comment):

    I think it is important to stick to principles when arguing against the vaccine mandates. We are arguing with people who thought the “individual mandate” in the ObamaCare and RomneyCare health insurance reform laws were morally justified. We should have said that the individual mandate amounted to a tax on a person’s life itself. A person is born with it.

    There are so many principles worth upholding in the arguments to be made against forced vaccination.

    For starters, it is forced if you cannot have gainful employment without it. When the choice is homelessness for you or your family if you don’t get the vaccine, that’s about as forceful as life gets. It is morally wrong and unacceptable for any government to force any medical procedure or medicine on its citizens.

    Second, every person has a sovereign authority over his or her body. That’s why hospitals need someone’s permission to do anything.

    We have to argue the case on principles, not specifics related to the vaccines.

    I think we have been all along.

    That the vaccine is also killing people is just a bonus argument.

    • #18
  19. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    I also wish someone would find the clips from the election debates in which both Harris and Biden complained about the vaccines developed under Operation Warp Speed and said they would not take them because they didn’t have confidence in them.

    I would love to run those clips 24 hours a day on CNN. Should the government have forced them to be vaccinated at that point in their understanding of and confidence in the vaccines? How about if their unvaccinated status disqualified them from running for office and serving if elected? How about if those statements got them barred and banned from Twitter and Facebook and every other public square where opinions are expressed?

    • #19
  20. MarciN Member
    MarciN
    @MarciN

    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf (View Comment):

    MarciN (View Comment):

    I think it is important to stick to principles when arguing against the vaccine mandates. We are arguing with people who thought the “individual mandate” in the ObamaCare and RomneyCare health insurance reform laws were morally justified. We should have said that the individual mandate amounted to a tax on a person’s life itself. A person is born with it.

    There are so many principles worth upholding in the arguments to be made against forced vaccination.

    For starters, it is forced if you cannot have gainful employment without it. When the choice is homelessness for you or your family if you don’t get the vaccine, that’s about as forceful as life gets. It is morally wrong and unacceptable for any government to force any medical procedure or medicine on its citizens.

    Second, every person has a sovereign authority over his or her body. That’s why hospitals need someone’s permission to do anything.

    We have to argue the case on principles, not specifics related to the vaccines.

    I think we have been all along.

    That the vaccine is also killing people is just a bonus argument.

    I don’t get out much. The arguments I’ve seen on Ricochet and Townhall tend to revolve around the vaccines themselves. 

    Good to hear. :-) 

    • #20
  21. Stina Member
    Stina
    @CM

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Skyler: They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they did. They proved to everyone that they could force us to get vaccinated, and companies across this country would scrape and bow and enforce their distinctly unamerican dictates.

    Well, I guess that’s one way to look at it. But here is what I think is a more accurate description of what happened:

    They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they tried. They tried to force everyone to get vaccinated, and some people complied, but so many people across so many industries and demographics pushed back, so many law suits were filed, so many judgments went against them, and the public backlash against their abuse of authority was so great, that they backed down. They caved in. They discovered that the nation wasn’t having it.

    Frankly, I think that’s what really happened.

     

    Tried? They didn’t try. They succeeded. So many people who didn’t want the Pfizer or modern, who were trying to wait for a few years, who wanted to utilize other options, WERE forced at threat of losing their jobs.

    Jobs were lost. People complied for a 12/8 deadline that never arrived.

    Biden never had to actually defend his mandate in court. Simply the threat of the courts upholding it or the threat of fighting the government in court over non compliance was enough to cause people to make a decision that would have preferred to do differently.

    THAT IS TYRANNY. Just because they figured out how to do it with plausible deniability and in a technically legal way does not diminish what they actually accomplished.

    • #21
  22. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Stina (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Skyler: They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they did. They proved to everyone that they could force us to get vaccinated, and companies across this country would scrape and bow and enforce their distinctly unamerican dictates.

    Well, I guess that’s one way to look at it. But here is what I think is a more accurate description of what happened:

    They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they tried. They tried to force everyone to get vaccinated, and some people complied, but so many people across so many industries and demographics pushed back, so many law suits were filed, so many judgments went against them, and the public backlash against their abuse of authority was so great, that they backed down. They caved in. They discovered that the nation wasn’t having it.

    Frankly, I think that’s what really happened.

    Tried? They didn’t try. They succeeded. So many people who didn’t want the Pfizer or modern, who were trying to wait for a few years, who wanted to utilize other options, WERE forced at threat of losing their jobs.

    Jobs were lost. People complied for a 12/8 deadline that never arrived.

    Biden never had to actually defend his mandate in court. Simply the threat of the courts upholding it or the threat of fighting the government in court over non compliance was enough to cause people to make a decision that would have preferred to do differently.

    THAT IS TYRANNY. Just because they figured out how to do it with plausible deniability and in a technically legal way does not diminish what they actually accomplished.

    Absolutely. They knew that if they made the threat, businesses would comply out of fear, and they could get private business to what they knew they constitutionally could not. (This has become a regular tactic with this administration.) 

    • #22
  23. Fake John/Jane Galt Coolidge
    Fake John/Jane Galt
    @FakeJohnJaneGalt

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):
    Everybody I know have been forced to get vaccinated….

    And yet so many people resisted that the administration is backing down.

    I know quite a few people who are not vaccinated. Some are self-employed, others are just too valuable to fire, others are working for employers who keep threatening but haven’t taken action. Now that a federal judge has suspended mandatory vaccines in 19 10 [corrected] states and President* Brandon is caving in, I suspect quite a few of those employers will quietly relax their own mandates.

    This is a victory. But maybe it’s a glass-half-full thing.

    Backed down how?   They got what they wanted.  So what they stopped after achieving their goal.  Most people do.

    • #23
  24. Seawriter Contributor
    Seawriter
    @Seawriter

    Well, I work for a Federal contractor. When they asked my vaccine status I told them to take a hike. 

    They they told me they would fire me if I did not give it. I told them the government could make no constructive use of the at information, and  they did not deserve to get it.

    Most recently they have told me if I do not prove I am vaccinated they will have to fire me. I told them to let me know what my last day was.

    They have not yet. They may eventually. Regardless, I don’t think the Brandon Administration has been very successful in forcing me to get vaccinated.

    • #24
  25. Seawriter Contributor
    Seawriter
    @Seawriter

    E. Kent Golding (View Comment):
    I am leaving Michigan when I leave my current employer or my current employer leaves me.

    I was born and raised in Michigan. Came to Texas in 1979. It was like being home for the first time in my life. I have been here ever since. Yeah, it’s hot in the summers, but it’s still a great place. The Rivendell of the United States. Consider coming down here.

    • #25
  26. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    Seawriter (View Comment):

    Well, I work for a Federal contractor. When they asked my vaccine status I told them to take a hike.

    They they told me they would fire me if I did not give it. I told them the government could make no constructive use of the at information, and they did not deserve to get it.

    Most recently they have told me if I do not prove I am vaccinated they will have to fire me. I told them to let me know what my last day was.

    They have not yet. They may eventually. Regardless, I don’t think the Brandon Administration has been very successful in forcing me to get vaccinated.

    They don’t really understand Americans down there in Washington.

    • #26
  27. cdor Member
    cdor
    @cdor

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Skyler: They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they did. They proved to everyone that they could force us to get vaccinated, and companies across this country would scrape and bow and enforce their distinctly unamerican dictates.

    Well, I guess that’s one way to look at it. But here is what I think is a more accurate description of what happened:

    They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they tried. They tried to force everyone to get vaccinated, and some people complied, but so many people across so many industries and demographics pushed back, so many law suits were filed, so many judgments went against them, and the public backlash against their abuse of authority was so great, that they backed down. They caved in. They discovered that the nation wasn’t having it.

    Frankly, I think that’s what really happened.

     

    Exactly, Henry. Do we know that progressives (actually they are, in fact, regressive) are intolerant and totalitarian in nature? Well, yes we do. But, this is still the USA, and we are still Americans. So what happened with Obama’s “Dear Colleague” request? Trump was elected and he rejected that action. What is happening to Biden’s mandatory vaccinations? People are electing conservatives who are challenging and winning against the mandates in court. Thus the Biden gang is being forced to backtrack. Eventually, the progressives will win, but it will take more time and their victory will be bittersweet because they will only win after destroying everything we have built, and thus they will win nothing. 

    • #27
  28. DrewInWisconsin, Oaf Member
    DrewInWisconsin, Oaf
    @DrewInWisconsin

    cdor (View Comment):
    What is happening to Biden’s mandatory vaccinations? People are electing conservatives who are challenging and winning against the mandates in court.

    Is that actually happening? I haven’t heard much about these mandates being taken to court.

    • #28
  29. cdor Member
    cdor
    @cdor

    Fake John/Jane Galt (View Comment):

    doesn’t really matter if the force the mandate or not. Everybody I know have been forced to get vaccinated and to present that info to their employers to maintain their job. In the end they exercised government power without law.
    also they have now broke HIPPA. Effectively any company can require you to turn over your medical history so they can assess risk. It is now established government supported pratice.

    I believe this is an overstep and the pendulum will swing back once people realize how much freedom they have relinquished.

    • #29
  30. Richard Easton Coolidge
    Richard Easton
    @RichardEaston

    Stina (View Comment):

    Henry Racette (View Comment):

    Skyler: They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they did. They proved to everyone that they could force us to get vaccinated, and companies across this country would scrape and bow and enforce their distinctly unamerican dictates.

    Well, I guess that’s one way to look at it. But here is what I think is a more accurate description of what happened:

    They don’t really care if you get vaccinated, and that was never what this was about. It was about wielding power, and they tried. They tried to force everyone to get vaccinated, and some people complied, but so many people across so many industries and demographics pushed back, so many law suits were filed, so many judgments went against them, and the public backlash against their abuse of authority was so great, that they backed down. They caved in. They discovered that the nation wasn’t having it.

    Frankly, I think that’s what really happened.

     

    Tried? They didn’t try. They succeeded. So many people who didn’t want the Pfizer or modern, who were trying to wait for a few years, who wanted to utilize other options, WERE forced at threat of losing their jobs.

    Jobs were lost. People complied for a 12/8 deadline that never arrived.

    Biden never had to actually defend his mandate in court. Simply the threat of the courts upholding it or the threat of fighting the government in court over non compliance was enough to cause people to make a decision that would have preferred to do differently.

    THAT IS TYRANNY. Just because they figured out how to do it with plausible deniability and in a technically legal way does not diminish what they actually accomplished.

    Where are the NTers who are denouncing this?????

    • #30
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