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Want to Increase Vaccination Rates? Let the Virus Do Its Thing
Louisiana “boasts” one of the lowest vaccination rates in the country, and as a result, the latest Delta COVID surge is hitting the state harder than high-vaccination states. It’s quite clear from local hospital’s reporting on the surge who are seeing the brunt of the impact: the unvaccinated. According to the latest numbers released, 239 unvaccinated patients are hospitalized, compared to just 32 vaccinated.
The question for healthcare workers and policymakers is “How can we convince the reluctant to get vaccinated?” And the answer may be simply: Let the virus do its thing. Let the apprehensive see with their own eyes what happens when you choose to stay unvaccinated. Watch your neighbors spend twelve days on a ventilator (mine just did) and let word of mouth scare people out of their apprehensions and fears. According to a recent study, these are the most common reasons why Americans are staying unvaccinated:
If you’re seeing dozens of your friends, colleagues, neighbors, and friends fall ill, most of the above reasoning falls to the wayside.
As I mentioned previously, I have a neighbor who recently spent weeks hospitalized, twelve days on a ventilator. We have several mutual friends in common who aren’t vaccinated. All of those individuals are now more concerned about getting sick than getting sick from the shot. They’re more concerned about what twelve days on a ventilator will do to them long-term than what the shot will do to them long-term.
This anecdotal hunch on a key driver of vaccination moving forward seems to be true in Louisiana, where it was reported last week,
On Monday, Louisiana reported one of its largest vaccination surges in months.
According to the Louisiana Department of Health, 84,271 additional doses of the vaccine were administered since Thursday. That’s even higher than last weekend, when the state reported 65,589 additional shots in an identical timeframe. Louisiana reported 56,110 doses over the weekend of Aug. 1.
About 61 percent of the shots given this past weekend were administered in people getting their first dose of the vaccine.
Across the country and the world, there are governments responding to any small or large COVID spike with increased lockdowns, mask mandates, and more. Recently in the New York Times, I wrote about why this is the wrong strategy in a post-vaccine world. But here’s another reason why mitigation efforts are the wrong call: Perhaps driving down the virus is also driving down the best motivator for vaccination.
Published in General
I agree. The vaccine is widely available. Open things up, forget lockdowns, forget masks. Those who wish to avoid getting sick know how to do it. It’s on them if they fail to take notice.
There are two CDC charts that tell the story in numbers. Total covid cases by age group and total deaths by age group. Ages 18-64 account for 73.9% of cases but only 20.5% of deaths. On the other hand those aged 65+ account for only 13.1% of cases but a whopping 79.4% of deaths. In my bracket (40-49), only 0.3% of cases result in death.
Considering this, if I were under 50 (and I am) then I would want to wait on the vaccine until it’s better vetted. If I were over 65, though, I would be beating down the door for a vaccine and any boosters I could get.
I should clarify my earlier comment (29): I love having had the vaccine. I’m trying to get the third dose. I think it is an achievement of modern science.
I’m just frustrated that the companies aren’t treating people with respect and simply explaining and addressing their concerns specifically. With the biochemistry. Americans can handle it.
Based on the CDC charts the correct policy is clear:
Get old people vaccinated now.
Get people with underlying conditions vaccinated now.
No restrictions on kids or schools or anyone else.
Continue testing and refining the vaccines for everyone else.
Continue testing and refining treatments.
Stop lying to people and scaring people.
Above all stop using covid as an excuse to indulge authoritarian and corrupt impulses.
A year ago, a 20-something in my area got Covid. She got the sniffles and was sent to a jam packed hospital…….along with camera crews from all the local affiliates.
A month ago, an acquaintance who is a college athlete got the vaccine as she was forced to. She then spent weeks on life support and her life will now be spent lying in a bed due to permanent heart damage………no camera crews and no mention of it.
I just don’t trust experts anymore. Send me all the cute little charts and graphs you want. I just look at the source of them and shake my head. Many more have died and suffered from hysteria than from the actual illness.
I haven’t been on Rico much the past 18 mos. Its been due to garbage like this OP and thread. Same old crap from the same old crap farmers. This post offered nothing new and neither have the following posts.
I don’t know which is responsible for more suffering and death, but I do know that we have suffered from the hysteria. Even the CDC numbers do not support such hysterical and arbitrary responses as we’ve been treated to.
As usual Carol you greatly overstate the rate of side effects and incorrectly interpret the efficacy data:
The vaccination rate for hospitalized COVID patients in Israel is 60%- but as you see below the vaccines still maintain high efficacy vs severe disease in the Israeli data:
https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/israeli-data-how-can-efficacy-vs-severe-disease-be-strong-when-60-of-hospitalized-are-vaccinated
Not true- the mRNA vaccines do NOT require the use of fetal cell lines for development. They did use cells derived form the HEK 293 cell line for safety testing as they are a standard safety testing measure. I would have preferred they did not- but imagine the anti-vaxxers hysteria if a standard safety test was omitted in the development of the mRNA vaccines- as it is the anti-vaxxers fraudulent claims are bad enough.
Antibody titer is only a small part of the immunity equation. There is data that the vaccine provides better immunity vs variants than does infection and that the vaccine may provide longer lasting immunity. There is good data that shows the vaccines provide durable cellular based immunity (ie non antibody) that is also effective against variants:
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.23.457229v1
The medical center I am affiliated is in a similar situation- typically >90% of the COVID patients are unvaccinated and we are now exceeding our COVID census from last winter. We are starting to transfer out COVID patients b/c of capacity limitations. The ER is full of patients awaiting bed availability and they are on the verge on limiting elective surgery- a very painful move financially.
I didn’t say development. You say yourself testing. That is the connection to the abortion industry. It is not a fraudulent claim. There is nothing anti-vax in this position – you are the one who sounds hyterical.
Meanwhile, we’re told that booster shots are needed. I’ve read studies supporting the opposite point of view.
https://youtu.be/G0ZZJXw4MTA
1) You must not have read the tweet you posted- it said “Fetal-cell lines played a vital role in the development of all three vaccines”. So you absolutely implicated abortion derived cells in the development of the vaccines- why else post a tweet unless you think it supports your point and adds some measure of authority?
2) I assume you meant hysterical not hyterical . Hysterical? What is hysterical about pointing out inaccuracies in a calm manner? Thou protests too much….
Mimac, I’m not sure what you’re getting at. The mRNA vaccines didn’t require the use of fetal cell lines, but they did use them anyway. Is testing part if development? I’d sat it is.
My understanding is that the J&J actually used fetal cell lines for production too.
Point being, the connection to abortion is real. You’re coming out with a strange mix of pedantry (the meaning of “development”) and confusion (who said anything about not testing?).
The connection to evil is different (in Catholic moral philosophy-that is the main source of concern about abortion derived cell lines & the vaccines) for the mRNA vs the J&J vaccines. There was a very good series of articles at The Public Discourse about many of the issues (links below). The best “go to guys” on these issues are Fr Tadeusz Pacholczyk (Catholic priest &PhD in neuroscience from Yale, post doc work at Harvard on stem cells) and Rev Nicanor Pier Giorgio Austriaco (PhD in Biology MIT and Catholic priest). I can barely spell, much less pronounce their names-but Fr Tad has been on top of these issues for years. The NCBC is a good source for bioethics that isn’t a shill for big science- I am a proud supporter of them and find them to be a rare blend of solid ethics provided by people who (like Fr Tad) have a real knowledge of the science involved.
https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2020/11/72866/
https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2020/05/63752/
https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2020/05/63447/
https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2020/11/72753/
https://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2020/10/72350/
addendum- another good source on bioethics (from the Catholic perspective) is Carter Sneed from Notre Dame. He was the legal counsel to the Bush administration’s Presidential Commission on Bioethics (itself a star studded cast) and has a good book out on bioethics- What it Means to be Human. I swear I get no royalties from my endorsements :(.
Yet there is still that connection to evil – the abortion industry. If we Catholics can’t take a stand against evil, who will. I’ll stand with my bishop Joseph Strickland and never take one of these abortion tainted vaccines. You have the free will to do so if you wish – good luck with that.
Thank you, Pelagius or perhaps Donatus. But I disagree. You should read some of the articles to appreciate the debate- you clearly have not b/c it would take much longer than the time it took you to reply. They are thoughtful treatments of the moral difficulties Christians face- we are called by our Lord to be “as wise as serpents and as harmless as doves”. Wisdom takes work.
Mimac, so much condescension. Why? Reading 20 or even 100 articles will not change the heart of the debate on that particular question. Fruit of the poisoned tree; one doesn’t need the expertise of a Fr Tad to make a moral judgement on that matter. Yes I believe there’s a point where making a pragmatic decision regardless of the moral judgement may be a reasonable course, but we should be on guard and not squander our moral judgement so lightly that we disregard the moral dimensions over something like civid which the CDC’s own numbers show is not particularly deadly for most people.
I apologize if I seemed condescending-but the matter is much more complicated than it is being portrayed- that is why I listed the articles at The Public Discourse. Several of them outline the issues involved. If you read the articles, you will see we all have participation in evil on a regular basis in a similar manner to that of the mRNA vaccines. That is why I said the use of cells derived from the HEK 293 cell line were used in performing “standard” safety tests. In other words, many other things we all have used were also tested in the same manner (hence my allusion to Pelagius &/or Donatus). And many of those items are much less important than a vaccine. The fruit of the poisoned tree has already been consumed we therefore have the burden of making prudential judgements- to do so we need to seek knowledge & therefore we need to consult people such as Fr Tad et al- otherwise we are easily mislead (and become prideful in our own decision making in matters we have little to no understanding of). A wise and faithful guide is critical at certain points. Read some of the articles, they are a good resource by people of faith & scientific knowledge. You need not agree with them, but failure to engage their precepts will almost certainly serve you poorly in your decision making.
Way to turn it ad hominem.
What makes you think I haven’t read these articles and others? I have read all this stuff and still conscientiously object to the jab.
I have been vaxxed for a set of reasons I may share later. My concern at this time is to protect the rights of those who object to being vaxxed for any number of reasons, conscience being one of them.
Let’s assume that non-vaxxers are a minority. Do we have the courage to protect them from the predations of the powerful?
I think there is a similar fault line on the controversy of mandatory masking.
I don’t actually think the matter is complicated. There are strong pulls to rationalization of course. That doesn’t make it complicated.
That we have already consumed the fruit of this tree whether knowingly or unknowingly is also not a complication. It’s a reminder that moral hazard is a real hazard no matter how we justify ignoring it. Because by ignoring it we enable its continuance.
Is it formal cooperation with evil? Or is it material cooperation? Is it mediate or remote or proximate? Or is it remote mediate material cooperation that has conditions that make it tolerable ? Therefore is the vaccine licit or not? Is the HEK 293 cell line even certain to be from an abortion? Can’t answer such questions without educating yourself. And since, as Bernard of Clairvaux said “He who makes himself his own teacher, makes himself a madman’s student”, you will need some guidance- as I suggested a good place to start is those articles and places like the NCBC.
As I said, there are strong pulls to rationalization. That doesn’t make it complicated. Being reasonable doesn’t make something moral either.
As Scott asked: why do you think I haven’t learned about any of the fundamental issues? Were cells derived from aborted fetuses used in some way or not? My reading has suggested that the answer is yes, in various ways and degrees, for all of the big three. If that is true, the rest is rationalization. There might be a situation where such rationalization begins to make moral sense or where we can rank moral considerations as they compete against one another (perhaps for those older than 65), but covid is not such a situation for most of us.
We should demand that drug makers start using non-abortion-derived cells to achieve the same testing, development, and production purposes. Motive and means makes a huge moral difference.
Every day, in some city or town in the Northern Hemisphere, another union stands up for its members and stands steadfast against a vaccine program that proves more dangerous every day.
Plus the other facet of the program – what is the point? People should stop to think about this: since it is happening even in societies like Iceland’s and Israel’s where over 90% of the citizenry has been COVID vaxxed, yet COVID “break through cases” are occurring, along with the “scariants,” then just what the hell is the point?
This is the most recent union to stand up against having an all risk, paltry in benefit vax program:
Since vaccines of all types are also responsible for a huge uptick in miscarriages, we perhaps should also encourage indie researchers to show the Big Pharma firms exactly why Jonas Salk always emphasized that no pregnant woman should ever be vaxxed.
Any proof of such a wild assertion? As usual you are posting bogus anti-vax nonsense- but there is a real risk to pregnant women who are unvaxxed. In Birmingham Ala there are 39 pregnant women hospitalized with COVID- at present 7 on ventilators- most not vaccinated. Nearly all of the pregnant women hospitalized due to COVID have delivered preterm- 2 pregnant women have died from COVID @ UAB & 9 have lost their babies(MedPage Today). COVID in pregnancy was associated with increased mortality, need for intubation, and ICU admissions (JAMA Aug 11, 2021).
no responsible medical authority thinks the COVID vax causes miscarriages- the vax doesn’t cross the placenta-
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/uk-review-finds-covid-19-shots-do-not-raise-risk-miscarriage-2021-08-16/
https://coronavirus.utah.gov/are-covid-19-vaccines-linked-to-infertility-or-miscarriage/
the miscarriage rate post vaccine is the same as it is in the general population.
Don’t you have some PR spin to start writing for yr next press conference or press release? For which you are very well paid.
Again wild, unverified accusations with no basis in facts-you need another page in the playbook. Virtually every dollar I have made in my career is for direct patient care. I was paid additional amounts to be the chief executive officer of a medical group with about 23 providers. I do limited teaching for a local medical school for no reimbursement. I have never been paid for writing nor endorsements. I post here to combat incorrect medical claims- you note I never endorse mandates nor lockdowns- those are mainly political decisions with little medical data to base them on. I post when people make inaccurate claims about vaccines, masks etc- my goal is to ensure that readers can make decisions based on accurate data.
addendum- perhaps I am taking this wrong- rather than an accusation of financial interest perhaps you are insinuating that I am doing too good a job defending vaccines and therefore must be a paid agent of big pharma. Not so- but if any big pharma agents are reading this I can’t be bought but I can be rented ;).[nb- TIC]