"We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Large-scale, deadly sectarian violence has broken out between Muslims and Coptic Christians in Cairo for the second time since the February toppling of Hosni Mubarak.
Hundreds of Muslims -- some of whom were apparently Salafists, or extremist Islamists -- descended on the Saint Mina Church in the Cairo suburb of Imbaba yesterday (Saturday), demanding that the Christians within hand over a woman they claimed had converted to Islam and was being held against her will. (If that sounds familiar, it should; the kidnapped convert accusation has been used several times before by Egyptian Islamists as a pretext to attack a church.) The Christians, who had been tipped off that Muslims were on their way and spoiling for a fight, had already assembled a group numbering in the hundreds to defend the church.
The clash quickly devolved into mayhem. Men attacked each other hand-to-hand with knives, clubs and bricks. Both sides began firing guns. Muslims threw firebombs into the church. As the hours passed, they are reported to have moved through the neighborhood, torching homes, storming apartment complexes and looting businesses owned by Copts.
Reports differ on how long it took the security authorities to arrive, but a wave of soldiers and police eventually appeared, shooting rounds into the air and firing teargas at the crowds. About 200 people were arrested. When the dust settled, at least six Christians and at least five Muslims were dead and about 230 wounded, 65 of them shot, according to the Interior Ministry. Both the Saint Mina Church and the nearby Virgin Mary Church had been set alight and severely damaged.
Hundreds of heavily armed soldiers and riot police are still in the neighborhood, and security has been stepped up at other Christian houses of worship. The entire Imbaba neighborhood has been cordoned off. Interim PM Essam Sharaf canceled a trip to the Persian Gulf to preside over an emergency meeting of the cabinet. Justice Minister Abdel Aziz Al Gindi said in response to the strife that Egypt has become "a nation in danger," and promised that the authorities will use an "iron hand" to protect national security. The military council has called on "all communities in Egypt, the youth of the revolution, the national forces and Islamic and Christian scholars to stand like a wall against any attempt by the forces of evil and darkness to tear the national fabric."
The Sheikh of Al-Azhar -- identified by the New York Times as "Egypt’s most respected Muslim religious authority" -- denounced the violence, and the Grand Mufti of Egypt Ali Gomaa, another senior Muslim figure, urged calm. "All Egyptians must stand shoulder to shoulder and prevent strife," he said, adding that it was up to the military council to take action to protect national security.
Some members of the Christian community have lost faith in the military to protect them, with some voicing the suspicion that its members are not only ineffective but actively on the side of the Muslims. The Bishop of Giza, Anba Theodosius, is quoted in AINA as saying, "We have no law or security, we are in a jungle." Copts are said to be staging a sit-in outside the US embassy in Cairo in the hope of gaining international protection, and Al-Jazeera reports that several thousand Copts have gathered in front of Egyptian state television, demanding the resignation of the country's military ruler.
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Jun '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
This is a shocking, but unsurprising, development. So long as the fundamentalist strains of Islamism exist, there will be Islam, and "the other" (Jews, Christians, and anyone else who is not them). The future Egypt could be a scary place to live in and to its neighbor Israel.
Judith, I worry about Israel, but I worry just as much about individual Israelis like you and your family.
If the United States is going to jump into Libya to protect civilians, I think it's about time the current administration let's Egypt's leaders (whoever they are) know that murdering minorities will result in consequences other than muttering the word "unacceptable."
We also need to make it clear that attacks on Israel are the same as attacks on the U.S. Then America needs to be ready to back it up.
Jan '11
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Judith Levy
Large-scale, deadly sectarian violence has broken out between Muslims and Coptic Christians in Cairo for the second time since the February toppling of Hosni Mubarak.
Right, let's all pretend that defending yourselves against an armed mob is the moral equivalent of being an armed mob. And that this just kinda happened ("has broken out"?!?) with nobody actually to blame for starting it.
I'm not exactly surprised; they've been playing the moral-equivalence game with Israelis and Palestinians for most of my adult life. But I am tired of deciphering the code.
I do not expect that America will do one single thing to protect either Middle Eastern Christians or Israel before January 2013. Will there be any Egyptian Christians left by then? Probably; Hitler found it impossible to kill or drive out all the Jews in Germany (about 8% of the population in 1933) until the Nazis got really efficient.
The greatest hope for the Christians of Egypt is not America (in the short run anyway) but the inefficiency of the Egyptian administration.
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Horrifying--and exactly what we all feared might develop. The worst appears to be happening.
Jun '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Faces of the Coptic Church
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvypI4naU_U
Nov '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Tabula Rasa and Ms. Ball are exactly right. There is no chance that the administration will do anything to help the Christians (or any other non-Moslem minority) in Egypt or elsewhere.
And, Israel will be abandoned at the first occasion, regardless of what we have promised in years gone by. The world began anew, in Mr. Obama's view, if not at his birth then certainly upon his inauguration.
Israel can now look only to its own strength and interests and would be foolish to risk its existence upon the expectation that the US will abide by the commitments we made in treaties any earlier or agreements.
Jul '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
I saw a blurb about this on the MSN homepage this morning, so I Googled "muslims burn churches". This, in top to bottom order, is what I got:
"Indonesia Muslims Burn Churches, Homes..." 2008
"Muslim extremists have burned at least a dozen churches in Ethiopia..." March, 2011
"Muslims burn protestant church in Algeria..."January, 2010
"Muslims burn fourth church in Malaysia..." January, 2010
"Nigeria: Tension in Kaduna as irate Muslims burn churches, police station..."
Finally, it got to the current Egyptian massacre.
The West remains mute. Imagine the hysteria in the Muslim world if someone burned, say, a Koran, in America. Oh, wait...
Aug '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Do Muslims recognise Christian Martyrs? Do they recognise anyone, or are we all just infidels? Will the Middle-Eastern newspapers tomorrow be full of self-flagellation and self-loathing like so much of the Western European press has been over the demise of a murderous fiend? I suspect not.
Jul '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
New policy: An attack on One Christian is an attack on All Christians. Let's act accordingly.
Aug '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvypI4naU_U · May 8 at 2:56pm
Very moving. I didn't know Copts used Greek in their liturgy. Do you know what we can do to help these people?
Edited on May 8, 2011 at 5:56pmMar '11
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Kenneth: I saw a blurb about this on the MSN homepage this morning, so I Googled "muslims burn churches". This, in top to bottom order, is what I got:
"Indonesia Muslims Burn Churches, Homes..." 2008
"Muslim extremists have burned at least a dozen churches in Ethiopia..." March, 2011
"Muslims burn protestant church in Algeria..."January, 2010
"Muslims burn fourth church in Malaysia..." January, 2010
"Nigeria: Tension in Kaduna as irate Muslims burn churches, police station..."
Finally, it got to the current Egyptian massacre.
The West remains mute. Imagine the hysteria in the Muslim world if someone burned, say, a Koran, in America. Oh, wait... · May 8 at 4:14pm
Wow, Kenneth, I am so sad to see just how right you are....ugh...
May '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Ah, more atrocities in the Moderate Muslim Nation (TM) of Egypt.
Various Moderate Muslim Spokespersons will soon appear on TV, lecturing us on how Islam is a Religion of Peace and the violence in Egypt is (1) the work of a tiny extremist minority that misunderstands Islam, and (2) is an understandable reaction to provocations by vicious Christians.
We will be expected to forget that evil propaganda demonizing Christians and Jews is daily fare in Egypt, and that "literature" like the Protocols of the Elders of Zion is a perennial best-seller (not to mention a sometime TV mini series.)
I am tired of Muslims telling us that Islam is a peaceful religion. I will start believing in a "moderate Islam" when Muslims stop giving mere lip service to tolerance and instead rise up to fight for the freedom and dignity of non-Muslims. Until then, well....
Sep '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
For tonight's Divine Mercy Chaplet I've added the Coptic Christians.
May '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Liberals everywhere will react to this atrocity by lecturing their neighbors on the need to wipe out "islamophobia".
May '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
One last comment:
"Muslims threw firebombs into the church."
If they really believed that Muslims were being held captive in the church, they would not have firebombed it. As usual, everything they say is a lie (except when they promise to rape, rob, and murder.)
Feb '11
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Margaret Ball
Judith Levy
Large-scale, deadly sectarian violence has broken out between Muslims and Coptic Christians in Cairo for the second time since the February toppling of Hosni Mubarak.
Right, let's all pretend that defending yourselves against an armed mob is the moral equivalent of being an armed mob. And that this just kinda happened ("has broken out"?!?) with nobody actually to blame for starting it.
I'm not exactly surprised; they've been playing the moral-equivalence game with Israelis and Palestinians for most of my adult life. But I am tired of deciphering the code.
I do not expect that America will do one single thing to protect either Middle Eastern Christians or Israel before January 2013. · May 8 at 2:52pm
Hear hear! I was about to write quite the same thing. The expression "violence has broken out between" is rarely even close to accurate. Certainly not when its about minorities and majorities.
(I saw something someplace yesterday that referred to "the new Egyptian democracy." I was in the middle of something and let it get past me.)
May '11
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
That is all very sad, but I will say that at least the Coptic Christians stood up and defended themselves, they did not just roll over and die like Christians, it too often seems, are expected to do.
Cheers!
Aug '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
Here is a website called Free Copts. I don't know if anyone will find it helpful.
My cursory googlings have turned up no charity that aids these people, only calls to lobby the US government to change its policy towards Egypt. I'm not wild about charity efforts that revolve around lobbying, and wish there was something else I could do.
Besides pray.
The Wikipedia article on Copts is here.
Feb '11
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
On the cover of today's Wall St. Journal -at least the edition I get -- is a heartbreaking picture and caption. It shows 2 young girls crying inside a ruined church. The caption is, VALE OF TEARS: "Two Christians cry Sunday inside the Coptic Church of the Virgin Mary, set ablaze in a clash with radical Islamists."
I cut the pix out, scanned it and will keep it as a reminder to myself what's really going on over there -- not that I don't get frequent reminders here on Ricochet and elsewhere. Just depressing what Christians in some part of the world are enduring at the hands of ...well, you know who.
Oct '10
Re: "We Are In a Jungle:" Churches in Cairo Attacked; Twelve Dead, 230 Injured
It's telling that, in Egypt at least, the 'clashes between Copts and Muslims' always end up with a churches and Coptic homes being burned. I never hear about mosques or Muslim homes being damaged.
I wouldn't be surprised if Muslim Egyptians think the reporting is biased, because it doesn't focus enough on what the Copts have done, this time, to deserve this treatment.