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As the news of Mubarak's resignation jerked and stuttered over Al Jazeera--the Internet didn't stream fluidly--my father recalled those lines from Henry IV. 

His first thought was that every president, prime minister or monarch whose rule is tainted by the faintest hint of illegitimacy will sleep poorly tonight.

But then it occurred to us both to wonder whether this is truly the psychological makeup of dictators. Was Shakespeare right? Or is it in fact the temperament of men who rule as Mubarak did to persuade themselves, until the very end, that they are beloved? 

Has Mubarak been lying uneasy for thirty years, fearing this moment? Or did this come as a complete surprise?

I wonder. 

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Jonathan Matthew Gilbert
Joined
Jul '10
Jonathan Matthew Gilbert

I think it was a surprise to him--he's been living out the stages of grief over the past two weeks in full public view and I don't think anyone who really thought this was possible would have moved so slowly through those stages when the evidence of where things were headed was so readily apparent. I see him (and most dictators) as closer to Macbeth than Henry IV personally; they are typically men whose alternating self-doubts and egotism obscure their sense of reality so completely that they entirely miss the moment when their power ceases to be absolute and begins to wane. 

Ajax Telamônios
Joined
Jan '11
Ajax Telamônios

Was Shakespeare right? Or is it in fact the temperament of men who rule as Mubarak did to persuade themselves, until the very end, that they are beloved? 

Has Mubarak been lying uneasy for thirty years, fearing this moment? Or did this come as a complete surprise?  

Yes.

Capt. Aubrey
Joined
Sep '10
Capt. Aubrey

I'm always amazed at how easy it is for people of a certain age and means to become utterly detached from the day to day reality of the people around them. I know an old fellow who lives in a gated community and spends most of his time at private clubs being waited on. He doesn't interact with young people much at all and yet I bet he is far less isolated and insulated than Mubarak was from the people around him. Since it does not appear that he's gone completely insane, like Saddam, I suspect this has shocked him and that he actually believed that he stood alone between Eqypt and Chaos. I sure hope he was wrong.

Its interesting that we never hear anyone talk about what might have happened in Iraq if we hadn't intervened since seems obvious to me that Saddam went utterly out of his mind well before we invaded.

Sisyphus
Joined
Jul '10
Sisyphus

Ajax Telamônios

Was Shakespeare right? Or is it in fact the temperament of men who rule as Mubarak did to persuade themselves, until the very end, that they are beloved? 

Has Mubarak been lying uneasy for thirty years, fearing this moment? Or did this come as a complete surprise?  

Yes. · Feb 12 at 3:26am

Ajax stole my answer.

Ajax Telamônios
Joined
Jan '11
Ajax Telamônios
Its interesting that we never hear anyone talk about what might have happened in Iraq if we hadn't intervened since seems obvious to me that Saddam went utterly out of his mind well before we invaded.

Stalin was no paradigm of sanity, and neither is Kim Jong Il, yet they both managed/have managed to hang around for quite some time.

Neither was King George III, come to think of it.  Maybe we shouldn't have intervened then, either, and instead just waited to see what happened.

Edited on Feb 12, 2011 at 5:28am
Joseph Eagar
Joined
Oct '10
Joseph Eagar

Dictators almost have to convince themselves  they're beloved, at least Western-supported ones.

No one knows how a modern constitutional state works.  It's almost hilarious to read development papers on this topic; or it would be if it weren't so damaging.  I think that's why so many attempts at nation building fail.  

We ask these people to create a constitutional order out of thin air, which they have no clue how to do.  Carbon-copying a Western system doesn't work, as so much of a nation's constitution is unwritten and based on national consensus.

These people are almost guaranteed to fail.  If we want to spread democracy, the Iraqi method is the only way to do it: forcibly occupy a nation until an acceptable constitutional consensus emerges.

Joseph Eagar
Joined
Oct '10
Joseph Eagar

Not that I'm in favor of invading more countries, heh.  But I think we're going to see more of that, possibly even on Obama's watch.  Northern Mexico comes to mind, unless the Mexican government somehow manages to regain control.

~Paules
Joined
Jun '10
~Paules

 Monomania seems to be a common characteristic of dictators.  In such cases the object of the mania is oneself (aka narcissism).  Such people tend to attract a coterie of sycophants and toadies who understand that their flattery will be rewarded.  It seems to me that it's the members of this group who suffer the sleepless nights.  The dictator sleeps well enough until the day he wakes up and finds himself abandoned and alone in his palace.  History informs us that the pattern is repetitive.

Which brings us to the current occupant of the White House.  Some of the reports leaked from W.H. insiders speak of a president who is increasing self-centered and detached from reality.  Well, what a surprise.  Any wonder why his inner circle is abandoning him for greener pastures?  I suppose some of them just want to sleep at night.

Fortunately, our Founding Fathers rigged a system of checks and balances.  Sixty-three seats lost in the mid-terms would indicate that Americans are on to the scam.  I'm more sanguine about conservative prospects for 2012 than most.  The guy in the White House can't get lucky forever.          

KC Mulville
Joined
Jan '11
KC Mulville
Joseph Eagar: Not that I'm in favor of invading more countries, heh.  But I think we're going to see more of that, possibly even on Obama's watch.  Northern Mexico comes to mind, unless the Mexican government somehow manages to regain control. · Feb 12 at 5:33am

I can't help thinking of "The Mouse That Roared," where Mexico deliberately invades us in the hopes that we'll impose order and bestow immediate, universal healthcare.

Kennedy Smith
Joined
May '10
Kennedy Smith

 Doesn't everyone in power have a taint of illegitimacy?  Or at least something iffy that can be exploited by opposition?

As to the mind of those who clig on a bit too long, I am reminded of the guy who tried to break Maggie's record as PM.

Foxman
Joined
Dec '10
Foxman

 "... and bestow immediate, universal healthcare."

I think they already have that.

flownover
Joined
Aug '10
flownover

Ever consider that this guy was mere window dressing for a military that shot his predecessor as he sat nearby ? The military didn't effect a coup, that's probably coming from Clueless Clapper. They made a timing error, got things turned around in 18 days, and got some new blood in there with their other guy ,Suleiman. I bet they that got Saudi to cover the other $1.8 billion that is at risk from the US ( huh?) State Dept. Please inform us about Algeria today as they go into the streets. And what is your opinion of the possible thoughts in Turkish military minds right now ? Slapping down Batum is small beer.

Claire Berlinski, Ed.
flownover:  Please inform us about Algeria today as they go into the streets. And what is your opinion of the possible thoughts in Turkish military minds right now ? Slapping down Batum is small beer. · Feb 12 at 7:09am

Algeria's next: Al Jazeera's decided. You can tell by the way they're pumping the coverage. 

LowcountryJoe
Joined
Jan '11
LowcountryJoe

 An article featured on my Yahoo! page estimates that Mubarak and his family have an estimated wealth of 40-70 billion dollars.  One can buy an awful lot of goons to protect oneself for that kind of money...and then sleep tight!  Most dictators understand that if 15% of a population can be bought off or enriched, the 85% percent can be kept in-line through other means.


Joined
Feb '11
Leith

I think not only is the temperament of the dictator to be considered, but also the nature of the power groups that had enabled the dictator. In Egypt, two groups come to mind, the military and the secret police. Once the hated secret police began terrorizing the Egyptian people that group weakened both the dictator and his selected replacement. Alternately, the military recognized the citizens’ right to protest and supported that right by not interfering and using force against the protesters and this won them  the support of the citizens as a candidate for taking charge of the transition.  As a result, the military was strengthened because these events shifted power away from the dictator to them. So if it is true that the Pentagon has strong ties to the Egyptian military then it would seem that Mr. Gates, not Mrs. Clinton or President Obama had the better understanding of the power dynamic which involved the dictator's temperament and his supporters that was being fought  out in Egypt.

Andrea Ryan
Joined
May '10
Andrea Ryan

If these dictators are secure in who they are why do they build their giant security apparatus?


Joined
Feb '11
Leith

 Andrea Ryan  "If these dictators are secure in who they are why do they build their giant security apparatus?"

to secure and maintain power.

Andrea Ryan
Joined
May '10
Andrea Ryan

Leith:  Andrea Ryan  "If these dictators are secure in who they are why do they build their giant security apparatus?"

to secure and maintain power. · Feb 12 at 8:36am

My point.


Joined
Feb '11
Leith

 Andrea Ryan,"My point"

If I understand your point, then "these dictators" are insure personalities from the get-go? Or is it something else?

Andrea Ryan
Joined
May '10
Andrea Ryan

Leith:  Andrea Ryan,"My point"

If I understand your point, then "these dictators" are insure personalities from the get-go? Or is it something else? · Feb 12 at 8:49am

Yes.  It means there's a significant element of insecurity (paranoia?), because they know their charm and good looks won't permanently secure their authority.  I agree completely with ~Paules' assessment.


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