Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Here's a fascinating point about how Republicans talk about immigration from a Newsweek interview with New Mexico Gov. Susana Martinez, who's been mentioned on one occasion or another as a potential Vice Presidential nominee:
As we sit down at a local Starbucks, I ask about immigration. It’s a topic she has been reluctant to discuss since winning the Republican primary in 2010, so what comes next is surprising: a battle plan that contradicts nearly everything the GOP has been doing and saying since 2007, Romney’s “self-deportation” strategy included. “‘Self-deport?’ What the heck does that mean?” Martinez snaps. “I have no doubt Hispanics have been alienated during this campaign. But now there’s an opportunity for Gov. Romney to have a sincere conversation about what we can do and why.”
Naturally, Martinez has some suggestions. First, Republicans should remind Latinos that Obama pledged to pass comprehensive immigration reform by the end of his initial year in office, but “didn’t even have the courage to try.” Next, the GOP should outflank the president--on the left--by proposing its own comprehensive plan. “I absolutely advocate for comprehensive immigration reform,” Martinez says, , sipping a caramel macchiato. “Republicans want to be tough and say, ‘Illegals, you’re gone.’ But the answer is a lot more complex than that.” Martinez envisions an approach “with multiple levels”: increased border security; deportation for criminals; a guest-worker program for people who want “to go freely back and forth across the border to work”; a DREAM Act-style pathway to citizenship, through the military or college, for children brought here illegally by their parents; and a visa (coupled with a “penalty” or a “tagback”) that allows rest of the illegal population to remain in the U.S. while they follow standard naturalization procedures.
Martinez’s point is not that Republicans should peddle so-called “amnesty.” In New Mexico, she’s taken a lot of heat from Latinos for repeatedly pushing to repeal a state law that allows illegal immigrants to obtain driver’s licenses; she also opposes a standalone DREAM Act, arguing that politicians can’t “fix [immigration] by saying, ‘Here’s the DREAM Act and we’re done. It has to be part of a larger plan.” She simply believes that a more pragmatic approach will help Republicans in the long run, particularly if it’s paired with the sort of issues-based appeal that inspired her to switch parties and a more aggressive campaign to recruit Hispanic candidates for local office. Maybe then the GOP can finally do what she did in her first statewide contest: approach the magic 40-percent mark among Latino voters. That alone would be enough to swing a presidential election.
“We’ve got to stop with the rhetoric,” Martinez says on her way out of Starbucks. “I’m so tired of the rhetoric. ‘Lower taxes,’ you know. ‘More opportunity.’ Da da da. It’s this five-liner of nothingness. There have to be some distinctions for people to latch onto.”
This last point is particularly key, and I wonder if it's been lost on too many of those on the right. Hispanics are often painted as communities of outreach met with a broad brush of aspiration and pablum. But in reality, the overlaps on specific policy issues should allow for much more targeted appeals. Martinez's dismissal of the "five liner of nothingness" is refreshing to hear from a Republican, and others would be wise to heed it.
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Comments:
Mar '11
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
So basically "What New Mexico's Governor can teach the GOP" is, when you cut the BS, adopt an amnesty policy, stat. She can call it whatever she likes, but that sounds exactly like what she's proposing. "Pragmatic" is the key here, as it basically is shorthand for "we can't send all those people back".
Yes, we can in a way. We can send enough back that people get the message. Stop prosecuting burglary, and you'll get more of it. Enforce laws. Eisenhower did it, and guess what? "Self Deportation" DOES work. When you enforce the law and refuse to cave in to illegal aliens, hey, they tend to go home more. What a shock, eh?
Reagan tried amnesty, remember? Look how that worked out. Any kind of a benefit for illegal aliens... amnesty, the DREAM Act, etc... is begging for more illegals. Because that's what happens when you reward illegality. You get more of it. So I can only conclude that Republicans pushing for this stuff either A) are completely blind to history, or B) want more illegal aliens for various and sundry reasons. Illegal immigration is not a conservative idea. Libertarian, yes. Conservative, no.
Aug '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Zzz. Unlike everyone who talks about "Latinos," I've eaten Ecuadorean plantains and told a Dominican his music was loud and twisted my neck 180 degrees reading Chilean subway maps. Mexico (the appeasement of which I presume this is really all about) doesn't even register. I believe the interests of the Just-Don't-Get-It-American Community need to be addressed. That community just might be pretty big.
Oct '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
“We’ve got to stop with the rhetoric,” Martinez says on her way out of Starbucks. “I’m so tired of the rhetoric. ‘Lower taxes,’ you know. ‘More opportunity.’ Da da da. It’s this five-liner of nothingness. There have to be some distinctions for people to latch onto.”
What she sees as empty rhetoric are ends we ought to be working towards. If by "distinctions" she means specifics, I'm all for it. Ryan's economic plan is a start. But "nothingness"? Who suggested this woman for VP?
May '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
I would be very sympathetic to the Gov's point of view . . . if there weren't a little thing called "context." The fact is that the Left has it's own very highly developed list of shibboleths, and anyone talking about immigration who doesn't mention that fact, and its role in creating deadlock, is, frankly, a political hack.
There is no other issue, except maybe debt reduction, where the GOP has been so routinely sucker-punched by the bad faith of the other side. Based just on the quotes you show here, the Gov sounds like one of those pathetic inside-the-bubble Republicans for whom the true passion is reserved for denouncing their friends on the right. If that impression is unfair, I'd be delighted to be corrected. Until that happens, I invite everyone here on Ricochet to join me as I spew her out of my mouth.
Edited on May 16, 2012 at 2:53amJul '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Yes it is, but the politics are not.
Outflank Obama to his left on immigration? Are you kidding Governor?
Probably she isn't.
More likely she is: too much a Southwest provincial to understand the electoral consequences, focused on 2016 or later and engaging in preemptive pandering disguised as unpopular truth-telling, or a one-trick pony.
It would require a level of idiocy unseen since Chris Matthews appeared on Jeopardy! for Romney to hand Obama the blue collar votes of the Rust Belt, and all swing states outside of the Southwest in this fashion.
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Palaeologus
Outflank Obama to his left on immigration? Are you kidding Governor?
So punishing small business with hefty fines for employing certain labor is the conservative solution? That's Romney's solution to get illegals to self-deport. It sounds pretty anti-capitalist to me.
Jun '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Mao Zehedgehog
Palaeologus
Outflank Obama to his left on immigration? Are you kidding Governor?
So punishing small business with hefty fines for employing certain labor is the conservative solution? That's Romney's solution to get illegals to self-deport. It sounds pretty anti-capitalist to me.
It's very hard to punish the people who have absolutely nothing to lose. A bus ride home is not the greatest form of punishment.
Oct '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Do you mean small businesses violating not only the immigration laws, but engaged in undermining their own country? In New Mexico, as in Arizona and California, the reconquistas are not an insignificant bunch of radicals, they are a movement which is seeing it's vision fulfilled by American politicians and fiscal profligacy.
And there are many ways the desires of small business for cheap help can be fulfilled short of undermining the poor of their own country. Want to dry up the demand tor illegals? The minimum wage would be a good place to start. Forcing the hand of small business toward innovation is another. Personally, I don't like the taste, or lack thereof, of machine picked tomatoes. But they satisfy 90% of the public, and do not any more require tens of thousands of braceros to pick them. I probably won't like the machine picked lettuce when it comes, but fewer braceros is the result.
America is being diluted.
Apr '12
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
She is correct about the main talking points of Republicans being unappealing. That is because Usually these talking points are given in a style that speaks to male brains. The same message needs to be given in a personal story to resonate and stick with women. E.g. "Balancing your home budget and you want the red bicycle and the party dress for your daughter as well as the guitar lessons for your son? There is not enough money so you have to budget. What would happen if you gave your children all of these, but did not budget?" etc. women need a personal context. Republicans may want to get an all female marketing team to come up with detailed story lines for specific programs like tax deductions for soccer and piano lessons. Maybe get their own Julia - Claire might be good? The Republican men may be scoffing at Julia, but someone on the Obama team is reading women brilliantly. Julia will have got through to females and they will remember her life goodies given by the government. Think about what women read- celebrity stories, not scores or rankings. Get stories to illustrate unique programs and tax refunds for children.
Jul '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Mao Zehedgehog
Palaeologus
Outflank Obama to his left on immigration? Are you kidding Governor?
So punishing small business with hefty fines for employing certain labor is the conservative solution? That's Romney's solution to get illegals to self-deport. It sounds pretty anti-capitalist to me. · 12 minutes ago
I (and my partners) own a small retail business. Why should we be implicitly penalized for following the law?
We collect and remit sales taxes, withhold for SS, Medicare, & Medicaid. We pay unemployment insurance (which we get dinged for well after temps leave and start collecting), above minimum wage, and corporate taxes at both the state and federal level.
So why would I view businessmen who are intentionally breaking the laws that I follow as heroes?
Short answer: I don't.
May '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Yes . . . but be careful how you phrase it or we'll be right back into "women don't care about throw-weights" territory and your noble efforts will backfire.
Edited on May 16, 2012 at 4:07amFeb '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
I'm all for comprehensive immigration reform. The problem is that last time we tried it, only one side of the "comprehensive" bargain was held up-- the borders were not enforced.
That's why this time around, so many people want to see the enforcement really proven, before we agree to the rest of the comprehensive package.
In other words, if I could be guaranteed that only a very few people are able to cross the border illegally or work illegally in the country, I'll be a lot more friendly toward the prospect of an organized, legal guest worker program; to things like the DREAM act (or in general, using some common sense when dealing with children of immigrants who themselves did not commit a crime), and so on.
The problem is that "comprehensive" immigration reform is, to the Left, just another word for amnesty. It's not comprehensive at all.
We will not, cannot agree to that.
Aug '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Seriously? The GOP would find useful policy recommendations from Newsweek, of all places? I checked my calendar and it's not April 1, so color me confused.
It's no wonder why Martinez is Newsweek's "thoughtful" recommendation for the GOP. The rest of that article shows her in conflict with conservative politics on many issues. She's against the Ryan budget; she approves of government paternalism; she disagrees with just about every national GOP stance. If she didn't own a gun and oppose abortion, Newsweek would be touting her as the "model centrist" that those mean ol' right wingers must become if they want votes.
On immigration specifically, she is essentially saying what the center-left has been saying for years. Again, only small details keep her from being a boilerplate Democrat: she wants the DREAM Act at the same time as "increased border security" (i.e. the same weak sauce peddled by every amnesty deal of the last 4 decades), instead of standalone; and she's against issuing driver licenses to illegal immigrants.
When you accede to every single idea the other side has, that is not "tweaking" your platform. That is giving up.
Oct '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
They say the number 1 issue for latinos is the economy. that may be true, but immigration will always be the shiny object...
Oct '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Severely Ltd.:
What she sees as empty rhetoric are ends we ought to be working towards. If by "distinctions" she means specifics, I'm all for it. Ryan's economic plan is a start. But "nothingness"? Who suggested this woman for VP? · 3 hours ago
sometimes, conservative operatives only see the last name and get excited, instead of getting to know the person fully.
Edited on May 16, 2012 at 5:41amOct '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Yup. This boils down to a USA-Mexico thing.
Jul '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
On her last point that there is a lot of rhetoric and very little policy coming from the candidates, Mitch Daniels has something similar to say: http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/04/indiana-gov-mitch-daniels-criticizes-romney/
Oct '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
Mao Zehedgehog
Palaeologus
Outflank Obama to his left on immigration? Are you kidding Governor?
So punishing small business with hefty fines for employing certain labor is the conservative solution? That's Romney's solution to get illegals to self-deport. It sounds pretty anti-capitalist to me. · 2 hours ago
The Old Left used to be against illegal migrant workers because it undercut wages (see Cesar Chavez). The Right wasn't because of their ties to Big Business. Now the Left has abandoned this thinking for latino votes and Conservatives in turn are using the old arguments of the Left (illegals dilute wages).
Dec '10
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
A few highlights:
“I have no doubt Hispanics have been alienated during this campaign...”
... the GOP should outflank the president--on the left--by proposing its own comprehensive plan.
“Republicans want to be tough and say, ‘Illegals, you’re gone.’ But the answer is a lot more complex than that.”
... an approach “with multiple levels”: increased border security... a guest-worker program for people who want “to go freely back and forth across the border to work”; a DREAM Act-style pathway to citizenship... and a visa... that allows rest of the illegal population to remain in the U.S. while they follow standard naturalization procedures.
"It [DREAM Act] has to be part of a larger plan.”
She simply believes that a more pragmatic approach...
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So, in a nutshell, she shares the opinion of the Republican establishment, that if you don't use the word 'amnesty' people will be too stupid to know you're talking about amnesty.
And my favorite:
“‘Self-deport?’ What the heck does that mean?” Martinez snaps.
So she doesn't even understand the basics of the argument? And we're listening to her opinions because... why, exactly?
Edited on May 16, 2012 at 7:07amJan '11
Re: Susana Martinez on Republicans and Immigration
I enjoy the heck out of immigration discussion. I particularly enjoy conservatives who adopt a "we need more government" approach to 'fix' this migrant person problem while they'll talk-up the concept of liberty for all in other threads.
I've heard nearly all there is to hear on this topic: "It's not immigration that we're trying to stop, it's illegal immigration. Don't you get that!" So when it's suggested that the rules can be relaxed or guest worker programs can be used to take the illegality out of the equation, then the discussion leads to something else such as American workers being displaced, immigrant crime statistics, welfare payments, or some such other bogeyman that some just cannot be rational about.