Should I Vote?
I am a US citizen, born and raised in the United States. I have just completed my thirty-ninth year in Israel. As with all Jews who come here, we are given citizenship automatically and the fact that we do not have to apply for it allows us to remain citizens of the US. My last US residence was in Chicago.
I have no interaction with US tax authorities or Social Security and I own no assets in the US. Of course I have family there, some quite close.
My one benefit is the passport. And the passports of my children who were born here.
I don't think it's right for me to vote in the US, despite the fact that I follow US politics way more closely than does the average "likely voter." (I did vote absentee for the first few years.)
Nor do I think that Israelis living abroad should be allowed to affect our elections here.
When I ask "Should I Vote?" it's rhetorical. But it's worth a bit of discussion. Especially because there is a mission of political-types coming here from DC this week to tell us that we must. I will go to their meeting, not just because one of them is my cousin.
I don't plan to make an issue of this, as I see it as a personal decision, but I hope they don't bring sign-up forms.
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Comments:
Jun '10
Re: Should I Vote?
Yes. You're a citizen. Vote.
Oct '10
Re: Should I Vote?
There is a war going on for the future of Western Judeo-Christian civilization. Our enemy, broadly characterized as progressive international totalitarianism, plays by no rules save defeating everything we are.
If you believe in the God of Christians and Jews, then this isn't merely a political battle to decide who rules, this is a "religious" battle between God and Anti-God factions.
The rules of citizenship qualify you to participate in this war. In entering the fray in accord with the rules of ethical engagement, you are deciding to join the war.
Never forget that pacifists are free riders. They live because of the benefits purchased by the blood of those whom they denigrate.
Your decision involves far greater issues than simply playing the political game.
Feb '11
Re: Should I Vote?
If Illinois is in play, it won't matter. We have won.
Don't think I can suddenly revert to being a Pennsylvanian.
GO BUCCOS.
Edited on July 8, 2012 at 4:37pmNov '11
Re: Should I Vote?
Israel, I share your concern. I am of the opinion that dual citizenship should not exist, and for most of the history of the United States, American citizens had to choose. For me it is basic to citizenship that one is fully committed to the nation, and in the past that meant that if one voted in a foreign election or served in a foreign military, one automatically relinquished citizenship. Changes in our laws regarding citizenship requirements are part of the general weakening of the bonds of citizenship, i.e., a weakening of the allegiance to a nation.
Nevertheless, you are permitted to be a citizen of two countries and I think that under that circumstance a case could be made that your higher moral course is to support a nominee who best supports one or both of your countries.
On the other hand, to quote Tevye, you will be voting in Illinois. Good luck.
Mar '12
Re: Should I Vote?
I am a US citizen. Those words are your own, and as far as I can tell, they were not coerced. As an American citizen living in Israel, you have a view that many Americans don't consider, America's position in the world, including Israel.
I am a US citizen. Good. Express your citizenship by voting.
Jul '12
Re: Should I Vote?
Having lived in Israel for 17 years, I made the exact same decision. As Rob Long says, "you should have skin in the game", and as I don't contribute to the citizen's responsibilities in America, I don't feel comfortable voting. "No representation without taxation!"
That said, I'm completely comfortable expressing my views and encouraging active US citizens to support one policy or candidate over another.
Shimon
Nov '11
Re: Should I Vote?
Yeah, you two are correct. It would not be right for you to vote in the US. You may follow things, closely, you have have strong connections, and very strong opinions, but no, if you don't live here, it would not be right for you to vote here.
It may be lawful for you to vote here, but it's not right.
Aug '11
Re: Should I Vote?
Fred Cole:
It may be lawful for you to vote here, but it's not right.
I'm leaning toward Fred's view. Even though you still retain U.S. citizenship, you are a citizen of a different nation, and I think having lived there for almost four decades, it just feels wrong for you -- or anyone in a similar position -- to influence the direction of a country you left a long time ago.
Not that I want to base anything on feelings -- that way lies leftism. But on the enemy message board, I know at least one other in the same position as you. He, however, leans strongly toward Obama, and it bothers me that he gets to vote here. Particularly because he is forever criticizing anything and everything American. If I feel that way about him influencing us toward the left, I guess I'd better be "fair" (to use an Obama-word) about those who might also influence us toward the right.
It may be legal, but I can't support it. YMMV.
Nov '11
Re: Should I Vote?
At one point I moved a few miles from where I am now, and I neglected to change my voter registration in time. I could've voted for several town offices, but not living in the town anymore, instead living a few miles away in the city, I did not feel it was right for me to vote on offices for a town I no longer live in. It wouldn't be right for me to impose my choices on others like that.
May '11
Re: Should I Vote?
Israel, my first reaction was in agreement with Fred - now that Israel is your home, you should not vote in the US.
But I am reminded of a 2010 US law called the Foreign Asset Tax Compliance Act that will soon have an impact on you and others in situations such as yours. To make a long story short, because you are an American, the IRS is very interested in information about your assets held outside the United States. And financial institutions all over the world are preparing to give it to them. You still have more than a passing interest in what goes on over here; I could certainly understand if you do choose to vote.
Apr '12
Re: Should I Vote?
Vote. The Canadian national leader of the NDP, like the Democrats, has French citizenship and votes in the French elections. Can you imagine if Obama was revealed to be voting in Indonesia /Kenyan elections. Oh...you are right...probably not much. OK, imagine if Rick Perry was found to be voting in the Mexican elections? Are you going to run for President? If so, vote but do not inhale.
May '12
Re: Should I Vote?
You don't sound like an ex-pat. That is, unlike some Americans who move to Mexico or Costa Rica in their latter years, you've probably made a commitment to Israel that an ex-pat does not in the countries he or she has moved to. The ex-pat keeps his or her American identity.
Because you're not an ex-pat, I think you should give up American citizenship.
Oct '11
Re: Should I Vote?
Israel, I won't pretend to advise - you've given the question deeper and more informed thought than I ever could. You posted, so I'll comment.
It seems to me there are two questions, one of efficacy and one of right. On the latter, you are for your own moral purposes a citizen of the state of Israel and not of the United States. Of course, some who do vote here are not living citizens either - voter fraud is rampant. You don't contribute to our public purse, but that is true of many who will vote.
The vote is not something you purchase. The law enfranchises you, and we are still a people of laws.
As regards getting the job done, we citizens need every vote. Even in Illinois.
The left, and of course our president, style themselves citizens of the world. They solicit and receive campaign contributions from across the globe.
Well, it seems I've convinced myself, and so I'll advise despite my promise. The walls will fall because of our failures of attention and will, not because of a lack of commitment to abstract justice. Unilateral disarmament is not moral. Please vote.
Apr '11
Re: Should I Vote?
Do you feel compelled to renounce your citizenship? I can see Fred's argument against state and local votes, where your vote would elect officials with no hold over you, but Congressmen and Presidents have plenty of jursidiction over Americans everywhere. Until you are no longer an American, I don't see why Paul's and Donald's point doesn't prevail.
I'd note that the America of the Founders included many who were not taxed but did vote. There is now even a Constitutional protection against the operation of Deoac's principle (the 24th Amendment).
Sep '11
Re: Should I Vote?
I would like to understand more about this "mission of political-types".
When I lived outside the country for a few years, not expecting to return, I did not vote for the same reason you and others express here, Israel. But taking to heart what Raycon says and wondering just who is sending this "mission"...I might be inclined to reconsider.
Oct '11
Re: Should I Vote?
No, don't vote (which seems to be your decision anyway).
Mar '12
Re: Should I Vote?
I would review Obamacare, if I were you. If the mandate/penalty/tax applies to you on January 1, 2014, then I would vote. If not, and you have no other taxable income in the US, then I would not. I guess I'm applying the Tea Party rule, either way: No Taxation, no Representation.
Feb '11
Re: Should I Vote?
I have read mixed opinions on that. Most sounded alarmist.
Apr '12
Re: Should I Vote?
Out of interest, since no ID is required, what would stop me from popping down to the USA to vote? There must be some address required or something?
Nov '11
Re: Should I Vote?
I cannot tell you how it is done in other places, but in NY, they do not require ID, but they do require you to sign a book, which contains a copy of your signature from your voter registration documents.
So, you'd have to have the name of someone in one of those books and sign something resembling their signature.
What would stop you? Well, the task is not difficult, if you put your mind to it, but I would a sense of right and wrong would stop you.