Ricochet Members and Military Service
Claire Berlinski, Ed. ·
Dec 19, 2010 at 5:42am
Just wondering--how many members of Ricochet have served in the military? Where and when? What's your sense of how the US military is doing these days--how's morale, training, preparedness? What about the budget--are you seeing areas of obvious waste? Under-funding? What about planning--does it seem to you that the military is planning for the right things? DADT is in the news--are there other major questions that aren't, but in your view ought to be?
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Nov '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
I was commissioned (2nd Lt., Inf.) in May, 1960; went to the reserve; called to active duty 6 Jan. 1963; relieved from active duty three years later on 6 Jan. 1966; mustered out of the reserve in 1968 (Capt., JAGC). No combat duty.
Aug '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
1976-1983 USN Naval Aviation (F-14' s).; 3rd and 7th Fleets. (Pacific/Indian Oceans)
I am increasingly equating the efficacy of aircraft carriers in the satellite/GPS/missile age to Battleships in WW2.
Two thumbs down on DADT repeal, but still able to laugh at Monty Python's take on the issue
Edited on Dec 19, 2010 at 6:31amNov '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
U.S. Army, 3rd Infantry Division, 2nd Battalion, 3-63rd Armor, re-designated 4-69th Armor.
I was enlisted, started out E-1, left Active Duty as an E-4, spent a couple years in the national guard, left as an E-5.
I was most of my time in Germany, from 88-91.
It's interesting to me to see the transition over the last 20 years. The Sergeant Major of the Army came and spoke to us at some point and he said that basically the cold war was over, the training we'd received to date was WWII thinking and aimed and readying us to fight a major ground war in the European theater. But, the world was changing, and the country needed a smaller, more nimbler, better educated fighting force. He also made this point, which I think was rather prescient: he said that individual soldiers would now need to be able to identify hostiles from non-hostiles just by looking at them.
I'm not in a position to determine if soldiers today are more or less efficient today than they have been. I do think they are getting trained for the right stuff, however.
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
nordman: 1976-1983 USN Naval Aviation (F-14' s).; 3rd and 7th Fleets. (Pacific/Indian Oceans)
I am increasingly equating the efficacy of aircraft carriers in the satellite/GPS/missile age to Battleships in WW2.
Would love to hear the argument, if you feel like elaborating. And the counter-arguments, if anyone disagrees.
Nov '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Started this thread on DADT yesterday...
Nov '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
U.S. Navy 1963-1967 mostly on the USS Conway DD-507, a Fletcher Class Destroyer. That’s the class of destroyer that won the battle off Samar Island in Leyte Gulf in 1944, Admiral Spruance with his Jeep carriers and five little destroyers and destroyer escorts stood off Japanese cruisers and a battleship. It’s often called “The Last Stand of the Tin Can Sailors” and there is a terrific book by that title. The USS Johnston was sunk and was nearly identical to the Conway.
The Johnston went down fighting, but the Conway died an ignominious death. It was towed out to sea and used for target practice. RIP.
I could not survive in today’s Navy. Females on board ship would demoralize me. It’s a man’s job, one of the few left. Well, I guess it’s not left after all.
Sleeping 18 inches away, common on a destroyer, from a guy who is gay would not be a problem even if I knew, so long as he didn’t tell me. Repeal of DADT? Why?
Edited on Dec 19, 2010 at 3:34pmAug '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Claire Berlinski, Ed.
Would love to hear the argument, if you feel like elaborating. And the counter-arguments, if anyone disagrees. · Dec 19 at 7:05am
Since WW2 our aircraft carries have been so effective because nobody had the capability to effectively counter them. Technology is changing that.
It boils down to once the enemy knows where you are, it's a simple matter of saturating your defenses with anti-ship cruise missiles and decoys. Yes, there is a capability to defend against simultaneously incoming missiles. But then all it takes is n+1 missiles in a salvo resulting in; one hole in a flight deck and you're out of the game. Tom Clancy raised this issue decades ago in his 1986 Red Storm Rising .
And I'm sure you've noticed the huge emphasis on stealth in recent years. Something the size and profile of an aircraft carrier is the epitome of anti-stealth. Advantage: submarines.
The VTOL version of the F-35 may l change; the way we deploy Naval air power (smaller, more numerous platforms?)
Edited on Dec 19, 2010 at 8:05amRe: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Yes, I was reading it--that's what made me wonder.
Jun '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
I spent 20 years in the Army (73-93).My youngest son is on the Afghan/Pak border beating the living [hint of expletive deleted--ed.] out of the Taliban in the famed 101st Airborne. They are the best trained, most physical Army in history.
Repeal of DADT is a treasonous act against our fighting men inflicted by a congress who has very few members who have every sweated under a full ruck sack in inhospitable terrain or climate . Support services like the Air Force can probably get by with openly gay service members, but the impact on young men in front line combat units will be dangerous for the gays. I saw it myself when I had an outstanding young soldier who turned out to be gay (before DADT). Once his sexuality was known the impact on the rest of the unit was drastic and dramatic. Our social engineers do not understand the bonds of cohesion and mutual trust. They can’t quantify or see effective leadership. Combat leaders do everything they can to bring out the machismo in 17-20 year olds and homosexuality does not fit into that life style. I know because I have been there and done that!
Editor's Note: On Ricochet we do not even use asterisks to signify an expletive. That's how [expletive deleted]-whipped we are.
Edited on Dec 19, 2010 at 9:21amDec '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Rien
Entered the U.S. Army through New Mexico Military Institute and Stanford (in the bad olden times when Stanford permitted an ROTC program). Served in the RVN as operations officer of a special intelligence unit attached to the Americal Division--the "baby killers." Knew several of the officers relieved in the aftermath of My Lai.
Regard the repeal of DADT and the current push by repectable culture and received opinion to salt small tactical units of the combat arms with females as malignantly insane. Inserting avowed homosexuality and opposite sex gender politics and sexual competition into young male populations already under the most extreme stress possible grievously threatens the unit cohesion that is the threshold requirement of survival in military conflict.
But, of course, by virtue of their class and culture, the most ardent proponents of these polcies will never see the elephant. And that suits them just fine. Such has always been so.
Aug '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
I served from 1993-1997 in the Marines, ending up as a Cpl. and infantry squad leader. I have been thinking about DADT and it seems to me that it is irrelevant. If a Marine is highly motivated, disciplined, and looks out for his fellow Marines, nobody is really going to care much about his, or her, personal life. With the caveat that it not effect their professional life. As to other issues of import that the fuss over DADT might be obscuring... I am fanatical about training, that is the lynch-pin of every thing. I remember the training dividends of the "peace dividend", It got so bad by 1997 that we would go out on 4 day field exercises with less that ten blank rounds a Marine. So we spent about 3.8 days running around in the forest yelling "bang, bang". I fear that we are seeing the hollowing of our military outside the war zones. Too many focus on equipment. I see the greatest danger as training suffering to to try to equip the force. If I was forced to choose I would take a better trained, better led, not as well equipped military.
Oct '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
In 15 days I'm off to OSUT (one station unit training) at Fort Benning, GA to make the transition from civilian to infantryman in 14 weeks. Obviously, I won't be around much from now on, at least until April or May. I know somehow Ricochet will carry on without me.
Nov '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Claire Berlinski, Ed.
Yes, I was reading it--that's what made me wonder. · Dec 19 at 8:06am
I think a woman's perspective would be interesting. Why don't you ring in?
Jul '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
No personal military background, but I have frequently worked with military on contracts and call many friends. That in no way compares to being in, but the question of carriers came up and I have recent facts with regard to. By the end of the Cold War it was suspected, and occasionally mentioned in position papers, that between missile strike and satellite reconnaissance capability the carriers might not last the first day of a WW IV. The modern American carrier is an awesome strike capability, typically protected by 8-12 other ships, including AEGIS destroyers capable of detecting incoming missile strikes and controlling fleet anti-ballistic response. In a Navy with about 300 ships, we have 10 Nimitz-class carriers and a new generation Ford-class carrier with a similar hull but radically modernized design technically.
The next generation carrier approach being discussed publicly beyond the Ford class involves smaller, faster carriers with fewer planes and a lower price tag. The notion being that they will be a harder kill, more numerous, and easier to replace in a serious fight.
Oct '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Joined the Army in '03 as a Combat Engineer. Got out for a time and was recalled in '09. Deployed to Afghanistan with the 810th Sappers through 09' to 10', where we conducted Route Clearance (looking for and disposing of IEDs). Now riding out the last few months in the Reserves.
Is there waste? There is enormous waste. There is also underfunding as well. The problem is that we have poorly allocated resources, so that those areas that need money, don't have it.
I often had to fight to get the parts I needed to keep my vehicle up and running. Since I drove the lead Husky, a mine detection vehicle, it was an mission critical piece of equipment and missions were canceled if it was not mission capable. I spent a lot of time in small FOBs where you may only get one hot meal a day, if that.
But you should have heard the outrage from fobbits when McChrystal kicked fast food joints out of BAF. There are two cultures in the Army. One where the warrior mentality persists, and the rest which has become burdened with political correctness, paperwork, and creature comforts.
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Ken Owsley
Claire Berlinski, Ed.
Yes, I was reading it--that's what made me wonder. · Dec 19 at 8:06am
I think a woman's perspective would be interesting. Why don't you ring in? · Dec 19 at 11:29am
I feel unqualified to comment. I haven't served in the military and suspect this is an issue best debated by those who have. I suppose I have one reflection, possibly not relevant, which is that the guys at my Muay Thai gym seem completely used to me now. My presence wigged them out thoroughly at first, and did cause some tensions that in a military context would have been ... bad for unit cohesion. There are probably some parallels between martial-arts culture and martial culture. What I've experienced suggests that having an outlier around can indeed cause some initial confusion, but that even young Turkish men are able to adjust when they see that the new, different member of the unit (so to speak) is there for more or less the same reasons they are and is willing to work hard.
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
That's what you'd expect, given central planning. Any good ideas for solving this problem?
Nov '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
hoo-wah...we didn't say that when I was in the military, but I guess they do now, so hoo-wah.
Nov '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Having a hotty around is decidedly different than a gay man...
Aug '10
Re: Ricochet Members and Military Service
Ken Owsley
Having a hotty around is decidedly different than a gay man... · Dec 19 at 12:41pm
Agreed. It's a significant force multiplier.