Obamacare Open Thread
Mollie Hemingway, Ed. ·
June 28, 2012 at 3:45pm
I thought about posting on a few other things this morning (this story on Mexican medical tourism in the New York Times fails to mention the costs of regulation or liability insurance when evaluating why costs are cheaper) but I can't think about anything other than the Supreme Court.
So as we prepare for a deluge of postings* analyzing the ruling, let this be our open thread for all things Obamacare.
*And contributor livechats. Ben Domenech's live thread. Avik Roy & NRO friends live chat.
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Comments:
Sep '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Breaking News: No bath salts or other exotics in South Beach Cannibal, just cannabis.
Prediction: Look forward to legalization of marijuana in November.
Dec '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
It's still a direct tax, so I see it being challenged on that grounds as soon as it is levied on anyone.
Aug '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
But totally predictable. How often does the Supreme Court limit the power to tax, after all?
It's my understanding that the Supreme court has even held that taxes are even exempt from the prohibition against ex-post-facto laws.
If the Supreme Court already believes imposing retroactive taxes is Constitutional, then what taxing power would the Supreme court ever consider unconstitutional?
Mar '11
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Midget Faded Rattlesnake
But totally predictable. How often does the Supreme Court limit the power to tax, after all?
It's my understanding that the Supreme court has even held that taxes are even exempt from the prohibition against ex-post-facto laws.
If the Supreme Court already believes imposing retroactive taxes is Constitutional, then what taxing power would the Supreme court ever consider unconstitutional? · 3 minutes ago
Oh, you are quite right. I don't like it, but you are right.
Dec '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
So, we're being taxed on non-activity now. How on God's green earth is that different than having non-activity regulated as commerce?
Nov '11
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
So Kennedy wanted to strike the whole thing down (reading dissent). If Roberts had gone with him, the whole thing would've been toast. That makes me feel sick.
On the other hand, Romney is now running against a huge and already-unpopular tax increase. That kind of debate tends not to go well for Democrats. The way the Supreme Court framed the issue has probably made the political repeal process easier.
Apr '11
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Once again a bush gives us a judas. So congress can compel whatever it wants from us the newly minted serfs. It just has to rely on the court converting its language into the correct ceremonial words for the legal religion. I am going to go throw up now.
May '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Isn't that how Social Security survived?
Described and sold as insurance, but justified to the courts as a tax?
At lease the Commerce Clause argument was rejected, which is something anyway.
Sep '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
And the trend of Republican presidents batting .500 on SC nominees continues. Good thing we got Roberts in there while he was still young..
Dec '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Matthew Bartle: Isn't that how Social Security survived?
Described and sold as insurance, but justified to the courts as a tax?
At lease the Commerce Clause argument was rejected, which is something anyway. · 0 minutes ago
Exactly.
Feb '12
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
If the mandate were argued and sold as a tax it would have been constitutional. The taxing power is very broad.
What seems to have happened is that the mandate, which was sold as definitely not a tax, wound up being saved on the grounds that it is a tax. It seems as if the court just imagined the government argued their case the way it should have been argued in the first place, and gave them a huge, sloppy, benefit of the doubt.
It seems this problem will have to be solved with an election.
Nov '11
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Jordan Wiegand: If the mandate were argued and sold as a tax it would have been constitutional. The taxing power is very broad.
What seems to have happened is that the mandate, which was sold as definitely not a tax, wound up being saved on the grounds that it is a tax. It seems as if the court just imagined the government argued their case the way it should have been argued in the first place, and gave them a huge, sloppy, benefit of the doubt.
It seems this problem will have to be solved with an election. · 0 minutes ago
In other words, the Supreme Court just ruled that the President lied.
Dec '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Someone please again explain to me how Romney is the right guy to fix this?
Dec '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
The opinion [pdf].
Jul '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
I am not sanguine about the chances of this ever getting repealed. Have we ever repealed anything from the Progressive experiment? It's looking more like another Revolution will be required to restore the Republic.
May '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
This problem will have to be solved with an election, and even then, it will be a gargantuan struggle, even if the composition of the Senate is changed and Romney makes it into the White House...
We must be ready to fight until victory is won or life is lost. And if PPACA prevails, then the death toll will be high, due to rationing, collectivist centralization, and increases in abortion and euthanasia. This is very dark.
Mar '12
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
i think the tea party just got new life. the recourse now is simple: repeal the law. which means that we need to get the white house, the senate, and the house. but more importanly, we, as conservatives, need to offer an alternative. the base starting point could/should be the ryan plan that offers premium support for the needy but pushes the notion of cost control into the free market. that's going to be a big sale.
Dec '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Pseudodionysius
Perhaps he is part Cherokee like Elizabeth. · 4 minutes ago
Roberts.....................
Aristocracy
Timocracy
Oligarcy
Democracy
Tyranny
IDIOCRACY!!!
"I'm too old to cry but it hurts too much to laugh."
- A. Lincoln (upon losing his first run for congress)
May '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Right - that's a question every candidate must answer: will you vote to overturn the ACA?
Fortunately, it's still unpopular, but that might shift a little now that it has court approval. We have to hammer the point that the "not a tax" claim was a lie.
Dec '10
Re: Obamacare Open Thread
Well, if Roberts wanted to be remembered in history books he now will.