Claire Berlinski, Ed. · Feb 6, 2011 at 2:41am

LowcountryJoe left a comment beneath my post about Salim Mansur that snapped me out of my funk:

While I agree that there are plenty of things to be worried about I just think this defeatist [expletive] does not help -- I know it [expletive] me off.  Influential people have platforms.  Some of you all that are listed as contributors here are influential people with real persuasive power. 

Dammit, use that power to sell some optimism regarding liberty and liberalization.  Use your intellect to counter these treands that you/we do not like.  Fight the left-leaning authoritarians by mocking their ideas where they need a good mocking...through parodies and pointing out their absurdities if you must.  Spend the energies there! 

He's right. Believing you'll win doesn't guarantee you'll win a fight, but it sure helps. The belief that you'll lose is a disastrous disadvantage. To an extent, whining about the stupidity and decadence of Western culture is propagandizing for the enemy. That's exactly what they say, so it must cheer them greatly to read that we're all in agreement about the West's terminal decline. 

In fact, when I step back from my morose precipice and think about it (a good night's sleep helps), there is no good reason to think all is lost. However great the potential for events in Egypt to become a cataclysmic disaster, they haven't yet. Nor need they. Nothing is written. It's breathtaking and incredibly moving to see how many Egyptians have stood up to authoritarian rule; that there is a risk they will be betrayed by the Muslim Brotherhood--or by another iron-fisted authoritarian, for that matter--does not mean it is a certainty. It doesn't mean we should fail to celebrate the sight of so many human beings demonstrating that mankind does, just as Salim wrote, thirst to be free.  

I keep my enthusiasm for this movie on the double QT here in Turkey, where for some reason they don't have any sense of humor about it. And yes, I know, these events in reality did not work out well for any party concerned. But many other queasy-making moments in history actually did work out okay in the end, even when everyone said they wouldn't. You can all provide examples in the comments.

By the way, Lowcountry Joe, I don't agree with the rest of your remarks--to the effect that we can't do anything about the rest of the world until our own house is in order. We don't have the luxury of waiting for that. We have to get our own house in order and construct a coherent, principled foreign policy and we have to do it at the same time and fast. Americans don't just live in America, they live on Planet Earth. When we've solved the problem of teleporting ourselves safely to another galaxy, we can have a long serious conversation about isolationism. Until then, we're stuck here.

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Del Mar Dave
Joined
Oct '10
Del Mar Dave

 Until I see some measurable movement backwards from the precipice, I have to remain somewhat morose about events.  To change the metaphor, I have been Charlie Brown attempting to kick the football too many times to believe any more that Lucy won't pull it back at the last moment.  That said, I did remark to a good (and very politically involved) friend some while ago that I still have one more attempt at a good counter-revolution left in me.

Claire, love your recent podcasts.  Might you consider one with Judith Levy in which you give us outlines of the underlying concepts and practices of property and business ownership, personal freedom and the legal structures to support them in Turkey, Israel and Egypt?

Mike LaRoche
Joined
Oct '10
Mike LaRoche

"The wise man said it could not be done.  The fool came and did it."

I often recall that Chinese proverb whenever I hear that all is lost, it's time to head for the hills, Western civilization is finished, and so on.  Solving the difficult political problems of our age - national and international - will entail some queasy-making risk.  Recall President Ronald Reagan's aggressive stance toward the Soviets in the early 1980's.  To this day, not many know that Operation Able Archer in the fall of 1983 brought us to the brink of war with the USSR.  Was it risky, perhaps foolish?  Did civilization hang in the balance?  Damn straight.  But nearly two decades later, there is little doubt that Reagan's brinkmanship was worth the effort.

Achieving a desirable result amidst the chaos in Egypt and the larger Islamic world will require similar nerve.  Our country's present leadership is clearly not up to the task, but in less than two years we can install some leaders who will be.  Isolation, though, is not a viable alternative.  That horse left the barn nearly a century ago and it's not coming back.  Nor should it.

Pseudodionysius
Joined
Sep '10
Pseudodionysius

I woke up this morning to even more commentary by Claire and Judith (always great to be able to say I had morning coffee with Claire and Judith), a very wise post above by Mike LaRoche and a new appreciation of a website that generates a comment by someone named Bi-Coloured-Python-Rock-Snake.

As to the funkadelic that seems to have descended on Berlinski and Masur, I can assure everyone that Masur is surrounded by an excess of MoveOn.org wingnuts. That's enough to bring anyone down, and Claire's Turkish non-embassy/embassy posting wouldn't do much for anyone's confidence about the endurance of Western thought.

But a word of encouragement as well as caution is in order. The United States has a word class capitulator in office, and his Arthur style spending spree is going to severely hamper the military might needed to project American force where it is needed. The Romans fell apart when they forgot what it means to be a Roman. The West is in the same danger. That front will be fought by those seeking serious school reform.

We've got our work cut out for us.

Anthony Aristar
Joined
Nov '10
Anthony Aristar

I'd love to be optimistic in this case, Claire...In my private life that's exactly what I am.  But I also believe that success is rarely a consequence of luck, but rather a result of bold action.  In the West we have become passive onlookers, afraid to do anything because actions always have consequences, and some of those are not pretty to behold. 


Joined
Sep '10
liberal jim

I paint the demonstrations with a less idealistic brush and fully expect your fears of a cataclysmic disaster to be realized.  I am however not pessimistic.  Democracy or the allusion of it is more often the tool of tyrants than the friend of liberty.  The optimism of the founding fathers and R.R. was not grounded in a belief in democracy, but a belief in the virtue and self-reliance of the American people.   If that virtue and self-reliance is longer sufficiently strong hard times will restore them. 

katievs
Joined
May '10
katievs

I agree with Mike that it's not over till it's over, and where there's life there's hope, and stranger things have happened, and all that.

But I want pundits who call it as they see it, not who make it their goal to get the rest of us to think positively.

LowcountryJoe
Joined
Jan '11
LowcountryJoe

Getting into a funk happens.  When you catch yourself in one, please do yourself a favor: just watch president Reagan's farewell speech from, say, around minute mark 10:00 onward.

~Paules
Joined
Jun '10
~Paules

 I'm optimistic.  The Egyptian protests are even now beginning ebb.  Nobody knows what form the new government will take, but clearly the military has played its hand well.  Perhaps we'll see a constitutional government with the military acting as guardian, something similar to the Turkish model.

As for the United States, the leftist agenda will roll on until it eventually runs off the tracks.  This is necessary.  The pain will be instructive and the results will see the the leftist agenda discredited for at least a generation.  We'll need to answer the question why we couldn't learn from history.  I think we'll find it in our school system.  Academia produced Barack Obama and the millions of useful idiots who voted him into office.  Must we endure this cycle every thirty years?  Was Jimmy Carter not lesson enough?  Apparently not. 

We'll need to do some serious house cleaning once the ship of state is righted again.  We can start with our schools, the public unions, and the dependent class.  I won't see the end of this fight in my lifetime, but the tide was turned last November.  Let us press ahead.

Anthony Aristar
Joined
Nov '10
Anthony Aristar

My feeling, sadly, is not optimistic. My problem is that I read Arabic, I have known many Arabs, and I know their attitudes towards religion.  I am quite certain that if an Islamist group is on the ballot, Egyptians will vote for it.  Diana West says it better than I can: http://washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/2011/02/egypt-may-well-go-route-iran

Claire Berlinski, Ed.
Anthony Aristar: My feeling, sadly, is not optimistic. My problem is that I read Arabic, I have known many Arabs, and I know their attitudes towards religion.  I am quite certain that if an Islamist group is on the ballot, Egyptians will vote for it.  Diana West says it better than I can: http://washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/2011/02/egypt-may-well-go-route-iran · Feb 6 at 6:49am

Anthony, give me some ideas. I'm going insane because I can't read Arabic. I would do anything to have a quick translation of feeds like this and Tweets that come up in Arabic under hashtags like this:

http://twitter.com/faisalalmuslemhttp://twitter.com/AboTameMhttp://twitter.com/AliAldafiri
#muslim #Egypt#Jan25#brotherhood #tahrir#ikhwan #Palestine#Gaza #sidibouzid 

How can we get a translation team organized to do this? Surely this should be possible and surely the importance of this is obvious? 

 

Anthony Aristar
Joined
Nov '10
Anthony Aristar

Claire, I looked at that twitter page; like all twitter pages, it's confusing, with many conversations goingon. Here's some of it

faisalalmuslem In order to create a serious chance to take the country out of crisis it is essential that the whole government resign and  a new government with a new approach be appointed

It’s not enough to accept the resignation of Sheikh Jaber Al-Khaled  to resolve the political crisis experienced by the country (continued)

@MuhannadAlSayer God give you good health and I agree with you

@KhalifaAlabdali Ame-e-e-en I’m with you

@Faisalalzafiri Saturday

@aldouseri77 I heard from informed sources that they offered some of what is wanted, but what do I know 

@Faisalalzafiri  I’ve invited you and the whole monastery

@HussainALhardan May your journey be good and your acts too and thank you for your trust

@AlajmiSaad I’ll preach

@Faisalalzafiri  May God give you glory and he who reads all the good

@HussainALhardan God willing, next Saturday

@aalshaye3 This requires care.. In short, what happened in Tunisia and Egypt will affect all Arab countries, however not all of what is used there is a means of reform  fit for others

Anthony Aristar
Joined
Nov '10
Anthony Aristar

One problem, Claire, is that I'm not an Arabic twitterer, and they're using odd words and abbreviations that are not standard, not to mention quotes from popular songs, e.g.

@mesferalnais By God,  welcome to you  .. We were discussing  the importance of state institutions.. How if you do not criticize me, Beloved :) Your brother ‘Alimi

Charles Gordon
Joined
Dec '10
Charles Gordon

Around 1848, when it was observed “a spectre is haunting Europe - the spectre of Communism” there was legitimate hope because that kind of change had not yet set back history for a century in several continents. Its attraction mesmerized, oddly, first its future victims, rather than its ruthless rulers. After all, Marx died miserably in a London hovel, no less decrepit than he.

Today, those who hold power are the mesmerized. Our historic first Islamic apostate president, his manipulators, and his bolshevik media are again imploring the return of this collectivist specter. But this time, he is disguising its misanthropy with his “mellifluous” (VDH) tone.

Further centralization of power into the hands of our mellifluous pharaoh, having the same despotic designs as the dynastic tyrants of old, proceeds unabated through the nexus of crony-capitalism, ruling by executive decree and regulatory diktats, all under the cover of our states’ and national Ponzi-pyramid.

Yes, warnings of doomsday can wear the most robust optimism raw, but we each live in the here and now. We cannot patiently wait for the return of glory in one hundred years.

A demon is haunting America, collectivization is its name.

Claire Berlinski, Ed.

Anthony Aristar: One problem, Claire, is that I'm not an Arabic twitterer, and they're using odd words and abbreviations that are not standard, not to mention quotes from popular songs, e.g.

@mesferalnais By God,  welcome to you  .. We were discussing  the importance of state institutions.. How if you do not criticize me, Beloved :) Your brother ‘Alimi · Feb 6 at 9:39am

Anthony, I'm actually going through some of this with Google translate, hardly the ideal way to do it, but machine translation seems to give more comprehensible results with Arabic than Turkish--owing to a greater similarity in syntax, I assume. I can get the gist of a lot of it. It's not good.

Anthony Aristar
Joined
Nov '10
Anthony Aristar

Claire Berlinski, Ed.

@mesferalnais By God,  welcome to you  .. We were discussing  the importance of state institutions.. How if you do not criticize me, Beloved :) Your brother ‘Alimi · Feb 6 at 9:39am

Anthony, I'm actually going through some of this with Google translate, hardly the ideal way to do it, but machine translation seems to give more comprehensible results with Arabic than Turkish--owing to a greater similarity in syntax, I assume. I can get the gist of a lot of it. It's not good. · Feb 6 at 10:28am

No, it's not good... and I'll keep an eye on the Twitter page if you like, to see if anything startling appears.  The problem with Google translate is that it seems to fail on fairly simple stuff, and doesn't seem to like interpreting inflections.  If you run the Arabic quote I translated above, you'll see it's pretty near incomprehensible. i just tried it.  Still, it does often give the gist.

Good Berean
Joined
Oct '10
Good Berean

It has been written... "mene, mene , tekel upharsin"..."you have been weighed in the scales and been found wanting". Yet another oligarch has fallen to desire for natural liberty, a yearning all mankind shares to be free. What is also written in the Egyptian culture and history is that the form of government that will replace Mubarak will also be  hierarchical and most likely bureaucratic-authoritarian. The question is how much influence the Islamists will have in the reformation of that government. The answer to this question will determine the fate of non-Muslim minorities in Egypt. Although the people may want freedom, having been little more than slaves for millennea, they have not the virtues of freemen which are necessary for the formation of a western style democracy. They will not be able to reformulate their constitution on a federal basis, the only firm foundation for "democracy".

I am afraid what will be written about today's Egypt already has been written:

"The Moving Finger writes; and, having writ,
  Moves on: nor all thy Piety nor Wit
Shall lure it back to cancel half a Line,
  Nor all thy Tears wash out a Word of it."

Edited on Feb 6, 2011 at 1:51pm

Joined
Feb '11
chipvw

 Whew! Glad you're kinda gettin' your groove back. I mean, I just joined up; don't need the leadership immediately goin' all Oswald Spengler on me. 'Sides, we can't be lettin' the likes of Mathews and Zakaria get us down. Claire, those boys couldn't carry your mongkon (or whatever you call that muy-thai headband thingee).


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