Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
I'm noticing a certain contradiction in the Ricochet Zeitgeist and I figured I'd point it out.
The general sentiment here seems to be "My goodness, Bibi is superb. Why can't we find a leader like that?" A sample of Ricochet comments:
"I wish I could see a US presidential candidate with Bibi's unique mix of eloquence backed up by steadfast conviction and deep experience. Who comes closest to the Israeli PM amongst the various Republicans running?"
"He embodies all of the qualities I'd like to see in a candidate for our own Presidency."
"Wow, now that's a leader!"
And I am also noticing on Ricochet a categorical aversion to considering a presidential candidate with a record of failure or betrayal in his marital life. Newt--unthinkable. Giuliani--no way.
I'm supposed to find "I mean what I say when I see nothing wrong with killing in utero babies, nothing wrong with same sex marriage" (coming from a man who's been married three times) refreshing and admirable? An example of "rock solid integrity"? No sale.
I haven't studied the comments carefully enough to know if the most ardent Bibi enthusiasts are also those rejecting the idea of candidates with "baggage." Maybe they're not. But if there's anyone who loves Bibi but hates baggage, you're dealing with a massive contradiction in thought.
I'd hate to break anyone's heart, but Bibi's on his third wife. As for the rest of the situation, frankly, it's none of my business. That's between him and his wife and his ex-wives and his ex-mistresses and his ex-mistresses' husbands and probably half the women in the Israeli army.
That's his private life (although it's hardly a secret), and I wouldn't bring it up at all were it not to make a point that actually does need making. Yes, you can be a lousy, unfaithful husband and still be an admirable leader.
In a perfect world, we'd have a slate of terrific candidates who have all enjoyed long, stable, happy marriages. It's not a perfect world. It's an insanely dangerous world. I'll be voting for a president, not a husband-in-chief. Show me the candidate who seems to grasp these dangers best and I'll vote for him. Or her.
- Comment (26)
- · Quote
- · UnfollowFollow (1)
- Pages:
- 1
- 2
- Pages:
- 1
- 2
Comments :
Nov '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
In a sense I agree with you, Claire. I'd vote for a Giuliani over a Huckabee (using him as a metaphor; I realize he's not running - thank god). As far as I know, Huckabee is a man of sterling, personal moral character. And so was Jimmy Carter. And Reagan was a divorcee, etc.
Nonetheless, where one stands--and how one votes--on the social issues is, generally, a far better predictor of how one actually votes (or signs off) on economic issues. As I've written before, those who are liberal on social issues end up, with very great frequency, actually voting as liberals.
Jun '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
I apologize because I'm writing this just as my Ambien is starting to kick in. Of course marital fidelity would be a plus for any candidate I might support. But I don't think infidelity necessarily has much correlation with job performance. So I am happy to look the other way on that issue. A hypothetical strong conservative with personal baggage is ok with me.
Nov '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Something I wrote earlier:
Those who claim to be liberal on social issues and conservative on fiscal issues are too likely, when the chips are down, actually to vote as liberals on the fiscal issues.*
That is, politicians of a libertarian bent often tend to vote for bigger government. This actually reflects the general libertarian view of autonomy, which denies the existence of any standard of good higher than the individual will ("autonomy," after all, means self-legislation). If there is no law higher than that asserted by my will, then why not make common cause with others like me to get what we want through government? It makes little difference whether this leads to a less productive economy overall, at least if I am clever enough to get what I want. Such open-ended individualism is really at the root of left-wing demagoguery, and tyranny.
What is needed is a coherent understanding of personal responsibility across the issues. This is basic conservatism, as distinct from libertarianism: education in personal morality and dedication to free markets.
__
* See the brief discussion here.
Jul '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Back when Trent Lott got into trouble for is one solitary comment (you know, a single comment shouldn't define a life) at Strom Thurmand's Birthday Party people were asking why no one spoke up for Trent.
My answer then was, because Trent won't speak up for us, why should we speak up for him.
And that's what the thing about Bibi is all about. He stands for something other than Himself in Power. He doesn't "Go Political" when the water starts to get a little hot. In fact, he may just turn up the gas to heat the water a bit more.
It's not the baggage. It's the posture.
When the posture is that of someone who means business, and isn't going to wimp out, the baggage isn't noticable.
When the Posture is "I want to play it safe so I don't loose." the baggage becomes very visible.
Again, it's the difference between playing to Win and Playing to Not Loose.
And ever since Boehner's Wiimpout of not going for the full 100 billion and using a strategy to get 100 billion, baggage has become Very Visible.
Feb '11
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Israel P. · May 26 at 1:14am
Come on, Israel, that was a really respectful way of putting it compared to the way it's usually reported!
Apr '11
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Is there not an issue of safety involved?
A person with a long term stable relationship is less likely to have skeletons in the closet that could give someone leverage over him.
What concessions may Arnies maid have requested and received over his term in office?
Jun '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
I completely disagree. Marriage vows matter. You can choose to take a candidate's fidelity into consideration when making a voting choice or not. But it is as relevant to a candidate's character as everything else he or she does.
Reagan's first wife left him....he was a man who cherished his wife and his vow. Please don't lump him in with Newt!
Edited on May 26, 2011 at 2:33amJan '11
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Robert Lux:
That is, politicians of a libertarian bent often tend to vote for bigger government.
I reject the notion that just because a politician seems to have socially liberal yet fiscally conservative policy stances while seeking votes, that they somehow have a libertarian bent. Most true libertarian-leaning candidates either run as Libertarians or have the endorsement of organizations like The Club for Growth, The Cato Institute, or the Republican Liberty Caucus. And when you hear them in the media, they're not bashful about describing our current government as a nanny state. They also tend not to get elected because too many voters do not want to hear someone tell them that their government should do less. It seems far too many voters believe in free lunches, looking out for their neighbors 'best interests', and the magic of politicians to make everything all better -- like a mother's kiss on tiny injury for a youngster.
So, I would venture that you won't find many true libertarian-leaning elected officials. And when you do, they're not the ones making government bigger.
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Character matters. When I was in Israel a decade ago, I was told that Ariel Sharon was a tough hombre but that he was as good as his word. I was also told that Netanyahu was not. Gingrich and Giuliani have qualities but they are both out of control in ways that ought to make people nervous. The jury is still out on Netanyahu.
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
It's fine with me as long as you don't drive.
May '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Claire,
I'm among those who said "no way" to Guiliani, making clear that it was primarily because of his pro-abortion, pro-gay-marriage views, not his personal failings. Foreign threats are not the only evils facing our nation.
I'm also the one who wrote:
It was in response to someone who claimed that the fact that Guiliani has been consistent in his pro-abortion, pro-SSM views means he is a politician of "rock solid integrity," which I find risible.
I was not among those praising Bibi. I admire him hugely. I know too little of judge his general fitness for high office. But what I learned of him today from you post is enough for me to say I wouldn't vote for him for US President.
May '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
I do, however, wish that we had someone running who had something like his experiential heft and rhetorical power.
Feb '11
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
All divorces are not the same, and all presidential candidates are not the same. Divorce, I believe, should be seen as a negative, but a candidate should have strengths that outweigh this negative. Ann Coulter wrote a fabulous column on this very subject yesterday.
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
katievs: Claire,
I'm among those who said "no way" to Guiliani, making clear that it was primarily because of his pro-abortion, pro-gay-marriage views, not his personal failings. Foreign threats are not the only evils facing our nation.
I'm also the one who wrote:
It was in response to someone who claimed that the fact that Guiliani has been consistent in his pro-abortion, pro-SSM views means he is a politician of "rock solid integrity," which I find risible.
Yes, your argument is different (and better) than my use of the comment in this context would suggest. It wasn't the best example I could have chosen.
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
I'm of mixed minds. I tend to have low regard for all politicians so it's hard to figure out why they disappoint me so. And I used to joke that all politicians should be given an endless supply of drugs, alcohol and women upon their arrival in office -- so that they wouldn't have time to mess with the economy.
But I have noticed a tendency for politicians who cheat on their spouses to not be terribly principled, as Guiliani and Gingrich and even Netanyahu show. I wonder if Schwarzenegger forsook all of his supposedly conservative ideas on account of trying to please a wife he betrayed. I notice how Jon Ensign's infidelity -- which destroyed two families, at least -- quickly led to much worse charges involving corruption at the highest level.
Nov '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
I think it is easy to hold a foreign leader in high regard based on a handful of issues; you don't have to vote for him, and you don't have to defend your vote for him. And you don't have to defend liking him at all, since no one seems to know, in this case, who BiBi is. That is based on the informal poll conducted by my son.
With Newt or others, I think the main opposition involves policy. Newt is simply perceived as an establishment Republican, and frankly, one who had his chance and blew it. Opposition to Newt on the basis of his failed marriages is secondary, and when it does come it it's primarily to point out that it makes him unelectable, not that it is the reason one is specifically not going to vote for him, if that makes any sense.
Mar '11
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
Claire Berlinski, Ed.
Israel P. · May 26 at 1:14am
Come on, Israel, that was a really respectful way of putting it compared to the way it's usually reported! · May 26 at 1:50am
Actually, I think it's blowing it out of proportion a bit, and also quite unkind to the women of the IDF. In any event, I think that the Israeli mainstream (i.e., Left) media is much more focused on trying to pin corruption or lies on him, and even in the incredibly hostile media there seems to be a consensus that on the marital level, Sarah Netanyahu knows how to hold him by a short leash. If anything, the press tend to criticize - correctly, to a degree - the extent to which he allows his wife too large a role in his official life.
Mar '11
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
In any event, your larger point is well taken. There has always been a noted tendency of powerful men (great leaders being a subset of that group) to misbehave in matters of sex and vices, but it's largely irrelevant to their greatness.
Winston Churchill is a perfect example of that: a truly great leader, yet his personal life was downright creepy. Next to him, even Clinton, Giuliani and yes, Bibi, seem quite moral.
Aug '10
Re: Netanyahu and Candidates With Baggage
I don't really care about baggage. I just think Giuliani is a little too old, and that he looks really old and feeble on television (especially if he was standing next to Obama).