My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Ricochet, please permit me to introduce you to my dear friend Mert, a new member of Ricochet and a student of constitutional law here in Istanbul. He's about to embark on the writing of his dissertation. He wants to write about the American presidential system. He's particularly interested in the idea of checks and balances in the US political system and the limits placed by our Constitution on the president's power.
There's an important reason for his interest. In Turkey, the ruling AKP is considering the introduction of a presidential system to replace Turkey's traditional parliamentary mode of governance.
The multifaceted momentum triggered by [last September's] heady referendum victory has turned new attention to an old idea of Turkey’s ruling party: a U.S.-style “presidential system” to replace the current European-style parliamentary mode of governance.
Just where American icons like “states’ rights,” “limited” central government and the supremacy of “local authority” will come in... those appear to be ideas for later.
At first brush, the afterglow of victory has apparently wetted Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan’s appetite for a different governmental architecture. The first president in the new system would, of course, be Erdoğan.
That possibility is anathema to the country’s opposition parties.
“The presidential system, according to [the ruling party’s] understanding, will bring an uncontrollable single-man administration. Judicial freedom will become even less protected,” Atilla Kart, a member of the Constitutional Commission and a Konya representative of the main opposition Republican People’s Party, or CHP, told the Hürriyet Daily News & Economic Review on Tuesday.
Mert is eager better to understand better why, in America, a presidential system does not result in dictatorship. He'd like to get thoughts from members of Ricochet about fruitful ways to explore this topic--suggestions, for example, about important case studies he might examine, pointers to critical moments in American history that defined the limits of the power of the president, general thoughts about what is required, constitutionally, to ensure that such a system does not devolve into despotism.
I know many members of Ricochet have given these questions a great deal of thought. It would make me very proud to see Ricochet engaging directly with people in Turkey who are concerned to safeguard Turkish democracy. I hope you'll be generous in helping Mert to understand how America works and what lessons Turkey might profitably draw from the American experience.
Ricochet, welcome to your first adventure in foreign policy. Do good work. The stakes for Turkey are very high.
Oh, and by the way--Mert is also a terrific martial artist. If you have any martial arts questions, he's our new in-house expert.
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Jan '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Being that everything is relative, Mert's comments do give me a change to pause and realize that while the United States [it is still plural, right?] has radically changed course from its foundings in how the state is to govern, the initial framework [three separate branches] has done well, so far, to prevent despotism.
May I suggest that Mert look into the debating and arguments bewteen the Federalists and Anti-Federalists to see what produced that strong initial framework while he keeps in mind that the U.S. Constitution is actually America's second 'constitution'. Those debates and arguments, while in writing, can also be found in audio formats if he'd prefer listening.
Edited on Mar 3, 2011 at 4:32amRe: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Yes, he definitely needs to look at the Federalist Papers. We've had some good discussions of them here on Ricochet, Mert: If you use the search function under "Federalist papers," I think you'll find them.
Jan '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
May I suggest he also look at the Anti-Federalist papers, as well. Some very wise dudes on that side too.
Nov '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
For a real world example of a crisis moment that in other countries could have gone very differently, I suggest he dive into the election and aftermath of the 2000 presidential race.
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
That's an excellent idea, actually.
Feb '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
It is good that Mert is asking. It is so easy to get this wrong even when done with the best of intentions.
Every once in awhile, someone here is Israel - a politician or one of the "good government" types - makes this kind of proposal, but it's as though they have not yet taken eighth grade civics. They treat the American example as a "pick and choose" thing, raher than a system of meshing parts.
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
The fundamental question of modern democracy is whether one can sustain self-government on an extended territory. Montesquieu's initial answer in the first part of The Spirit of Laws was that one cannot. Later, he suggests one expedient -- federalism -- and hints at another: the separation of powers. The American Founders combined these two expedients. The danger is that emergencies of the sort that large states are prey to will force a concentration of power in the hands of a single executive (which is what happened to Rome). Our answer was to devolve most responsibilities to the local level; to create a unitary executive at the center to handle emergencies in the sphere where they are most likely to appear (foreign policy), and to hold that executive accountable for what he has done through the legislature. In the absence of federalism, a loose party structure of the sort to which federalism gives rise in the US, a genuine separation of powers sustained by bicameralism, and term limits for the President, what Erdogan proposes will result in despotism.
Your friend might want to read The Federalist in light of Books 8 through 11 of Montesquieu's Spirit of Laws.
Edited on Mar 3, 2011 at 5:45amSep '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
LowcountryJoe
May I suggest he also look at the Anti-Federalist papers, as well. Some very wise dudes on that side too. · Mar 3 at 4:51am
Bah. You beat me to it.
Jan '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Franklin Roosevelt being the closest we've gotten to any sort of despot or dictator as president (at least as far as I'm concerned), I would suggest studying the New Deal legislation of the 1930s and especially FDR's battles with the Supreme Court of that era.
I would also recommend studying the Alien & Sedition Acts and the election of 1800. Happening within little more than a decade of the constitutional and ratification debates, this little episode shows that even a carefully crafted constitution couldn't keep some of the very people who wrote the thing from abusing their power.
Edited on Mar 3, 2011 at 6:00amJul '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
I remain in awe of George Washington, particularly his setting aside command of the Army and limiting himself to two terms in office. His example, coupled with his high character, is one of the many ways he significantly aided the establishment of the Republic and why, along with Lincoln, he is regarded as one of our two best Presidents. Some of the logic of Washington's character and acts can be seen from Addison's Cato, a play Washington studied.
Gosh, we were and are extraordinarily fortunate.
May '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
I would tell Mert that the ultimate check upon government and obstruction to despotism is culture, the sum of the values and virtues of a given people. As history shows, governments often proceed without regard for their own constitutions (Soviet Union) or proceed without constitutions at all (England). All the checks and balances, procedural rules, and separations of power in the world won't halt a culture that rejects civil liberties in favor of abject servility to the state.
As far as political configurations go, I'd tell Mert that the more political power is decentralized, the less likely a nation will fall victim to a leviathan state. As political power is centralized, the governmental entity enjoying the centralization is in a better position to overstep its bounds. When political power is decentralized, it faces greater resistance when it attempts to expand its authority. As political power is spread, it becomes more difficult for any one state to exert coercion against another or against its own people. Hence, separating the production, enforcement and interpretation of laws, reducing the the size of political jurisdictions, maximizing the delegation of tasks to local political authorities, etc. - these are all examples of decentralizing power.
Edited on Mar 3, 2011 at 6:38amMay '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Tell Mert that if he's looking for that political configuration that has succeeded best in hedging against tyranny, he should examine Switzerland. Its a non-EU member, its an uber decentralized confederacy (yes!), its probably the freest place in Europe, its super clean and riff-raffless, and its gun ownership rate makes the U.S. look like a bunch of [expletive - plural].
Edited on Mar 3, 2011 at 6:59amSep '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
I would tell Mert that the ultimate check upon government and obstruction to despotism is culture, the sum of the values and virtues of a given people.
That reminds me: If you are curious about culture then there is no better reflection than Josef Pieper's Leisure: The Basis of Culture. Here's a link to a 1999 Essay by Roger Kimball at the New Criterion entitled Leisure and Its Discontents.
Feb '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
I just want to echo what Bob Forrester said about the importance of George Washington in setting the precedents that exerted great influence over the way that the government took shape and developed in the early years. I highly recommend Ron Chernow's recent biography of Washington. I really think we can't overstate the importance of this one man's character in setting the US on the right path.
Oct '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
"Mert is eager better to understand better why, in America, a presidential system does not result in dictatorship."
1) term limits
2) presidents can be impeached
Presidential systems can benefit presidential candidates or cult figures who are popular with the masses. In the presidential system, you are voting for the person, not the party. if erdogan is the most popular politician in turkey, then the opposition has good reasons to oppose the change for now.
Edited on Mar 3, 2011 at 8:05amMay '10
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
I'm probably just summarizing points from other posts, but I usually trace the failure of presidential models in other nations to two related factors:
(1) The absence of dual sovereignty in those nations (i.e., there are no states in the sense of the "United States"), and
(2) The national government's exercise of plenary authority (versus the U.S. government, which is a creature of the Constitution's grant of enumerated powers from the states, which exercise plenary authority subject to Constitutional protections).
Absent dual sovereignty and (limited) enumerated powers, the presidential model is often a vehicle of mischief and mayhem. Being ignorant of Turkey I can't come down one way or the other, but my tin foil hat tells me it has nothing approaching a notion of dual sovereignty and I don't think Erdogan is looking for anything less than plenary power. I'd take my chances with the parliamentary system.
Edited on Mar 3, 2011 at 8:11amFeb '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
I would suggest "Ratification" by Pauline Maier. It was published in 2010. She did an interview or presentation on book tv (go to booktv.org and type in Pauline Maier). I'm in the middle of reading it myself. It lays out ratification of the constitution in various states. The book does not go into great detail about the Constitutional Convention in Philadelphia, but there are enough pointers there to get you started with other work.
Be careful with the Federalist Papers. I certainly recommend them but they are partisan documents written in the context of a heated political battle and should be read in such a light.
Feb '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Claire first of all thanks a lot for the introduction. I can clearly see all the good people in ricochet are too kind to share a lot and spent time for a foreigner. I am honored and more motivated...
Feb '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Ajax Telamônios: Franklin Roosevelt being the closest we've gotten to any sort of despot or dictator as president (at least as far as I'm concerned), I would suggest studying the New Deal legislation of the 1930s and especially FDR's battles with the Supreme Court of that era.
I would also recommend studying the Alien & Sedition Acts and the election of 1800. Happening within little more than a decade of the constitutional and ratification debates, this little episode shows that even a carefully crafted constitution couldn't keep some of the very people who wrote the thing from abusing their power. · Mar 3 at 5:55am
Edited on Mar 03 at 06:00 am
Especially FDR's battles againts Supreme Court can be quite interesting. Because i think that "How the Supreme Court is limiting the powers of the President ? How it checks it ? " can be another good subject for a thesis...
Feb '11
Re: My Turkish Friend Has A Few Questions About How America Works
Mert Nomer,
You are beginning an extremely interesting study and I would be interested in knowing what you think is applicable and what is not applicable and why for this is not only a contrast of place and culture but also of time. Certainly, not anything right away but if you were to check in from time to time with thoughts on this, it would be very interesting. Cheers and good luck!