Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Some hours after I posted Wisconsin: Turning the Tables, I added an update, pointing to a report that Dr. Kathy Oriel, Associate Professor of Medicine and Director of the Madison Residency Program in the University of Wisconsin at Madison’s Department of Family Medicine had given an interview on WKOW TV in which she came clean about what the doctors handing out medical excuses to delinquent schoolteachers were up to.
There is now more information up at The PJ Tatler, which quotes from a story issued by the Associated Press:
Doctors from numerous hospitals set up a station near the Capitol to provide notes covering public employees’ absences. Family physician Lou Sanner, 59, of Madison [Associate Professor of Medicine at the University of Wisconsin], said he had given out hundreds of notes. Many of the people he spoke with seemed to be suffering from stress, he said.
“What employers have a right to know is if the patient was assessed by a duly licensed physician about time off of work,” Sanner said. “Employers don’t have a right to know the nature of that conversation or the nature of that illness. So it’s as valid as every other work note that I’ve written for the last 30 years.”
Among the doc tors from the medical school who were reportedly engaged in similar conduct were Professors Anne Eglash, Hannah Keevil, and James Shropshire. According to AP, the University of Wisconsin is investigating. “Right now,” says the PJ Tatler, “it appears likely that these doctors, as well as apparently committing fraud and conspiracy to commit fraud, are also violating medical records laws, confidentiality laws, and may be a little out of the bounds of their malpractice insurance.”
It is, of course, possible that the University of Wisconsin will dodge its responsibilities in this matter, and it is entirely conceivable that the medical establishment in the Badger State will do the same. But there is in Wisconsin, I am told, a qui tam law, empowering ordinary citizens to prosecute malefactors whom the authorities decline to pursue. As I said yesterday, there is trouble a-brewin’.
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Sep '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Good. [Expletive] unethical liberal doctors.
Jul '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
It is useful for civil servants to learn that being on a public payroll does not place them above the law. If the university that encourages this belief does not discharge its duty I would hope there is a Badger tea partier out there who will see that justice is done.
May '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
I wonder how many of these physicians present work for the university or state or local health departments versus private practice?
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
My bet is that nearly all of them work in the public sector. Everyone named thus far fits into that category.
Jan '11
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
So these doctors are committing fraud so that a bunch of striking teachers can have an excuse to abandon their students (who they so care for) and try to squeeze some more blood out of the governments' stones. There have got to be some consequences for that, don't you think?
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
It looks like unprofessional conduct all around (the MDs and the teachers alike) -- grounds for dismissal, I should think.
Oct '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Paul A. Rahe:
I wanted to look at Dr. Sanner's quote because it is obvious that he firmly believes what he is doing is defensible. I see a problem with "duly licensed physician" because that license is contingent upon meeting the standards outlined by the Wisconsin Medical Board. His license is only valid so far as he complies with those guidelines (as I understand it in my limited understanding) and this note practice might itself compromise such guidelines. Also, I disagree with his validity of the practice on the licensure premise because unless he has been practicing street corner medicine for 30 years, this is drastically different. What measures of stress were noted and documented per HIPAA in such a public setting, even a measly blood pressure/pulse?
Edited on Feb 21, 2011 at 8:22amDec '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Oriel: 9/2008 $1000 to Obama for America
Eglash: 10/2004 $250 to Tammy Baldwin for Congress
Jon Keevil, a physician from Madison, WI (undoubtedly the husband): 10/2004 $1000 to DNC
9,10/2006: $450 to Moveon.org
4,9/2008: $1250 to Obama for America
12/2009,1,10/2010: $1500 to Russ Feingold
Shropshire: 11/2000: $200 to DNC
10/1998: $200 to Russ Feingold
11/2003: $200 to Moveon.org
Nothing on Sanner, undoubtedly he's the only one of the bunch without provable political activity and so he's the media guy.
Trying to see if I can track down contributions to WI state
Dec '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
OK, some Google-fu here:
http://cfis.wi.gov/Public/Registration.aspx?page=ReceiptList
Oriel: 10/2010 $200 Barrett for Governor
Shropshire: 10/2010 $25 Barrett for Governor (why bother, cheapskate?)
None of the others show up.
Dec '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Paul A. Rahe
It looks like unprofessional conduct all around (the MDs and the teachers alike) -- grounds for dismissal, I should think. · Feb 21 at 7:30am
I think the teachers will largely get away with it. At worst they'll have the day's pay docked. The doctors are in bigger trouble. The whole idea of a doctor's note depends on the assumed integrity of doctors. If you can't assume that, the whole thing is useless.
Jun '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
While fraudulent on it's face, I'm not sure the doctors behavior goes beyond the bounds of their medical licenses. I'm sure in each case they can say the "patient" was suffering from excessive stress or fatigue. Clearly unprofessional, but illegal? I wonder if the doctors will need notes from each other for taking sick days away from their clinics, where real sick people are waiting for them,
May '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Bruce Hendricksen:
Clearly unprofessional, but illegal?
There's a third category: unethical.
Dec '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Does it matter if the doctors avoid legal or ethical sanctions? Their actions only serve to make the teachers look that much more contemptuous of the public. Hey, if a doctor tells me that I'm too stressed to work and that a protest march and shouting matches with political opponents is going to REDUCE my stress, he's a quack and a political hack.
Oct '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Bruce: " Clearly unprofessional, but illegal?"
The teachers claiming sick pay are commiting fraud; the doctors are facilitating that fraud. Clearly illegal.
Dec '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
"Patient, Doctor and Society (PDS) welcomes James Shropshire, MD, as PDS 2 course director. PDS 2 is the second in a series of four semesters that are devoted to teaching history, physical exam skills, ethics, evidence-based medicine and health care in society to first- and second-year medical students.
"Shropshire has both lectured and taught in PDS since 2002, always receiving excellent evaluations from students. He is clinical associate professor of family medicine and practices at UW Health Monona Clinic. Dr. Shropshire earned his medical degree from the University of Wisconsin and completed his residency at the University of Minnesota Department of Family and Community Medicine."
http://www.fammed.wisc.edu/node/16156
Edited on Feb 21, 2011 at 10:43amJun '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Sorry, but your argument is absurd on its face. If they were suffering from excessive stress or fatigue they would have been home in bed wouldn't they? Not marching in the cold, shouting and chanting at the top of their lungs in Madison...doesn't sound very fatigued to me.
This is fraud pure and simple and these doctors should be stripped of their ability to practice medicine. If their affiliated university won't do it, then patriots in Wisconsin should sue them and bring them to justice. I'm happy to contribute to a fund that will see this through.
May '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
It was the dispensing of indulgences that led the the Reformation.
Jun '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
Well, I'm not defending these physicians for an instant. What they are doing is disgusting and, yes, unethical. But you have to work really hard at losing your medical license. I just think that what we would all like to see happen, and how this will actually play out are two different things. I just think these docs will end up being a side show. I would absolutely love to be wrong about this, though.
Aug '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
My very strong suspicion is that nothing will happen with this and if anything does it will provoke a backlash that hurts the Republicans.
Lots of states have "medical" marijuana and it's an open secret that the overwhelming majority of the patients are potheads rather than cancer or glaucoma patients and the doctors who write their prescriptions are party to fraud. Nonetheless medical weed is politically popular and the feds under Clinton, GWB, and Obama have decided it would be bad optics to prosecute physicians and have let it slide.
Similarly, to prosecute doctors for writing transparently fraudulent sick leave excuses for political activists -- even when the docs admit on camera and in writing that they completely understand what they are doing -- would strike many voters/jurors/judges as politically vindictive and an assault on professional autonomy.
I'm not making an "ought" case here, just making an informed prediction.
Oct '10
Re: Medical Malpractice in Madison?
As a member of that professional class, I am in disagreement with their actions. However, understanding the mind set, I would imagine that their justification would take the form of an act of civil disobedience. That being the case, under the ethics of civil disobedience, the individual choosing the act, also chooses with it the civil consequences of his act. Therefore, IMHO, the institutions employing these physicians and/or the professional associations governing them should investigate them and bring action against them where appropriate.