Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
One of the reasons that American libertarians as a political movement never amount to anything is that they can be incredibly intolerant people. This may seem counterintuitive, but while a great many fiscal and social conservatives are willing to seek compromise in common purpose, libertarians are forever in search of hills to die on for their noble and incorruptible principles, particularly when it comes to locally grown produce or which is the best Von Mises book (Human Action you say? Poseur!). Libertarians form factions within factions, cliques within cliques, and the more libertine they are, the more oppressively dull.
Consider the response of some of the more urban libertarians to the Tea Party, which obviously contains many libertarian minded individuals. But survey data also indicates that much of the Tea Party is opposed to abortion and generally traditionalist in perspective on marriage – they are and were disaffected small-government conservatives, not just fiscal ones. Upon discovering this, some big city libertarians became strongly anti-Tea Party, including certain ones, like David Boaz of the Cato Institute, who took to lambasting Sarah Palin and other Tea Party figures as dull-witted country mice. Where’s the evangelism, folks? If churches took such attitudes toward theological questions, no religious body would exist beyond one or two people.
See this rant from Boaz for a measure of the fault lines between the vast majority of the right and the tiny minority of true libertarians. Boaz argues that conservatives are awful because they have a bad record on personal freedom. Allow me a bit of devil’s advocate: “Conservatives, like National Review, supported state-imposed racial segregation in the 1950s and 1960s.” Does Boaz support the Civil Rights Act, which included government mandates over the behavior of private businesses regarding segregation? Forget whether that’s right or wrong: how exactly is that libertarian? “Conservatives opposed legal and social equality for women.” Does Boaz support the Equal Rights Amendment? Why not? Was Barry Goldwater wrong to oppose it? “Conservatives supported laws banning homosexual acts among consenting adults… Conservatives still oppose equal marriage rights for gay couples.” Is Boaz not a federalist? Does he disagree with Justice Thomas’s opinion on the matter that this is not an item for the federal purview? Does he believe in a living constitution? “Conservatives (and plenty of liberals) support the policy of drug prohibition, which results in nearly a million arrests a year for marijuana use.” Sure, but what about crack and heroin? And any libertarian who supports drug legalization prior to the end of the welfare state is not really thinking this through. Prior to that happening, isn’t legalization (as opposed to lighter sentencing) just an act of redistribution and subsidization? “Conservatives support state-imposed prayers and other endorsements of religion in public schools.” I’m not sure about that; I can’t recall the last “state-imposed” prayer law. They do support, however, I must admit, that short ecumenical (but Christian) prayer that is offered in the halls of the U.S. Capitol prior to every day of Congressional action. For Boaz, this is evidently a bridge too far toward the impurities of socialism. Get out of the tent, you blasted liberty haters! There is only room enough here for the truly pure of heart. The ideal libertarian political party, you see, is a party of one.
- Comment (60)
- · Quote
- · UnfollowFollow (6)
Comments:
May '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
I swear, the space-time continuum will collapse into a black hole netherworld of errant neutrinos before we as a species will see the end to the last ditch "Libertarians are just libertines" argument.
Edited on June 16, 2012 at 7:34amApr '12
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Michael-- ditto the last of the "you SoCons need to ignore what you care about and care about my priorities NOW!" junk.
Been going on as long as I've been watching politics, even before I could name what I am.
Totally not impressed with the recent Libertarian impulse to try to claim movements for their own; just because the TEA party didn't explicitly list non-Libertarian things doesn't mean we were libertarians. (Capitalization is important; as important as the difference between Ron Paul supporters and Ronulans.)
Nov '11
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Libertarians should replace the Democrats and then we'd actually have a choice. Democrats are socialists and Republicans are centrists. There would then be meaning to the term Independent as now it just means 'I don't like either one'. It seems publicly & politically big L Libertarians have made their stand on social issues such as SSM and legalizing marijuana and intellectual arguments that come down to freedom=slavery appealing to Dems, and alienating many Conservatives. Focusing on less Big Government would result in solving many of the social problems. Once again I believe Libertarians, with the Tea Party's help, should focus on our Tax system (Flat Tax) and actually accomplish a big blow to Big Government. Not just exercising intellect discussing ideologies and thus actually winning (yes, we can discuss stuff, but if you don't win who cares?). They would need to court Conservatives and not Democrats (fools game anyway). Reign in the Freak Flag, and focus on small Government goals that actually accomplish something.
As a Conservative I would most likely vote Libertarian over Republican but not if their campaign revolves around social issues. They are just like liberals at that point.
Nov '11
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
I would like to add that the common goal should be to get rid of the socialists (politically) and think this is a real possibility if Conservatives and Libertarians unite.
Aug '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
But we do unite. How could we get into ridiculous squabbles like this one if we didn't spend a heckuva lot of time together?
It's like a marriage. A dysfunctional marriage, perhaps, but a marriage nonetheless. And we all know how important marriage is.
PS: I'm all for keeping the fun in dysfunctional. It's the only way to live ;-)
Edited on June 16, 2012 at 6:16pmAug '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Noesis Noeseos:
And may Ludwig haunt all heretics to von Mises!
C'mon, MFR, you must have your Constitution of Liberty down pat. The party is waiting for your solemn address!
Stuff written by Hayek? Perhaps... Von Mises?...
I tried to pull a Bachmann and read Human Action on the beach last summer. At nearly 900 pages, and as densely-written as math or law papers, I got... to page 69 and petered out. Really reading something like that requires contemplation -- and marginal notes. Which I apparently didn't feel like doing on the beach.
I kept on getting distracted by seagulls, for one thing. "Oh look, that gull is eating zebra mussels. How green of him." Or, "I wonder what that gull over there is doing with that hypodermic syringe."
Edited on June 16, 2012 at 10:10pmFeb '12
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
How many self-proclaimed libertarians are willing to say that they support the right of a real estate developer to build a subdivision that excludes blacks, Jews, homosexuals, and people with green eyes? Would they all, or would this be a good test for whether someone really values property rights and individual freedom?
Aug '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Eric Rasmusen:
How many self-proclaimed libertarians are willing to say that they support the right of a real estate developer to build a subdivision that excludes blacks, Jews, homosexuals, and people with green eyes? Would they all, or would this be a good test for whether someone really values property rights and individual freedom?
This test is only reliable if it's really true that libertarians are so in love with Uncompromising that they just can't wait to find that next hill to die on.
Libertarians find certain uncompromising poses useful, provocative, or just plain fun, but the reality is usually that they've also got some idea of how trade-offs work and a healthy appreciation for self-interest.
There's the logical answer to your question. Then there's the strategical question of, "Which battles do you pick, and should this be one of them right now?" And there's also the matter of what a prudent person feels like typing on a public forum in the age of Google...
Dec '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Isn't it an amazing coincidence that those attempting to shrink the tent are always of some other ideological bent?
Dec '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Michael Labeit
I swear, the space-time continuum will collapse into a black hole netherworld of errant neutrinos before we as a species will see the end to the last ditch "Libertarians are just libertines" argument. · 12 hours ago
Edited 11 hours ago
You misrepresent the argument. It isn't that any one libertarian is a libertine. It's that libertarianism's most ardent adherents will only be satisfied when every individual gets to decide for himself what is right and what is wrong (consenting adults and all that) -- when the Tao is atomized into nothingness. Moral relativism is what strict libertarians and leftists have in common.
Dec '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Aside: You must be drumming up business for Ricochet on Hot Air, Ben. I noticed this is your second post in as many days to make the headlines there. Good work!
Aug '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Just wondering... If you spell "poser" poseur, are you being a poseur? Or just a poser?
Aug '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Western Chauvinist
It's that libertarianism's most ardent adherents will only be satisfied... when the Tao is atomized into nothingness.
I don't see this ever actually happening. Humans have an innate desire for order, morally as well as physically. True, some of us are bad at living an ordered life in one respect or another, whether in the most abstract moral sense or in the far more humdrum sense of being poorly organized. But not leading a sufficiently ordered life... kinda sucks.
What I think is that some libertarians lash out at all order now because what frightens them most is a world filled with anti-Tao order. Is it immature to be so frightened by anti-Tao order that you miss the Tao that still is the world? Yes. But it's easy to sympathize: there's a lot of anti-Tao order out there, and it can be rather overwhelming.
May '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Oh really? How do you know this?
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
I'm totally late to this vent-fest of Ben's but this strikes me as quite a bit of mileage to get out of one David Boaz blog post.
But if I may offer a thought. You think we're awful and that berating us will make us more friendly toward conservative statism. Is this really an effective strategy?
Because to me, it just makes me feel even more unwelcome.
Apr '12
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Mollie Hemingway, Ed.: I'm totally late to this vent-fest of Ben's but this strikes me as quite a bit of mileage to get out of one David Boaz blog post.
But if I may offer a thought. You think we're awful and that berating us will make us more friendly toward conservative statism. Is this really an effective strategy?
Because to me, it just makes me feel even more unwelcome. · 6 hours ago
So, how should the SoCons who have dealt with it for the last three elections or so feel about it?
Apr '11
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Mr. Boaz' opinions seem to me to be less persuasive on this point than opinion polls, and opinions polls strongly disagree with the "equal split" hypothesis. His opinions do prove, and here polling supports his opinions, that there are some libertarians who'll vote Blue this time. This is partly why adding Johnson is enough to swing some polls, but not all that many; he's likely to keep New Mexico blue, and somewhat less likely to swing New Hampshire to Obama. Ohio, Virginia, and other very close states might be swung by even a small number of votes, but it takes twice as many votes for a 75/25 demographic to put you over the top as it does a 100/0 demographic. He's a minor, but not trivial, objective enemy of freedom.
Jan '12
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Midget Faded Rattlesnake
Noesis Noeseos:
And may Ludwig haunt all heretics to von Mises!
C'mon, MFR, you must have yourConstitution of Libertydown pat. The party is waiting for your solemn address!
Stuff written by Hayek? Perhaps... Von Mises?...
I tried to pull a Bachmann and read Human Action on the beach last summer. At nearly 900 pages, and as densely-written as math or law papers, I got... to page 69 and petered out. Really reading something like that requires contemplation -- and marginal notes. Which I apparently didn't feel like doing on the beach.
I kept on getting distracted by seagulls, for one thing. "Oh look, that gull is eating zebra mussels. How green of him." Or, "I wonder what that gull over there is doing with that hypodermic syringe." · Jun 16 at 7:41am
Edited on Jun 16 at 1:10pm
My dear lady (if I have overstepped the bounds of propriety, please rebuke me in private email):
Never, never read von Mises in the heat; your brain will frazzle. I suggest repairing to the coolest nook in the garden, pouring a glass of ice water of lemonade, and proceeding gingerly.
Jan '12
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Uh, by any chance was "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" shimmering in your brain at the time?
Edited on June 18, 2012 at 7:14amAug '10
Re: Libertarian Tent-Shrinkers
Noesis Noeseos
Uh, by any chance was "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" shimmering in your brain at the time?
If reading von Mises in the heat makes your brain frazzle, what need is there of chemical aid?
As for the gull with the syringe, gulls have no sense of delicacy about the bits of beach trash they use in their aerial games.