Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
George Savage ·
Jun 21, 2010 at 1:08pm
Jonah makes a vital point over at NRO:
Scientists are technicians, not moral philosophers. While they can provide facts that inform good decision-making, they can’t distill morality in a test tube. Politicians shouldn’t abdicate to the guys in white coats their responsibilities to answer moral questions the white-coats can’t answer.
We see a sort of Displaced Expertise Syndrome at play all over -- quick: how long since you've seen a talented actor holding forth in a quasi-official capacity on the details of, say, foreign affairs? -- but nowhere more than in the generalized deference to the Scientist; even when the scientist is out of his depth, speaking gobbledegook, or worse.
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May '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
"Scientists are technicians, not moral philosophers."
Only if the scientists I know really felt that way. Truth be told, after three years working as an undergraduate researcher in academia, many scientists I know see themselves as activists first, objective investigators of truth second. Look no further than the ClimateGate emails to see how scientists can pervert their work for political (and monetary) gain.
Not to say all scientists are that way, of course. Most engineers I know don't behave this way, but most engineers base their work on cold, objective calculations, rather than subjective observations. Physicists and other "hard sciences" are still run this way, but branching out from there, (biology, climate science, economics, etc.) and you get a heavy dose of opinion with interspersed facts. When systems get too complex to calculate, you introduce (expert) opinion-based models and produce more subjective results. It's still science, but it's hardly as objective as the President seems to think.
Of course, all of this is irreverent if you think political ideology can be based on some objective truth to begin with; given that basis, you can rationalize all the politics you want... based on science, of course.
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
Jonathan Lanctot: "When systems get too complex to calculate, you introduce (expert) opinion-based models and produce more subjective results. It's still science, but it's hardly as objective as the President seems to think.
Of course, all of this is irreverent if you think political ideology can be based on some objective truth to begin with; given that basis, you can rationalize all the politics you want... based on science, of course. · Jun 21 at 1:59pm
That's a great way to look at it. I was amazed to hear Obama talk on and on during the campaign -- and after -- about his promise to "restore" science to its rightful place. He seemed awfully confident that "science" is a Democrat.
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
I first noticed this Displaced Expertise Syndrome in business school, George. (As you know, my MBA never really took. But it enabled me to witness a lot of interesting stuff.) Whereas most of my classmates had spent several years in business before enrolling, I'd spent six years in the federal government. Whereas I tended to suppose businesspeople were competent and all-knowing--to this day, I tend to quail before successful entrepreneurs, assuming they're just smarter than most people--I knew for darned certain, from my own pretty extensive experience, that the federal government was for the most part an inefficient and unholy mess. But my classmates? With them it was just the reverse. Whereas they tended to see business figures as competent only over the very limited range of the activities they preformed for a living every day, they assumed--simply assumed--that the government knew more, behaved better, and proved a far better and more disinterested guardian of the economy than the free markets. (When we took a straw poll, Dukakis beat George W. Bush among MBA students by a wide margin.)
Jun '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
I think it was the amateur philosopher, Eric Hoffer, who said, when looking for books on a new subject, you occasionally find two books by the same expert--one thick, one thin. The thin one will contain what the author knows, and the thick one will contain what the author thinks he, the expert, ought to know. Read the thin one.
May '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
Rob Long
He seemed awfully confident that "science" is a Democrat. · Jun 21 at 2:22pm
I think the President should be confident in his assumption. Scientific research takes place primarily in private industry and on university campuses. The latter has a groupthink mentality towards politics and the promotion structure ensures any political dimension of research skews towards that groupthink. The former is always dismissed as inherently biased towards whatever economic ends the industry wants.
E.g., when a university releases a study reinforcing left-wing positions we hear about what academics or researchers have discovered. When a privately funded researcher releases a study, one will inevitably hear about the big bad corporation that funded the project.
Jun '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
Why should anyone think that scientists are any less the cognitive-misers than, say, the Vancouver women’s glee club. Let’s face it, persons who are shrewd or smart or talented in their primary field of interest/endeavour are very likely to think themselves smart, even brilliant, in all fields. Hence we get the physicist as moral philosopher and the entrepreneur shouting government ought to be run as a business. Most of the time neither one knows what they are talking about, but they sound good saying whatever it is thay say. Add to this the sycophantic adulation the well timed bon mot engenders and you have instant public erudition on any subject known to man as well as some subjects unknown to man. At the risk of being labelled a cynic, we all learn early that most of the time we can slide farther on bu****it than on gravel, and we go, aslidin' whenever someone, anyone, asks our opinion. Then some real expert comes along and lays down the gravel and. . . . Let's just say it ain't a pretty sight.
May '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
One pitfall of this line of reasoning is this: Imagine what kind of crazy world we'd live in if we left our ethics up to ethicists, our social structures up to sociologists, our morality up to moralists, etc. There are some areas of public discourse where lack of qualifications should not be an impediment to entering the debate.
May '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
This has nothing to do with ethics, but Johnathan astutely notes an point here that I haven't seen made yet (and come to think of it, one I ought to write a column about): in regards to practical matters like the Deepwater Horizon leak, you shouldn't be calling scientists for help in the first place--you should be calling engineers. There is a difference, although it's one that many non-technical academics (like Barack Obama) and liberal arts majors (like almost all of the media) don't comprehend. Asking a molecular physicist (no matter how renowned) like Steven Chu how to plug a massive undersea oil leak is like going to a neurologist when you need to have your anterior cruciate ligament repaired. Yes, the person you're talking to is called "doctor," but his area of expertise has little or nothing to do with your problem.
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
Hey, check out this morning's WSJ editorial about Obama's new drilling commission. Seven members - all environmental activists not one with any expertise in drilling engineering. Obama did put one engineer on the panel - he specializes in physics and optics, which I suppose is "close enough for government work."
May '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
Will and Adam, you raise a great point. But I suppose to someone with almost no technical knowledge, all technical knowledge seems interchangeable ("It's all Greek to me"), and the only way to tell them apart is whether they have a Nobel Prize in sciency things.
May '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
This just provided me with my latte's worth of Ricochet for the month! The Vancouver women's glee club has become my new straw man for every future argument (until I hear a better one!) I can see them now all lined up on risers with their short, no-fuss haircuts, their slimming black wool crepe slacks and their colorfully embroidered vests. Thanks Cas!
Jun '10
Re: Jonah Goldberg on Science and Politics
This discussion reminds me of one of my favorite movie quotes:
"...your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should." ~ Jurassic Park