Joe Frazier. American Hero.
The loss of a boyhood idol makes writing his obituary difficult. I loved Joe Frazier. He was an American hero.
My first recollection of wanting to be anything when I grew up was to be a boxer. I wanted to bob and weave like Joe and have people talk about my punch like they did Smokin’ Joe’s left hook. The most watched sport in my house was boxing, and any big fight was an event.
See that picture to the right taken during Ali-Frazier 1? It’s an iconic photo you’ve probably seen before. It’s also a family heirloom - the gentleman to the right in the photo in the white shirt and tie is my uncle Billy Dello.
Though only 7 years old at the time, I recall the night of Ali-Frazier 1 vividly. I couldn’t see the fight, but remember waiting to hear the result with the excitement of Christmas Eve.
Of course I didn’t understand the socio-political contest that Ali-Frazier 1 took on (neither did Joe). For me it boiled down to what 7 year old boys could understand – one guy had a big mouth and bragged too much and the other guy was going to shut it. Joe did.
Growing up in a predominately black neighborhood, I’ve lived through some times where I’m certain the predominately white media got it all wrong. After Joe won, while I’m sure radical blacks like Panthers and Nation of Islam members were crying in their misplaced hopes they put in a boxing match along with anti-war whites, everyday blacks weren’t so tied to “the movement.”
The following day was a school day. Every boy on our playground was yelling “I’m Joe Frazier” followed by a protest of the next closest boy who would pump out up his chest and yell, “No I’m Joe Frazier!” So many fights broke out on the playground that day the teachers couldn’t stop them all, but don’t get the wrong idea. Like boxing itself, these fights were sport. No one was angry. No one stopped being friends when the school bell rang. No one got in trouble. Each of us was trying to show we could be Joe Frazier – the boxer, the hero, the bully-killer.
As I grew older, I became fascinated reading about the politics that subsumed the fight. Once again, the white media got it all wrong, and Joe Frazier was misidentified as something he wasn’t – the “white” fighter as antagonist to the “black” hopes for civil rights that Ali came to represent. Somehow, media turned Ali into black America and Joe into white America.
But take a better look at the men and who they really were – consider which was “more black” and which was the better American.
Joe Frazier was a poor share-cropper’s son from Beaufort South Carolina. He was a farm hand who made his own heavy bag out of a burlap sack and taught himself to box. He was a rugged individual. He was self-reliant. Like many southern blacks Frazier came north to find a better life. He was 15 when he took the bus north by himself.
Muhammad Ali grew up in a suburb in Louisville Kentucky - closer to middle class than anything else. He learned to box in a gym with real equipment and trainers. White boxing mentors took him under wing at 12. He was never a poor southern black as was Joe Frazier. He never embodied the American black experience.
It was an injustice to Joe that they tried to turn him into some sort of Uncle Tom or white man’s fighter. He epitomized the rural American black man. Ironically, it was Ali who was stripped of his Muslim name by the Nation of Islam. Why? Ali refused to stop fighting “for the white man’s money.” Neither was an Uncle Tom, but it was terribly wrong that the media assisted Ali in painted Joe as such.
Both men won the Gold medal for America in the Olympics, but only Ali threw his away in the Ohio River in protest to America. I cringed when they selected him years later to light the Olympic flame. It should have been Joe.
Joe Frazier was a better fighter, a better American and a better representative of blacks than Muhammad Ali.
America will miss Joe Frazier dearly.
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Jul '10
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Actually, Ali's comments started before the first fight, and Frazier won that fight giving Ali his first loss. Unfortunately, that didn't stop Ali from repeating those same slurs. I'm just floored that any one thinks it was no big deal and would even go so far as to make it sound like Frazier was at fault for not simply ignoring them or being "slow-witted" parroting the exact same crap Ali spouted. If someone were to refer to Thomas Sowell as an Uncle Tom or to Clarence Thomas as a gorilla, would you still think it was no big deal? It's shameful that this mentality persists, and that Frazier had to endure it from someone he tried to befriend.
Jun '10
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Only in America.... What a tremendous story this all is. I truly love them both because they were "in the arena":
These two were great Americans, not cold nor timid -- but GREAT.
Jan '11
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
That seems a huge exaggeration. I think most of the world saw the antics as an arrogant, good looking, big mouth getting the better of a kind of slow tough guy in a battle of wits. I don't think many people expected anything more of Joe than a good left hook, and I don't think they thought about him much after he lost. Claiming that the fight had any serious impact on how people viewed racial issues in the country doesn't really hold a lot of water, IMO.
A lot of people hated Ali because he changed his name, dodged the draft and talked trash. Many wanted to see him lose because of his big mouth, but that was true even before he converted to Islam and took a stand against the war. Many were disappointed because Ali proved he was a better fighter. But in the end I think most people saw the fight for what it was, a great piece of entertainment that ultimately didn't really change anything in their life or the world.
Edited on Nov 8, 2011 at 10:59amRe: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
BThompson
That seems a huge exaggeration. I think most of the world saw the antics as an arrogant, good looking, big mouth getting the better of a kind of slow tough guy in a battle of wits. I don't think many people expected anything more of Joe than a good left hook, and I don't think they thought about him much after he lost. Claiming that the fight had any serious impact on how people viewed racial issues in the country doesn't really hold a lot of water, IMO.
There are some interesting documentaries about the fight and how the world saw it. I wish I could remember their names. Worth the watch.
For some reason, boxing seems at times to intertwine with politics. There was nothing like the Louis/Schmeling fight. Both nations, Heads of State included, acted like their country was literally in the ring, not a boxer.
Dec '10
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
BT
Do you think it would be a good idea to forget Hitler, and therefore not let him: "continue to occupy an important space in our minds and hearts"
Mar '11
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
There were several times that Ali got a pass in the ring, not just in the media. Off the top of my head, Jimmy Young and Ken Norton got robbed (arguably twice for Norton). Ali could easily have been another coulda-been had he not been given a very close decision against Doug Jones in 1963 and in 1964 had Angelo Dundee not saved his bacon after Henry Cooper uncoiled a left hook that whacked young Cassius Clay from London to La La Land at the end of the fourth round. Dundee split Clay's glove to buy him time to recover between rounds, otherwise the kid would have been stretched out by Cooper in the fifth.
Ali was hardly the dominant fighter he is often made out to be. He was even less of a man. Fortunately, his statements in recent years have shown a penitent heart, but one would have to be blind, deaf and, well, dense, not to realize the damage he had done.
Edited on Nov 8, 2011 at 12:23pmJan '11
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Foxman: BT
Do you think it would be a good idea to forget Hitler, and therefore not let him: "continue to occupy an important space in our minds and hearts"
Oh come on, are you Godwinning this thread to be funny?
Jul '10
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Tommy De Seno
There are some interesting documentaries about the fight and how the world saw it. I wish I could remember their names. Worth the watch.
For some reason, boxing seems at times to intertwine with politics. There was nothing like the Louis/Schmeling fight. Both nations, Heads of State included, acted like their country was literally in the ring, not a boxer. · Nov 8 at 11:26am
HBO put out two good ones: Ali-Frazier I: One Nation...Divisible about the first fight (The Fight of the Century) and Thrilla in Manila (about the third fight).
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Whiskey Sam
Tommy De Seno
There are some interesting documentaries about the fight and how the world saw it. I wish I could remember their names. Worth the watch.
For some reason, boxing seems at times to intertwine with politics. There was nothing like the Louis/Schmeling fight. Both nations, Heads of State included, acted like their country was literally in the ring, not a boxer. · Nov 8 at 11:26am
HBO put out two good ones: Ali-Frazier I: One Nation...Divisible about the first fight (The Fight of the Century) and Thrilla in Manila (about the third fight). · Nov 8 at 11:56am
Thanks!
Jan '11
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
This seems like a good take on the rivalry.
Edited on Nov 8, 2011 at 12:57pmMay '10
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Boxing is neither sweet, nor a science. It isn't even the art of self-defense. It is brutality and ugliness shrouded in legitimacy by calling it "sport."
From 1932 to 1960, boxing was a sanctioned championship event of the NCAA. At the last championship, Charlie Mohr, a middle-weight from Wisconsin collapsed from a brain hemorrhage and died a week later. College boxing died with Charlie Mohr.
Championship events used to be 15 rounds. That's 45 minutes of concussion-inducing blows. It leads to dementia pugilistica. Yes, they give old, mentally incapacitated boxers their own Latin diagnosis. The Mayo Clinic says head trauma can lead to anywhere from a four-to-eleven-fold increase in likely development of Parkinson's.
I've often wondered if Ali has career regrets. We can't ask him because the Parkinson's has robbed him of his ability to speak.
Olympic boxing is down to three, three-minute rounds. It ought to go down on the canvas and stay there. The spectacle of watching well-dressed and affluent people crowd around a ring to watch two black or Latino men beat the crap out of each other is deplorable.
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
EJHill: Boxing is neither sweet, nor a science. It isn't even the art of self-defense. It is brutality and ugliness shrouded in legitimacy by calling it "sport."
The best way to tell that it is a sport and not two guys beating each other up is by watching the guys who try to get in late or make a career change to do it. They can't. They fail miserably.
It is a sport with particular skill sets and rules. Boxing is as much about making the other guy miss as it is hitting the other guy. Not everyone can do it, and those who are good at it spend years full of hours perfecting it.
It is sport. It is drama. It is wonderful.
Until they stopped enforcing clinches as a foul sometime in the 1980's. Then it just became boring.
May '10
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Professional assassins have their own particular "skill sets" as well.
The object of this "sport" is to brutally beat another human until he quits, loses consciousness or is taken pity on by an old guy in a bow tie. And for the amusement of others.
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Love your post, Tommy, and I'm also enjoying the comments.
When I was a very green reporter in my 20s working the phones at the NY Post, I was assigned a story about Laila Ali, who was making her way to the top of the (fledgling, pathetic) women's boxing game. I spoke with Laila and, of course, I tried desperately to get a quote from Ali himself, but couldn't get to him. (I started my career saying I didn't want to leave it without ever interviewing William F. Buckley and Muhammad Ali. Sadly, I retired 0-for-2)
On a whim, I called some gym in Philly where Frazier's friends supposedly were. When someone answered, I introduced myself and said I was trying to track down Joe Frazier. "Speaking," he said. I can still remember my face turning hot and stammering in disbelief and panic. I didn't actually have questions prepared!! Serves me right. Of course, he was funny, gracious and gave me the best quotes about his daughter (then in training to fight Laila!) as well as his relationship & fights with Ali. One of the highlights of my short career. RIP, indeed.
Oct '10
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Well said, Tommy. Thanks. Smokin' Joe was one of my heroes. He was one of the greatest heavyweight fighters of all time and a class individual.
Jan '11
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
EJHill
The object of this "sport" is to brutally beat another human until he quits, loses consciousness or is taken pity on by an old guy in a bow tie.
With respect, I disagree.
Boxing isn't chess, and it isn't dancing. It's tough and it involves hitting. But so does football. Both sports test the combination of speed and strength.
There's a simple fact about sports. To maximize strength (i.e., make a good hit), you need to have your feet firmly planted. But to maximize speed, you have get your feet off the ground. Agility and footwork is the ability to transition from one to other. The skill of most sports (football, boxing, and even tennis) tests that agility; how effectively can you transition from strength to speed, and from speed to strength?
In that, hitting isn't a test of barbarity - it's the measure of strength. A mere thug would never last in the ring; a good boxer would be too fast. A boxer or football player sees a hit the same way a tennis player sees a stroke - he wants to deliver the strongest hit that he can. It isn't personal.
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
Ursula Hennessey:
On a whim, I called some gym in Philly where Frazier's friends supposedly were. When someone answered, I introduced myself and said I was trying to track down Joe Frazier. "Speaking," he said. I can still remember my face turning hot and stammering in disbelief and panic. I didn't actually have questions prepared!! Serves me right. Of course, he was funny, gracious and gave me the best quotes about his daughter (then in training to fight Laila!) as well as his relationship & fights with Ali. One of the highlights of my short career. RIP, indeed. · Nov 8 at 3:52pm
Wow you talked to him! I'm jealous!. I remember the daughters of Ali and Frazier boxing. It was a great match. Frazier's daughter, if I remember correctly, was in her 30's at the time. I thought she won, but I'm a jaded Frazier fan.
Apr '11
Re: Joe Frazier. American Hero.
You say that as though it's a bad thing.
Ali tried to act like a college professor in a milieu where treason wasn't fashionable sophistication, and that milieu, America, reacted to the betrayal. Ali's refusal mattered because Ali really achieved real things, and because he was a fighter who wouldn't help America in a fight.