Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
The battle against obesity makes for some strange bedfellows. The Daily Caller reports that in the food fight between Sarah Palin and Michelle Obama, possible presidential contender Mike Huckabee has taken Obama's side:
Speaking with New York radio host Curtis Sliwa, Gov. Mike Huckabee rejected Sarah Palin’s mocking of Michelle Obama’s childhood nutrition campaign.
Huckabee tells Sliwa that "Michelle Obama is not trying to tell people what to eat, or to force the government’s desires onto people...She’s stating the obvious: we have an obesity crisis in this country."
I'm all for healthy eating and living--and, as I understand it, Huckabee is too--but in fairness to Palin, Obama has done more than state the obvious.
On her show "Sarah Palin's Alaska," Palin has taken aim at Obama's Let's Move program and Healthy Hunger-Free Kids Act, saying, "Where are the s'mores ingredients...This is in honor of Michelle Obama, who said the other day we should not have dessert."
Speaking on the Laura Ingraham show, Palin has also said:
Take her anti-obesity thing that she is on. She is on this kick, right. What she is telling us is she cannot trust parents to make decisions for their own children, for their own families in what we should eat...
Instead of a government thinking that they need to take over and make decisions for us according to some politician or politician's wife's priorities, just leave us alone, get off our back, and allow us as individuals to exercise our own God-given rights to make our own decisions and then our country gets back on the right track.
Palin's argument, very simply, is to keep government out of our lives.
Huckabee, however, at least acknowledges that we have an obesity crisis and wants to do something about it. He says, "health care costs are staggering, with 80% of health care costs going toward chronic disease, a lot of which is caused by obesity. So the first lady's campaign is on target."
Who do you think makes the stronger case--Huckabee or Palin?
I don't see the harm in some sort of non-legislative, cultural campaign--get MTV and facebook on board--that promotes healthy eating and exercise. Perhaps that's what Huckabee should be very specifically promoting.
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Aug '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Andrea Ryan
Louie Mungaray
Andrea and Kennedy- I do not believe we have a crisis of obesity requiring our immediate response. It is certain that each obese individual will come to crisis sooner or later.
The solutions are simple but not easy. By its very nature the problem is discreet to the person's person. The issues of embodiment and liberty are at the core of each case of obesity.
It's a crisis when it burdens society. I share the same resources, so I have a vested interest when it creates a longer wait to see a doctor or use the ER. · Dec 22 at 11:56am
I see and conceed your point regarding who is in crisis. Unfortunately the nature of the beast remains: individual persons in individual bodies freely and slowly destroying their well-being.
So the most effective solution would be-purely for the sake of illustration- something akin to a prison camp. Forced marches and a subsistence diet would certainly reverse obesity, at the cost of all personal liberty.
I am not arguing for one extreme or the other, but the question is: how far should we go in a free society?
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Caryn:
BTW, take it from someone with the appropriate degrees, Epidemiology is junk science. Just for the record. The only good studies are the ones in support of red wine and dark chocolate. In other words, find the study you like and quote it.
I don't know what "appropriate degrees" are, but Epidemiology is not junk science. It's bulk science that explains population health.
We're not talking about moderate obesity. We're talking about morbid obesity and there's a measurement for that. A body mass index greater than 30 is obese by anybody's definition of the word. Greater than 40 they are morbidly obese. They're dangerous to take care of in the operating room, because they have hypertension, diabetes, peripheral vascular disease, cardiovascular disease, cerebrovascular disease, sleep apnea, pulmonary hypertension and they're chronically hypoxic. With a BMI that high, doctors ASSUME they have all these diseases until proven otherwise, because it's a rare patient that doesn't have at least some of these morbidities, if not all of them.
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
They wear out their joints, so they have total knee and total hip replacements at like eight times the normal rate. A BMI of 35 and greater is expensive medical care waiting to happen. And when they do get that care they will have every complication in the book...DVTs, infections (from the diabetes), pneumonia (they can't breathe deeply enough because of the weight), and perioperative MIs, just to name a few. Anyone who denies this is not doing routine clinical care of patients on a daily basis. This isn't about chocolate and wine.
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Louie Mungaray
...So the most effective solution would be-purely for the sake of illustration- something akin to a prison camp. Forced marches and a subsistence diet would certainly reverse obesity, at the cost of all personal liberty.
I am not arguing for one extreme or the other, but the question is: how far should we go in a free society? · Dec 22 at 5:16pm
Did you not read all my other comments in this thread? I repeatedly said I do not want the government to intervene. It's still a crisis. The two have nothing to do with each other. Let the free market decide. Charge super fat people more for their health insurance, so I'm not subsidizing it. Maybe pain in the pocket book will motivate them to make a change.
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Andrea Ryan
We don't live in a vacuum, Kennedy. You can acknowledge a problem exists, that it negatively effects society, and still do nothing about it...· Dec 22 at 1:30pm
Watch! Here's me, doing nothing about it. I mean, were I Cartman's mom, I'd worry. At least we ditched the whole "crisis" label. A crisis is when you ring the alarm and head for the fallout shelter (well, evil lair, in my case).
Jul '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
I wanna push back a little at this point Andrea. While it's true, it's also true that very few people -only those who die suddenly- remain healthy until death. Even if they take great care of themselves.
As you know, we deteriorate. Consequently, comparing the obese to the "healthy" seems like a study about income disparities that doesn't control for age.
In other words, while I'm sure that the obese (and idiot smokers) living to say, age 69 may (health care wise) cost more in total than a clean-livin' 77 year-old, I'd bet the gap closes very quickly in those last eight years. And so every extra year of careful behavior probably isn't nearly the cost saver it might seem, because it's always adding to the tail of a decline.
There are also, of course, non-health related social costs of an extended existence. Social Security, for instance. An extra eight years of collecting matters.
Dec '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Lady Kurobara
Why does anything have to "be done about it"? That is the way liberals think. In a truly free society, people have the right to screw up, even if that means living on nothing but a diet of deep-fried Twinkies.
Hear, hear! The only "obesity crisis" I see is our elephantine government. A lot of really fat people? Sure. A bad thing for those fat people? Certainly. A drain on society? Yep. A crisis? Only if we insist on the government "doing something" about it.
Put the government on a diet. As for the fat people, let 'em eat cake!
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
I think Governor Palin is correct. The Government has failed, as usual, in mandating 'health', in that their primary focus seems to have been disallowing certain foods/drink to be accessible to kids. Why not afford instead programs that promote physical activity? Why not allow a certain amount of ridicule that won't be deemed 'hate speech' or 'bullying' to motivate kids toward maybe not feeling that obesity isn't an optimum choice? Public shunning of smokers has worked (though too often coupled with legislation). Why doesn't Mrs. O speak to some of her fawning designer friends and offer up the idea that loose-fitting fashions hide just the attributes she rails against? Why is the go-to option always to dictate?
Aug '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Freeven
Hear, hear! The only "obesity crisis" I see is our elephantine government. A lot of really fat people? Sure. A bad thing for those fat people? Certainly. A drain on society? Yep. A crisis? Only if we insist on the government "doing something" about it.
Put the government on a diet.
Yes. Uncle Sam is even fatter than we are.
Jul '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
For the heck of it, I'll throw a radically contrarian voice into the mix, because it seems this thread is in need of it. Governor Huckabee and Michelle Obama are absolutely correct: there is no question at all that the negative externalities of obesity in this country are a severe problem. Do they require government regulation? It's probably at least worth investigating. At the very least, there's little reason why the First Lady shouldn't be a strong advocate for healthy diets, in the same way that there exists the President's Council on Physical Fitness.
As serious conservatives, oughtn't we be pushing for ways to reduce public and private expenditures on health care in this country? It would seem that the best way of doing that would be to limit the incidence of heart disease, which (it bears repeating) is the primary cause of premature death in the US. Taxing junk food and encouraging people to eat healthily is as sensible a way to reduce unnecessary costs to society as taxing cigarettes.
And I'm with KarlUB: end the corn subsidies now. This should be a domestic policy rallying point for the GOP.
Dec '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Every time I start to really like Mr. Huckabee he has to go and give me a reason to distrust him. I don't want Michelle Obama anywhere near my life—not in word, thought, or deed.
Edited on Dec 22, 2010 at 11:13pmAug '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Charlie Dameron:
As serious conservatives, oughtn't we be pushing for ways to reduce public and private expenditures on health care in this country?... Taxing junk food and encouraging people to eat healthily is as sensible a way to reduce unnecessary costs to society as taxing cigarettes.
And I'm with KarlUB: end the corn subsidies now. This should be a domestic policy rallying point for the GOP.
Rather than starting by taxing junk food, why not start with your last suggestion: ending corn subsidies (sugar subsidies, etc)? I mean, why tax what is already being subsidized? Why not wait to see what happens when you first take the subsidies away?
Also, our food welfare needs a serious overhaul.
As for ways to reduce public and private spending on healthcare in this country, why not start by repealing ObamaCare, instituting real free-market reform, transitioning Medicare and Medicaid to more sensible systems, tort reform?... Big-picture, I bet these things would be more helpful than an anti-obesity initiative.
So... why not try all these things before embracing a "junk food tax"?
Always remember, fiscal discipline is supposed to be in the service of liberty, not the other way 'round.
Jul '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Caryn:
1) Seems to me the biggest problem is all the people sitting on their butts, particularly kids. Turn off the television, turn off the video games, get rid of the X-box, Wii, cable, internet, and send the little twits outside to play. And stop driving them everywhere!
2) What happened to kids going places by bike? Am I that old that I remember walking a mile to school, walking to friends' houses, bicycling around my college campus? Heck, it wasn't that long ago...
1) Outside to play what? Dodge Ball, Tag, Monkey Bars et. al. are prohibited today. There is nothing Left but video games.
2) Pedophilia happened. (See NMBLA for a complete and concice view of how.)
Edit: Addendum to Item 1, I just saw that Swing Sets are now to become a thing of the past.
Edited on Dec 23, 2010 at 1:25amNov '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Freeven
Lady Kurobara
Why does anything have to "be done about it"? That is the way liberals think. In a truly free society, people have the right to screw up, even if that means living on nothing but a diet of deep-fried Twinkies.
Hear, hear! The only "obesity crisis" I see is our elephantine government. A lot of really fat people? Sure. A bad thing for those fat people? Certainly. A drain on society? Yep. A crisis? Only if we insist on the government "doing something" about it.
You phrased that very nicely, Freeven. Very pithy, as they say.
Nov '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Jaydee_007
Outside to play what? Dodge Ball, Tag, Monkey Bars...are prohibited today. There is nothing Left but video games.
...Swing Sets are now to become a thing of the past.
The "Nanny State" has pretty much shut down the traditional playground. Back in the Good Old Days, my grade school playground was (in liberal eyes) a nightmare of rusting steel and crumbling concrete — a very unforgiving environment for a clumsy child. And my classmates were a pretty rowdy bunch, much given to rough play.
And yet, I do not recall that a lot of kids got hurt, except for the occasional skinned knee. One boy fell off the slide and broke his arm, but that was just "one of those things." Personally, I avoided the splintery seesaws, simply out of consideration for my young, tender hiney.
It is obvious that the progressive agenda restricts our freedoms, but it also sucks the joy out of everything.
Edited on Dec 23, 2010 at 12:49pmRe: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Charlie Dameron:
serious conservatives, oughtn't we be pushing for ways to reduce public and private expenditures on health care in this country? It would seem that the best way of doing that would be to limit the incidence of heart disease, which (it bears repeating) is the primary cause of premature death in the US. Taxing junk food and encouraging people to eat healthily is as sensible a way to reduce unnecessary costs to society as taxing cigarettes.
And I'm with KarlUB: end the corn subsidies now. This should be a domestic policy rallying point for the GOP. · Dec 22 at 10:51pm
Agreed on corn.
On taxing junk food, though--an intriguing idea, but I wonder: if we go down that path, will junk food become as taboo as cigarettes? Will the FDA come between us and our candy, as it did with cigarettes? And if sweets do become that taboo, is that a bad thing or a good thing? I ask that sincerely.
Personally, the idea makes me uncomfortable. My take on sweets is the same my take on cigarettes (and alcohol, and really, anything else): if you want to enjoy them, do so in moderation.
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
The NEJM article I mentioned yesterday is:
Jerome P. Kassirer, M.D., and Marcia Angell, M.D.
N Engl J Med 1998; 338:52-54. Jan 1, 1998.
I have a pdf version, but no way to attach it. If there's a way to post my email address that is only selectively available, I'll do it and then send to anyone who asks. Otherwise, I think you have to have subscription access, either institutionally or personally.
Lady Kurobara made the point I was hinting at:
"It is obvious that the progressive agenda restricts our freedoms, but it also sucks the joy out of everything."
We can't get kids off their fat butts because the idiots that restricted their freedom to play (and, oh horrors, possibly get a boo boo), didn't take into account the usual "unintended consequences" the the kids would probably get fat. Now they want to continue digging the hole by ruining the pleasures of good food. Funny, in typical form, they project onto us their own vices: it is not the conservatives who can't stand the idea that someone somewhere is having a good time, it's the "progressive" nannys. Or ninnys...
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
And Andrea, your definition of Epidemiology is the essence of junk science. It's a social science that uses one significant figure level data analyzed with 3 significant figure level statistical methods. It looks important with all those zeros, but most of the data input are weak at best.
Epidemiology is properly defined as "the study of disease distribution and determinants in human populations." It was the first question on the first exam in Epi 101 in grad school. Epidemiology explains nothing, but merely searches for statistical associations. At best it is hypothesis generating. Actual cause and effect is only demonstrable via real scientific methods.
At the risk of making this a pissing contest, I have 2 Master's degrees (including in Epidemiology & Biostatistics) and 2 years PhD work at Johns Hopkins, with some 50 research publications and presentations in microbiology and infectious disease. You have...what? Oh, right, a surgeon husband.
Obesity is not contagious and is not a threat to our national security as it only directly hurts the obese person. Also the definition of not a crisis. Take a deep breath!
Now I have to get back to work....
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Caryn: ...your definition of Epidemiology is the essence of junk science.
At risk of making this a pissing contest, I have 2 Master's degrees (including in Epidemiology & Biostatistics) and 2 years PhD work at Johns Hopkins ...You have...what? Oh, right, a surgeon husband.
So, let me understand this...you have a Masters degree in "Junk Science", no clinical experience and you're thumbing your nose at my husband's MEDICAL DOCTORATE? Not only did he spend four years in medical school, but he has another five years of postdoctorate work after that. He's enormously trumped you in the education department and takes care of patients every day. My husband is not a surgeon, either. He's an anesthesiologist, the one who keeps the patient alive and in some cases that's even borderline (packing the patient in ice and stopping the heart). He has to understand the human body very well to determine and titrate some of the most potent anesthesia drugs. He performs the most difficult surgical procedures known to man...every day. Oh, and he also attended a highly prestigious academic institution, as well. And graduated top of his class. Your arrogance is misplaced.
May '10
Re: Huckabee Sides with Michelle Obama Over Sarah Palin
Caryn:
At the risk of making this a pissing contest, I have 2 Master's degrees (including in Epidemiology & Biostatistics) and 2 years PhD work at Johns Hopkins, with some 50 research publications and presentations in microbiology and infectious disease. You have...what? Oh, right, a surgeon husband.
By the way, I didn't mention my education, either, because it's in the same "junk science" as yours.