Honor and Dignity
Peter's allusion to the use of the word "honor" struck me as important. Another word that comes to mind is "dignity."
Look again at this photo, which Tommy posted in a discussion of the controversy about this absurd creature's nipples. I'm loathe to post it again because I found it odious in the first place, but it makes an important point.
Whether her nipple or her cleavage is exposed is immaterial to me--the unclothed human torso, male or female, is an eternal subject of fascination to mankind, and whether a nipple is indecent depends upon the context.
What I deplore here is the sheer, grotesque vulgarity of this image. Part of the problem is the collective inability of our culture to recognize and respond to this as something meretricious, tawdry and undignified. She is lacking in dignity not because her flesh is exposed, but because everything about her--everything--conveys mindlessness, childishness, and unseriousness. Yet we consider that a perfectly normal public display. To point out that this woman is conveying in a million unsubtle ways that she is too stupid to pass a Turing Test, to say that there is obviously nothing about her that an adult would admire or enjoy, is inevitably to be accused of being a snob or an elitist.
There is a connection here, too, to the appalling low standards of speech and rhetoric in American political life--and in its daily life, as well. It is one cliche after another, just an endless string of them, revolving lifelessly on their hooks like carcasses in a slaughterhouse, and no one objects. No one even notices. It is assumed that all politicians speak in cliches and talk to the public as if they were small children. It is not only Obama who does this: It is virtually the entire political class. And why wouldn't they? It is considered quite normal to find People magazine--and only People magazine--in the waiting room of the dentist's office. How would anyone recognize adult speech at this point?
It is very telling that the word "adult" has come to be a synonym for "pornographic." What we really mean by an "adult" movie is an "adolescent" movie. The dignity of adult taste, adult expression, adult enthusiasms, adult interests, adult discipline, and an adult appreciation of cause and effect has come to be conflated with elitism.
Undoing the mess must somehow mean undoing this error, but I have no idea how.
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Jun '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
If I was never taught, I doubt that I would've found maturity on my own. Some can, but most of us need some help. Until we do, we're just children with adult hormones. That's a bad ending waiting to happen.
May '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
Claire, I haven't much to add but you may find it encouraging to consider that I - a single male in his late 20s - don't recognize this chick at all, and will be going to bed without taking fifteen seconds to find a picture of her "faux pas" online.
Surely I'm not alone, and it seems the most conservative response is a simple one: take mental stock of the ridiculous things you tend to ignore, complain as you see fit when this stuff crosses the line, and have some dignity in your own day-to-day life.
Yes, I realize this comment may be summarized, "cop-out!"
Nov '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
The pendulum swings, the tides turn, and there is nothing new under the sun... those kids at the U - give them time, they'll revolt in disgust. They are nobody's fools for long. I can already feel it on campus.
Oct '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
For me, the most challenging aspect of living in Los Angeles is being surrounded by this.
OK, you can stop laughing now.
I don't mean scantily-clad women, although they do exist. Venice Beach is Venice Beach. I mean what I can only describe as the aggressive vacuity of our popular culture. It really is the case, to a shocking degree in my experience, that to insist on being able to carry on a conversation based on an assumed background in the western canon is to be considered to be at least overeducated, if not elitist and, in the worst case, part of whatever hegemony "education" is supposed to overcome.
With respect to the proximate issue, all I can say is: only America could produce a Madonna, Lady Gaga, or Nicki Minaj. In any truly oppressive society, such as the Muslim world, they'd simply be banned. In any truly libertine society, such as the Netherlands, they'd warrant no more than a yawn. To Claire's point, America is an adolescent society, and has some difficult non-economic choices to make, as well as the obvious economic ones.
Oct '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
We'll know the test has been passed when the machines are offended by the comparison.
Dec '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
These days, the avant garde is so de rigueur.
May '11
Re: Honor and Dignity
I hate to say it, but though I agree with the sentiment, it still seems a bit prudish to complain about someone in showbiz with big hair and bright colors. Clowns are people too.
I suspect that the wardrobe malfunction was a deliberate attempt to get us to learn who this particular clown is. I don't care who she is, not my type, but the thing about a free country is that not everyone has the same tastes. Lots of people like rap music or opera. I think both are atrocious.
Mar '11
Re: Honor and Dignity
I'm an adolescent in a 62-year old body, but I agree with almost all of this, except to say that there is a huge difference between the way Tea Party Republicans speak, and old Republicans like John McCain or any Democrats, especially Mr Obama.
Actually, very often I agree even with Mr McCain, except when he says something totally ridiculous. Ditto Mr Graham.
The only hope I have for America is that the Hobbits do win, in the end.
Oh, and I have no idea who that lady with the frizzy hair is ( no, not the fully-clothed lady above her), but her nipples look fine to my aging, adolescent, eyes (am I allowed to say that?).
Edited on Aug 8, 2011 at 1:46amJul '11
Re: Honor and Dignity
Your thoughts on concerning the coarsening of the culture, and this particular manifestation of it, are spot on. My only beef is with this line:
"To point out that this woman is conveying in a million unsubtle ways that she is too stupid to pass a Turing Test..."
The conflation of intelligence with any sense of goodness and wisdom is a dangerous tendency. We see it all the time - how many pundits were seduced by Obama's ability to quote Niebuhr as a sign of his fitness for office? Does this woman lack intelligence? Who knows? What I see is someone who has decided that making money and gain notoriety by making a spectacle of herself is worth any price she will pay in self-respect or societal scorn. As you point out, the latter cost will be pitifully small. As for the former, if she has not been raised to respect herself, such behavior may seem entirely rational. Intelligent even!
Re: Honor and Dignity
Cobalt Blue: Your thoughts on concerning the coarsening of the culture, and this particular manifestation of it, are spot on. My only beef is with this line:
"To point out that this woman is conveying in a million unsubtle ways that she is too stupid to pass a Turing Test..."
The conflation of intelligence with any sense of goodness and wisdom is a dangerous tendency. We see it all the time - how many pundits were seduced by Obama's ability to quote Niebuhr as a sign of his fitness for office?
But that is exactly my point: Something has gone deeply wrong when you can claim a reputation as a deep thinker and credible leader by spreading a layer of Niebuhr-Spam over some cheese and sandwiching it in a loaf of platitudes.
Jul '11
Re: Honor and Dignity
Brilliant post. The chief benefit of following this site is the conversation and sheer seriousness of the posters. I love it, meaning that you express my views so very well.
I'm an old man, and have seen this coming for a long time. The coarsening is an advancing, spreading stain on daily life. Personally, I ignore it and hide wherever possible, but because it's spreading now to everything, that escape is less effective.
I wish I knew the antidote, but I do not. We tried to counter it in the raising of our children, but with only mixed effectiveness.
In "the sixties" I thought, "Hell, we're not going to be able to turn the world over to these people; we're going to have to stay till the next generation gets here." I never saw that "these people" would simply take it over and and transform it before the next generation could get here.
That's what it looks like to me, in popular culture, politics, the academy, wherever.
Billy Pilgrim said it best, I fear. "So it goes."
Feb '11
Re: Honor and Dignity
One of the things I find fascinating is the de facto political alliance between *entertainers*, a category that includes some of the least-intellectual people in existence, and college professors. Pick any issue, and the professors and the entertainers are likely to be on the same side regarding it.
Jul '11
Re: Honor and Dignity
It's the "and" between "thinker" and "credible" that's problematic. Someone may be a legitimate Niebuhr aficionado, but that doesn't mean they have any meaningful leadership qualities. The prejudice that the former implies the latter predates our current social ills, but it has become particularly prevalent in recent decades (I'm guessing due to the explosion in the size and influence of the "academic elite"). My line of thinking here hearkens back to WFB's famous line that he would rather be goverened by the first 2000 names in the Boston phonebook than the 2000 members of Harvard's faculty. Distorted by many as being anti-intellectual, it's not - it simply recognizes that effective leaders need much more than cleverness.
And I love the Niebuhr-Spam line - instant classic!
Nov '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
Actually, Nicki Minaj sounds like a rather interesting person, though perhaps lacking in that acceptable Oxbridge veneer. And the choice of a Melzi painting as a counterpoint is rather amusing, Renaissance Italian high culture was at least as decadent as ours, if not more so.Perhaps Ricochet needs to resurrect Savonarola? I wouldn't recommend it...
I completely agree that political discourse is pretty low these days, but I don't know if in general it is ever substantially higher. Certainly at times there are great exceptions, but those are usually not placed against their contemporary context. That cherry picking tends to leave the impression that at some point it was all so much better than today. But if you randomly pick historical eras and look at them in detail, I think you'll be disabused. Human nature really doesn't change very quickly.
Sep '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
Something else is going on here--she's black, so we're not allowed to criticize her. We must "celebrate" her. You can't speak the truth--that she appears to be vulgar, stupid and ugly--because then you're racist, and the mass media will condemn you at the top of its electronic lungs.
I had a black student who loved physics and math and did well at both. He was obviously swimming against the undertow of today's culture. Fortunately, he didn't much care what other people thought of him; but how many bright kids have been ruined by our culture without our ever knowing?
Edited on Aug 8, 2011 at 6:54amNov '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
This is the reason I've dedicated my life to education of the young. Even though I teach math (mostly, but this year I'm taking on the choir) I consider it one of my main tasks to communicate something beyond erudition to high school students. And boy, are they hungry for it, after a steady diet of the stuff portrayed in this picture.
I could only hint at it in the public schools, and the elite post-religious 100-year-old private school I taught at for a decade would have forced me out eventually due to my non-orthodox beliefs concerning homosexual activity. Now that I am at a good Catholic school, I can unequivocally proclaim the source of renewal which turned pagan Rome into Christian Europe.
That same source can renew our culture again, but who knows how far we have to slip before we begin to realize our need for renewal as a society. The African and Indian priests that serve my suburban Minneapolis Catholic parish bear witness to the fact that the 3rd world is now sending missionaries to ME.
Dec '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
Cobalt Blue
My line of thinking here hearkens back to WFB's famous line that he would rather be goverened by the first 2000 names in the Boston phonebook than the 2000 members of Harvard's faculty. Distorted by many as being anti-intellectual, it's not - it simply recognizes that effective leaders need much more than cleverness.
And I love the Niebuhr-Spam line - instant classic! · Aug 8 at 5:31am
I believe WFB's formulation was also an extension of Chesterton's description of the virtue of democracy -- that it solicited the wisdom disbursed among the common man.
Unfortunately, the notion seems tragically quaint to me now. I consider myself better informed than 95% of the electorate and still, after hours of studying my ballot, I feel marginally qualified to vote. I suppose it is the complexity of the issues now that Leviathan governs.
If Buckley had said 2,000 in toto, the idea would be complete. The Republic would thrive with the smallest, weakest, federal government possible made up of a cross-section of citizens having some share of wisdom. I know... I dream.
Re: Honor and Dignity
I actually had no idea she was black. Given that I had no idea--based on the photo--what on earth do we mean by "she's black?"
I can certainly say my comments were entirely free of racial bias, given that I assumed the woman was as white as Lawrence Welk.
Dec '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
That picture and the cultural poison underlying it is why many conservative Christians I know identify as actively living counter-culture. I don't know whether to laugh at the irony or cry over the lost ground.
As conservatives, it would be uncharacteristic of us, as well as philosophically incoherent, to try to compel cultural changes. I think all we can do is live counter-culture lives and teach our children the same. I try to push back against the received "wisdom" of the culture with friends, but I don't think I'm very effective.
...
Dec '10
Re: Honor and Dignity
On the issue of delayed adulthood, for example, I recently argued with a secular friend for the advantages of marrying young.
Nothing matures a person more than taking on adult responsibilities, like marrying and having children. This is particularly true for men, it seems, as now that the average age for marrying has advanced to the late twenties, women are having trouble finding men, rather than boy-men, to date.
There's the energy problem for older parents. Trust me. I had mine at 36 and 40.
And really, your personality and values are pretty much in the can by the time you're 20, so the chances of you making a better choice of mate later in life aren't much improved.