"Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Troy Senik's post on David Brooks's latest column got me thinking about The Great Gatsby. Okay, let me explain that.
Troy said Brooks had written a thoughtful and provocative piece, which of course he hadn't because he's David Brooks and is incapable of doing so. But this insistence by so many smart people that David Brooks is worth reading reminded me how everyone says The Great Gatsby is this fantastic novel. I read it in high school and thought it was dull and unenlightening. Then, in my late twenties, I thought, "Hey, everyone says it's great, and I was just an idiot high school kid, so maybe I was missing something." So I read it again, and it was still dull and unenlightening. My wife, who's a much more astute literary critic than I, had the exact same experience, which is one of the many reasons I love her. I mean, almost nothing happens (he hits someone with a car, right?) to people it's very hard to care about, and then . . . there's not even an "and then." That's it -- almost nothing happens to unsympathetic people. Oh, and there are fancy parties.
Anyway, any other nominations for supposedly great books that actually [edited]? (Can we say "[edited]" on Ricochet? I hope so.)
Editor's note: Ricochet seeks to return our standards of gentility to the year 1957. We therefore discourage the use of the edited word. When it doubt, ask "Would June Cleaver feel ill at ease were I to say this?" You may also ask whether you would use the phrase before the Queen Mother. No other member of the Royal Family may be used as a reliable guide, alas.
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Oct '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Sisyphus
dogsbody: I'm waiting for the hate mail after I make my nomination: Chaucer's Canterbury Tales.
What is excellent about Geoffrey Chaucer requires active scholarship and a powerful teacher to bring to life, along with a willingness to totally absorb the medieval Western world view from CS Lewis and others. (And Canterbury Tales is all about the plurality of world views.)
If my exposure had left off in high school, we would be of one mind on this. I absolutely agree he is not for everybody. · Jun 29 at 6:17pm
People have admired Chaucer through the ages for his ability to depict human nature. As when reading Shakespeare, one must read Chaucer and think "Where have I seen that person before?" (Chaucer's satire, though, is unlike anything in Shakespeare.)
The General Prologue to the Canterbury Tales is a masterpiece of character portraits and satire. Seth Lerer's Teaching Company course on Chaucer provides a decent guide. If you aren't a poetry fan to begin with, some of his comments might sound a bit precious, but the lectures are a good time investment.
Aug '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Mark Hemingway: Gatsby, on the other hand is pretty much note perfect back to front ... I happen think Gatsby works on just about every level.
Jun 29 at 5:29pm
Mark, this former English major couldn't agree more. I think Gatsby is the closest-to-perfect American novel yet written, and one of the best ever. It's lush but concise, evocative but never lurid, and I find it a joy to read.
I also want to put in a good word for Faulkner. Sometimes he got a bit out of control, but The Sound and Fury was the most memorable reading experience I've had. You have to fight through the multiple points of view for a long, long time, but if you read it cold (i.e. without reading/explanatory notes) like I did, there comes a point when everything suddenly snaps into place. The camera is focused, and all is illuminated. Chills may occur.
Who's overrated? Spare me, please, from Sinclair Lewis. Sorry, Mr Lileks, and any other Minnesotans here, but this Iowa boy says that Minnesota has a lot to answer for when it comes to tedious politicizers.
Oct '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Running joke in English grad programs:
A modernist grad student puts Finnegan's Wake on the reading list for his oral exams. He keeps trying to read it, and he keeps failing. Finally, the week before his exam, he realizes that he'll never even come close to finishing the book. He puts it down.
So he takes the exam and passes the bits on Lawrence, Woolf, Eliot, etc. with flying colors. Finally come the questions from the Joyce scholar. After rattling off responses to queries about the Portrait and Ulysses, the student faces his worst fear.
Professor: "So, what did you think of Finnegan's Wake?"
The student looks at his hands for a moment and then admits that, actually, he didn't read the book.
Professor: "Oh, nobody ever reads the book--I just wanted to know what you thought of it!"
Jan '11
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
My fiction nominations for what Woody Allen called "The Academy of the Overrated" in "Manhattan" are:
The Magic Mountain - Thomas Mann
Under the Volcano - Malcolm Lowry
Lie Down in Darkness - William Styron
The Autobiography of Alice B. Toklas - Gertrude Stein
Gravity's Rainbow - Thomas Pynchon
JR - William Gaddis
Jun '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Totally agree. The point of The Great Gatsby is that it is boring. No thanks, I can visualize boring in a variety of ways on my own.
May '11
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
The diversity of opinions on this thread contradicts the conventional view of narrow minded conservatives. I actually agree with many literary critics who rate The Great Gatsby as the greatest American novel but all lists of that sort are meaningless. I think the two most underrated authors of the last century were Graham Greene and Walker Percy.
Jul '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Walker Percy was underrated for a reason: his prose is so thick and incomprehensible that it reminds one of a raving homeless person.
Nov '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
J. D. Fitzpatrick
Running joke in English grad programs:
A modernist grad student puts Finnegan's Wake on the reading list for his oral exams. He keeps trying to read it, and he keeps failing. Finally, the week before his exam, he realizes that he'll never even come close to finishing the book. He puts it down.
So he takes the exam and passes the bits on Lawrence, Woolf, Eliot, etc. with flying colors. Finally come the questions from the Joyce scholar. After rattling off responses to queries about the Portrait and Ulysses, the student faces his worst fear.
Professor: "So, what did you think of Finnegan's Wake?"
The student looks at his hands for a moment and then admits that, actually, he didn't read the book.
Professor: "Oh, nobody ever reads the book--I just wanted to know what you thought of it!"
This pretty much sums up my undergraduate experience with the book, with one exception: I was forced to read it.
Thankfully, I had taken copious notes during lectures and was able to regurgitate appropriate commentary when necessary. I was also fortunate to have an extremely patient professor. :-)
Oct '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Joseph Stanko
Jan-Michael Rives
Jan-Michael Rives
Consider the possibility that there's more to literary greatness than simply plot.
Otherwise, Dan Brown is a genius and Hemingway was a dunce. · Jun 29 at 4:24pm
I guess it's "Otherwise," then... · Jun 29 at 4:31pm
Dan Brown is a dunce, and I didn't mean to reject Hemingway altogether. I liked The Sun Also Rises, but TOMATS was just... boring. · Jun 29 at 5:33pm
I'm a huge Hemingway fan. I've reread just about the entire cannon 3 times. And I skipped 'The Old Man and the Sea.' I completely agree that its sub-par and boring. I don't understand the critical acclaim. Perhaps the 3rd world-ism?
Nov '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
As for the several mentions of James Joyce on this thread -- and particularly with respect to Finnegan's Wake -- I recommend the eminent literary critic and thinker George Steiner's criticism of Joyce; video clip deep-linked to 27:07 here.
His discussion of other literary greats is pretty fascinating to listen to, if you have the time.
Moreover, if you watch the entire two hour interview, his reflections on Oxford and Cambridge, among other things, is quite colorful and interesting. Not bad for an old Lefty, who never signed on to multiculturalism or the "let's hate dead white males" toxicity.
Edited on June 30, 2011 at 5:15amMay '11
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Well, I love Hemingway, at least what was published before he died. Most of his posthumous work is terrible.
I really liked "The Old Man and the Sea." Like "For Whom the Bell Tolls" it shows a man doing what he must do no matter the danger or the cost. For the Old Man, his luck is down, he's not catching any fish, but he keeps going out and never quits trying. Hemingway is showing how man is heroic, even when trying to just survive. I thought it was very powerful. But being heroic is passe nowadays, I guess.
I liked Stenger's "Angle of Repose" too, but I lent it to an old girl friend and never got it back. I should buy another copy someday.
Jun '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Kenneth
Western Chauvinist: I
I'm wondering what Ricochet members would recommend as "must reads" for the great American novel, great English-language novel or great English translation novel. Any suggestions?
The great American novel: A Soldier of the Great War.
The great novel not written by an American: The Growth of the Soil. · Jun 29 at 7:07pm
The great American novel: Cather's Death Comes for the Archbishop (though I love A Soldier of the Great War too)
Great novel not written by an American: Don Quixote (Edith Grossman translator).
Sep '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
I'd nominate Mark Helprin's entire oeuvre, but I also want to put in a good word for Japanese writer Shusaku Endo, who Graham Greene vehemently believed deserved the Nobel prize for literature.
Walker Percy was not of the caliber of Flannery O'Connor.
Jun '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Western Chauvinist:
I went through a phase where I tried to read at least one contemporary Pulitzer winner each summer. Any opinions on All the Pretty Horses or Love in the Time of Cholera? Neither did much for me. Apparently my phase lasted two summers. · Jun 29 at 7:04pm
All the Pretty Horses is a great novel--great action, great characters, great (and tragic) love story.
Love in the Time of Cholera is OK. Garcia Marquez is a great writer, but the magic realism gets very old very soon. One Hundred Years of Solitude is his masterpiece. For me, a little of Garcia Marquez goes a long way.
Mar '11
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
The Catcher In The Rye and Wuthering Heights. Ugh.
Nov '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
A Farewell To Arms by Hemingway (I actually kind of enjoyed The Old Man and the Sea) and Wuthering Heights. The characters in those books were so unlikeable that I just couldn't enjoy reading the books.
I know The Grapes of Wrath is Steinbeck's most critically acclaimed novel, but I enjoyed his other works far more - Of Mice and Men, The Red Pony, and East of Eden.
I've never been able to finish Moby Dick any of the several times I've tried, and got bogged down somewhere in the Crimean War in Les Miserables. Considering I managed to finish War and Peace, Atlas Shrugged, and Anna Karenina, I blame the material.
As for favorites, I adore Alexandre Dumas and the entire series featuring the Three Musketeers and D'Artagnan. I think they get far too little love in literary circles.
The (non AP level) high school reading lists of today make me want to weep. Utter tripe.
Nov '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Judging by the current state of lit. crit here, I think Harold Bloom's book How to Read and Why might actually be the best place to start....
Aug '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
tabula rasa
Come on. Marvin J. Mooney Won't You Please Go Home is a lot worse. · Jun 29 at 6:03pm
Give credit to how bad the Lorax and the Sneetches are.
May '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
Ah. I loved Warn and Peace. I read it when a sophomore in HS mostly because my dorm parents (brilliant English and History teachers) mocked it so much and then confessed they'd never read it because it was too difficult to read. "Pish posh," I thought, "I'm reading it."
It took me about 3 weeks. My other homework really suffered because I got so caught up in the book. I couldn't wait to get home to read it. Sometimes, I'd hide it in my Math book to read. But then I got caught. No one really believed I was actually reading it. I had a reputation for being vapid back then, too. That book stayed with me for years. Just remembering certain passages made me bawl. And then I saw the movie with Henry Fonda and was... disappointed. It was so pale compared to the book.
Oh, forgot to mention I read the original Russian... Nah. Just checking to see if you're still with me.
Aug '10
Re: "Great" Books that in Truth Are Tedious
HalifaxCB
Judging by the current state of lit. crit here, I think Harold Bloom's book How to Read and Why might actually be the best place to start.... · Jun 29 at 8:28pm
All children should be mandated to read the "Among the Hidden" series and "The Giver" book