Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Recently, the First Lady made some comments regarding the adverse effects of inner-city people not having access to fresh fruits and vegetables. It is seen as axiomatic that you cannot have good health without these.
This puzzles me because the year-round access to fresh fruits and vegetables in a very recent phenomenon. When I was young, after I spent the day dodging dinosaurs and sabre-tooth tigers, my mother would always serve vegetables with dinner, but, as a rule they were canned or frozen. Does anyone else remember the sequence in Steinbeck’s East of Eden where they attempt to ship a load of lettuce by train from California to New York, because they believed that people in New York would love to have some fresh lettuce? For those of you who don’t; it was a very expensive failure.
Frozen foods have only been available for about one hundred years, and the original ones were pretty awful. Frozen vegetables were mush before Birdseye. Canned food has only been around for two hundred year. Before canning people had to get by on vegetable that could be stored in a root cellar or salted and fermented vegetables such as sauerkraut.
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Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
In many cases frozen vegetables can be more nutritious than the "fresh" vegetables you buy in the supermarket because they are picked at their peak ripeness and immediately flash frozen. During this process, most of the nutrients are locked into the veggies.
I keep a freezer full of frozen vegetables. They're convenient, much cheaper than fresh veggies, equally if not more nutritious than fresh, and don't rot if I don't use them immediately.
But of course, there are a host of vegetables that you can't find in the frozen foods aisle. Or maybe you can, but the thought of getting frozen turnips or beets or tomatoes or onions isn't all that appealing to me. I'd rather get these things fresh.
Jun '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Very interesting points. And isn't it true that today's frozen veggies actually retain more of their nutrients than the fresh variety that often sit too long on the shelves?
Another thing that isn't much addressed has been very well covered by Therodore Dalrymple when he writes about the underclass and their self-defeating habits. Much of the urban poor he services (many in his role as prison doctor) have absolutely no idea how to prepare a meal. For them, opening a can of peas and heating it on the stove is a household task they've never seen performed, never mind more complicated food preparation. To them, all food comes from a take-out line at McDonald's or the local fish & chips counter. Handing them a container of spinich or a bunch of broccoli wouldn't mean they'd know what the heck to do with it.
And that East of Eden scene was quite powerful!
May '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Frozen veggies can be pretty nutritious, but I'm a big fan of fresh stuff when you can get it.
Kill the farm subsidies-- or, more realistically, phase them out-- and we'll see our national health improve somewhat. We subsidize the kinds of food that go into high-calorie, low-nutrient fast foods and junk foods. This makes them cheaper and as a result, many lower-income families don't think they can afford the healthier stuff.
Of course, that's only part of the solution. As StickerShock points out, part of the problem is societal and habitual, which loops back around to having intact, responsible families that will teach good habits, including self-control, discipline, and planning ahead.
My grandmother was a health "nut" and passed down not only the methods but the acquired taste for good, healthy whole foods and home cooking. Yes, if you accustom yourself to eating healthy food, stuff from fast-food joints can actually become repulsive to you. But it takes discipline to wean yourself.
Fast-food joints know that fat, salt and sugar are literally addictive. I blame them for exploiting that, but the problem is, if they didn't, others would.
May '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Foxman: It is seen as axiomatic that you cannot have good health without these.
This puzzles me because the year-round access to fresh fruits and vegetables in a very recent phenomenon.
You can have good health without them, but the problem is that the alternatives available in the mainstream are largely cheap and plentiful, and unhealthy in large quantities.
If you eat fresh veggies, you can feel full and satisfied quite easily without gaining weight. On the other hand, if you eat a lot of white bread, fried stuff, cheese and meat, it's hard to feel satisfied without eating too many calories.
In the past, people may not have had access to fresh fruits and vegetables. However, that was counterbalanced by the fact that people exercised a lot out of necessity (walking, working, etc.) and also were accustomed to smaller portion sizes out of necessity.
It should not be a matter of any controversy that, given our sedentary lifestyles, eating more healthy food such as fruits and vegetables is far better than eating large quantities of the highly refined foods available cheaply today. Weight Watchers works, because of this.
If you wish to challenge that, be my guest.
Dec '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Chris Deleon
It should not be a matter of any controversy that, given our sedentary lifestyles, eating more healthy food such as fruits and vegetables is far better than eating large quantities of the highly refined foods available cheaply today. Weight Watchers works, because of this.
If you wish to challenge that, be my guest. · Feb 15 at 9:33am
I don't challenge that for a second. What I challenge is the idea that the fruits and vegetables must be fresh. As others above have pointed out frozen is sometimes better than "fresh", if by fresh you mean what is available at your grocer.
Canned is a poor third place, but better than most people had before canning.
Aug '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Firstly, I'd like to add my voice to those who praise modern frozen vegetables. As I kid, I never ate my veggies. As an adult, I discovered the magic of stir-fry. I eat much healthier because of the convenience of pre-chopped frozen veggies.
Secondly, I note the contradiction of Michelle Obama talking about the need for "fresh" veggies, while she also campaigns for "local food".
It is physically impossible to get "local" food year-round that is also "fresh".
So which is it, should people get "fresh" food that has been transported thousands of miles, or should they get "local" food that has been frozen, canned, and processed?
Sep '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
So what? You want to go back?
Dec '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Wow. This is the first time a post of mine has been bumped to the main feed. I am so honored
Jul '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Clarence Birdseye. Jeffrey Dahmer.
The two icons of frozen foods.
Jul '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Oh, come on. You knew Diane is a sucker for a food post.
By the way, a nice post with a photo of Salma Hayek will always attract Emily's attention...
May '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Please do not attempt to bother the Left with history. If they cared about what actually happened in previous years or decades, they wouldn't be able to maintain their world view.
Dec '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Don't forget drying -- before salting and fermenting and cold storage, there was drying of fruits and fish and meats. Pre-Colombian Plains Indians on the American prairie would drive herds of bison off cliffs, then rush to cut out as much meat as they could to dry it in strips before the carcasses rotted. There was a lot of wasted meat, but then, there were evidently a lot of bison.
And potting: putting food into a container and covering it with fat to exclude air.
Pemmican combines drying berries and meat and potting them with seal, whale or walrus fat: great for an Arctic lifestyle where environmental cold and strenuous activity mean you need thousands of calories daily to survive.
Fruits and vegetables are wonderful, but lots of human societies developed in places where the flora offered very limited food choices. Humans don't have the digestive tracts to handle grass blades and foliage. Fruit was so scarce out of season that it's no wonder we developed tongues that favor sweets: we evolved to seek out carbohydrates and to devour them whenever we found them. Unfortunately, agriculture means that we can (in the modern USA) obtain unlimited carbohydrates.
Dec '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Chris Deleon
Foxman: It is seen as axiomatic that you cannot have good health without these.
This puzzles me because the year-round access to fresh fruits and vegetables in a very recent phenomenon.
Yes, if you accustom yourself to eating healthy food, stuff from fast-food joints can actually become repulsive to you
· Feb 15 at 9:33am
Food, as a rule, is not healthy. It is dead. It can however, be healthful.
Aug '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
While the First Lady may be overstating the virtues of "fresh" fruits and vegetables over frozen, canned, etc. I found in my six years living in Crenshaw that our local grocery stores seemed to carry produce that was essentially rotten. The stores in Culver City, less than a mile away, had abundant and fresh produce for sale. The food cost the same in the two locations as the stores were the same chains.
Jul '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Or the Asian-steppe (Mongols, Turks, etc.) horse sweat cure. Strips of meat placed underneath the saddle.
I'll take smoked or pickled instead, thanks.
Dec '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Palaeologus
Or the Asian-steppe (Mongols, Turks, etc.) horse sweat cure. Strips of meat placed underneath the saddle. · Feb 15 at 11:36am
Yum
Jun '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
While it may be tougher to get fresh veggies & fruits in some areas, I'm thinking of the lunch I always served when my kids were younger & I had a group play date:
Peanut butter & jelly sandwiches on whole wheat. (Turkey for the peanut allergy kids.) I'd have to cut the crust off for fussy kids. Milk or chocolate milk to drink.
Then I'd put out a bowl each of sliced banannas, sliced apples, and baby carrots. Also seedless grapes if I had them on hand. My daughter loved when I opened a can of chick peas, rinsed them, and put them in a bowl. Some more adventurous kids would enjoy noshing on black olives. (OK, those last two aren't fresh, but they're fine kiddy snacks when compared to french fries.)
They'd devour the food. Preparation involved a knife and a sink to wash the fruit and carrots. I can't imagine any deli, bodega, or neighborhood grocery store not having those basic ingredients.
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Chris Deleon
In the past, people may not have had access to fresh fruits and vegetables. However, that was counterbalanced by the fact that people exercised a lot out of necessity (walking, working, etc.) and also were accustomed to smaller portion sizes out of necessity.
Yes.
Dec '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Palaeologus
Or the Asian-steppe (Mongols, Turks, etc.) horse sweat cure. Strips of meat placed underneath the saddle.
I'll take smoked or pickled instead, thanks. · Feb 15 at 11:36am
Smoked AND pickled: pastrami, at the Second Avenue Deli... on an onion roll... with cole slaw and Russian dressing....
Dec '10
Re: Fresh Fruits and Vegetables
Ursula Hennessey
Chris Deleon
In the past, people may not have had access to fresh fruits and vegetables. However, that was counterbalanced by the fact that people exercised a lot out of necessity (walking, working, etc.) and also were accustomed to smaller portion sizes out of necessity.
Yes. · Feb 15 at 11:52am
And in some places -- northern Europe a few hundred years ago, for example -- peasants essentially hibernated to reduce their caloric demands during the winter. They had little food stored for the winter because most of their surplus went to their landlord or feudal lord. Starvation also helps to keep you trim.