Footnotes to Aristotle
Claire Berlinski, Ed. ·
Aug 24, 2011 at 11:40pm
I'm seeing endless appeals to the Judeo-Christian heritage of the West in the media. For balance, I would like to urge upon everyone a proper weighting of our Greco-Roman heritage.
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Jan '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
A little light reading?
Apr '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
The Christian part of Judeo-Christian incorporates the Greek philosophical tradition; it's sometimes called Judeo-Greco-Christian tradition. Christianity adopted Plato and Aristotle. Islam's rejection of them was one of the Whats that "went wrong". Benedict XVI caught a lot of flak when he pointed that out.
By the way, in what media are you seeing this groundswell of nostalgia for the Old School?
Mar '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
The Greco-Roman part of our tradition contains a lot of what is wrong with the modern world. One should start with Plato: the first and definitive defense of an authoritarian state headed by a philosopher king.
Plato has been debunked - and on his own terms. But most people don't know it, and none of those who do are modern liberals.
Judeo-Christian tradition, by contrast, values human life. As Jonathan Sacks has pointed out, there were 4 great modern revolutions: French, Russian, English and American. The first two were godless, and incredibly bloody. The last two were Deistic, and there was very limited bloodshed by comparison. If you think all people are created in the image of G-d, then you place a value on something that rational thinkers like Pete Singer or those who backed Eugenics assert has none. And so the Judeo-Christian tradition is (almost uniquely) life-affirming.
Dec '10
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
Claire, I appreciate that did not reference Plato but Aristotle.
So much of what is missing in modern society is a well founded understanding of what Aristotle called happiness (better translated as human flourishing). Aristotle considered this the only thing that we pursue for it's own sake, and the highest good.
I agree that many of the great foundations of our individualism and the common good that is the fruit of individual responsibility, are from Aristotle's lessons on one's pursuit of virtue.
I think it is a lesson lost on post-modern western society and its loss is evident in how we have replaced earned and proven virtue with bestowed status. In my mind, that status is the product of fear induced paternalism, and a sign of how weak we have become.
Instead of endeavoring to master the virtues like ambition by struggling against human proclivities toward sloth and greed as Aristotle taught, society now encourages us to shun competition and ambition altogether, and hide in the false security of equivalence.
Pursuing equal outcomes aims to protect existence, but I think it has little to do with flourishing, which begs the question, what then are its true ends?
Edited on Aug 25, 2011 at 3:33amSep '10
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
Plato has been debunked - and on his own terms. But most people don't know it, and none of those who do are modern liberals.
I'm sure Paul Rahe and the rest of us closet Straussians (I wear a corset most workdays) will be pleased to hear that. Could you give us a quick sketch of the argument? Unfortunately the book's sales rank, lack of reviews and book blurbs by only one person leave us a little puzzled as to whether we should read the book or not.
Edited on Aug 25, 2011 at 5:12amJan '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
The western tradition incorporates all of them anyway, so I don't see a need for a conflict.
However, I should point out that Aristotle's works were lost to the West for centuries. The West almost forgot about him, because they didn't have his works to read. The only reason that Aristotle is now given his proper place was because Thomas Aquinas happened to be alive in the 1200s, which by luck was also the time when the Arabs starting mingling with the West (and they happened to have their own copies of Aristotle's works). It was Aquinas who brought Aristotle back into prominence.
So who should get credit? The Greeks? The Arabs? The Catholics? All of them, as far as I'm concerned.
Sep '10
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
The definitive translation of Aristotle's Nicomachean Ethics, in English, is now here. And, yes, that makes me happy.
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
There's no conflict, just a debt we should acknowledge.
Jun '10
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
There is a third pillar to our culture: Anglo-Saxon law (aka English Common Law). Notice how the left attacks all three pillars as they try to establish utopia on earth. They have substituted moral relativism for Judeo-Christian values. They deny logic and reason as the basis for truth ("It's just your opinion!"). And they demand that "social justice" takes precedence over the rule of law. A prescription for societal collapse if there ever was one.
Sep '10
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
There is a third pillar to our culture:
Who is Harold Berman?
Apr '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
KC Mulville:
However, I should point out that Aristotle's works were lost to the West for centuries. The West almost forgot about him, because they didn't have his works to read. The only reason that Aristotle is now given his proper place was because Thomas Aquinas happened to be alive in the 1200s, which by luck was also the time when the Arabs starting mingling with the West...
So who should get credit? The Greeks? The Arabs? The Catholics? All of them, as far as I'm concerned. · Aug 25 at 5:14am
I've often wondered if that's really true. The Byzantines surely had access to the ancient texts and there was uninterrupted contact between Constantinople and the West. We know that Byzantine scholars fled west as the eastern empire began to crumble and they must have brought their books with them. I suspect we don't give enough credit to Medieval knowledge accepting as we do the Enlightenment narrative that no one knew anything before the Quartrocento. But yes, all three groups deserve credit for keeping the flame alive.
Sep '10
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
I suspect we don't give enough credit to Medieval knowledge accepting as we do the Enlightenment narrative that no one knew anything before the Quartrocento.
You've got that absolutely spot on correct sir! And both the Renaissance and Enlightenment thinkers stoked that myth which is why its so prevalent.
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
What I wouldn't give to go back and see for myself.
I agree that the media is medievophobic.
Jan '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
No argument from me.
It should also be mentioned that even if Aristotle wasn't prominent up until then, Plato certainly was ... which makes Claire's point as well.
Jan '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
Claire Berlinski, Ed.
There's no conflict, just a debt we should acknowledge.
Exactly. It doesn't diminish the influence our Judeo-Christian heritage has had on our moral and religious traditions to say that our civil, philosophical, mathematical, and scientific traditions were (largely) Greco-Roman. Just because liberals spurn the former doesn't mean we should ignore the latter.
Edited on Aug 25, 2011 at 7:52amFeb '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
I think for the modern PC mind the classical heritage is often as distasteful as the Judeo-Christian. The Roman sense of patriotism, familial authority, and basic conservatism must leave them muttering about proto-fascists (which at times would not be amiss), it seems the only thing many in the liberal camp feel strongly positive about is that there was a lot more sex with a lot more people for certain individuals of certain social classes, and that's just hunky-dorry and to be celebrated, of course they usually totally misunderstand sexual issues in antiquity anyways... Also, it seems that sometimes there is an embrace of the Classical world (by the left) in a quest for a rooted sense of culture that isn't religious, and the "enlightenment" of some classic authors is a refreshing place to stand and appear both sophisticated, modern, and yet uber-retro. I have an ambivalent relationship to this side of our culture - so much to love from the classical world, so much to recoil in horror from, but it cannot be denied that it is an inescapable influence on the west. One wonders what they do with Greek chauvinism - that whole barbarian thingy...
Aug '10
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
"One should start with Plato: the first and definitive defense of an authoritarian state headed by a philosopher king."
Please tell me Dr. Popper how you came to this view, and when you finally actually read The Republic.
There is this strange little phrase that keeps recurring in the works of Socrates students, including Plato, about the best ruler ruling and being ruled in return. Additionally, I would read Plato's commentary that follows the introduction of the Philosopher King and continue to the end of the book. This might be helpful in understanding Plato's view on the viability, let alone the justness, of authoritarian states.
Feb '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
As to the proper place of that heritage - I think that without the filter of the Judeo-Christian tradition the classical world is a very dangerous cup to drink from...pretty public buildings, great art, and the beginnings of rational philosophy and science on one side of the balance with horrific brutality in the name of the state, social mores that were very um...un-enlightened from many points of view, and a low view of the worth of the individual (in reality if not always philosophy) on the other.
Roman law - not a big fan of it, roman political understanding - interesting, and the republic has much to admire, treatment of women, children, and those outside your cultural or social group - not very nice, literature - fantastic...the greeks - interesting culture, roots of democracy, science, etc., pretty awful at times; if you go back beyond the classical period the differences between Jewish and Greek thought are not that great, and one misses the moral profundity and value of the lesser from the Jewish tradition, and the outsider. Of course the early church is so thoroughly classical in many senses, without it, the classical world would have had no lease on life.
Mar '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
Evidently some of us are unaware that Neoplatonism made Christian Theology possible.
Mar '11
Re: Footnotes to Aristotle
"One should start with Plato: the first and definitive defense of an authoritarian state headed by a philosopher king."
I'll just direct you to this conversation had within the last two weeks in which several of us, including Prof. Rahe, debunk this very claim.