First they came for our guns....
While we honor our veterans today, let's also spare a thought for the virtues of an armed citizenry. Seventy-two years ago (November 9–10, 1938) the anti-Jewish attacks known as Kristallnacht, or the Night of Broken Glass, took place throughout Nazi Germany and parts of Austria.
What made Kristallnacht possible? For one thing, a sustained effort by the Nazi government to disarm all Jews in the period leading up to the attacks. The facts are laid out in this fascinating article by Stephen Halbrook in the St. Thomas Law Review (ht/Volokh ). A brief snippet:
Over a period of several weeks in October and November 1938, the Nazi government disarmed the German Jewish population. The process was carried out both by following a combination of legal forms enacted by the Weimar Republic and by sheer lawless violence. The Nazi hierarchy could now more comfortably deal with the Jewish question without fear of armed resistance by the victims.
It may be tempting to argue that the possession of firearms by the German Jews would have made no difference, either in the 1938 pogrom or later in the Holocaust, when the majority were deported and then eradicated in death camps. Yet this fatalistic view ignores that the Nazis themselves viewed armed Jews as sufficiently dangerous to their policies to place great emphasis on the need to disarm all Jews. In 1938, it was by no means certain that Jewish armed resistance movements could not develop, and even less certain that individual Jews would not use arms to resist arrest, deportation, or attacks by the Nazis.
Stalin and Pol Pot, incidentally, also moved to disarm their citizens before their reigns of terror. For those who invoke the rallying cry of "Never Again," -- and count me in -- it's useful to consider the role of an armed citizenry in resisting oppression.
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Aug '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
And remember folks, guns don't kill people.
National socialist governments kill people.
Aug '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Oh Adam, you bitter clinger you!
In all seriousness, I'm not sure how much defense I could put up against the military or the police with my 30.06 rifle and my 3 shotguns (I'm sure there are many people, including some Richocheters, whose arsenals are much more formidable than mine).
However, given the conservative nature of the members of our military, I have a hard time imagining the circumstances under which they would obey an order to disarm the citizenry. The police may be slighty more likely to do so but even that is a huge stretch in my mind. So I guess what I'm saying is that the possibility doesn't keep me up at night...
Aug '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
In my opinion it is a duty, not merely a right, for any person that is legally able to own a gun to do so and to see to it that they can employ it safely and effectively. Depending upon the laws of your state, it is important also for all who are able to obtain a concealed carry permit and to be armed as much as possible. Depending on your state, the next step is to work to have a law enacted that permits open carry. The purpose of this is not for the purpose of displaying a gun as in the old days of Dodge City, but in order to protect licensed carriers from legal penalties when on rare and accidental occasions (e.g. a sudden wind blowing a jacket open) a gun or its print on clothing is revealed.
Edited on Nov 11, 2010 at 1:19pmNov '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
My Confession: Although Oklahoma does allow concealed carry, I've always been too broke (or lazy, those times that money wasn't such an issue) to go about purchasing and practicing with a firearm. I am, however, well skilled with my medieval warhammer.
So, I won't be much threat if the Brownshirts come knocking, but hopefully I'll get to knock out a tooth or something.
May '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
When I read Mollie's post the other day about the government kidnapping a couple's baby, my first thought was the necessity of guns to protect freedom. In many cases, I'd accept wrongful imprisonment before resulting to armed defense, but some tyrannical acts cannot be tolerated. There have to be boundaries, though it can be difficult to identify them until they've been crossed. I would not have waited on lawyers while my child was taken.
Re: First they came for our guns....
Blakes7th: My Confession: Although Oklahoma does allow concealed carry, I've always been too broke (or lazy, those times that money wasn't such an issue) to go about purchasing and practicing with a firearm. I am, however, well skilled with my medieval warhammer.
So, I won't be much threat if the Brownshirts come knocking, but hopefully I'll get to knock out a tooth or something. · Nov 11 at 1:41pm
You know, I'd really like to see a picture of that warhammer. I mean, I think I know what one looks like, but I'm not sure.
Aug '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
F.C., Please reconsider. The reason that it is hard--at present--for you to imagine a gun grab is that America is generally pro-gun. But the military is changing and will likely change further. If the military realizes a promotion of homosexuals in its officer ranks, I predict that the military will suffer the same cultural revolution that seminaries, academia and Hollywood underwent. It won't be your mother's Army any longer. To another point of yours--of course you can imagine a multitude of scenarios where you do not win using a .22 against three tanks, two battalions, an off-shore aircraft carrier, a warship launching cruise missiles, and a squad car with two sheriff's deputies. What you should imagine is a cop in a future condition of political strife, weighing whether he and his pard alone want to go knocking on your door to execute some unrighteous law.
Adam, why is "it can't happen here" such a perniciously difficult misconception to eradicate?
Edited on Nov 11, 2010 at 3:19pmMay '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Another reason I'll never understand why Jews so lopsidely vote Democrat, and for adamant gun-grabbers (Richard Durbin, Jan Shakowsky come immediately to mind here in Illinois).
Aug '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Blakes7th, as I said way above, I consider it a duty...I did not say it should be entertaining (though it can be). I know the obstacles you describe. You live in a place with lots of opportunities and the expense is not what you may imagine. Just start investigating.
Jun '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
My county sheriff spoke at our gun club the other night. He said that our community would never have to worry about a gun grab because any three people present in the room were more heavily armed than his entire department. So... there's that. It's good to live in the South.
Aug '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Casey, you are not a Veteran yet, I suppose, but I just want to thank you, Dave Carter and any other soldiers, sailors, airmen--as well as our Veterans--reading this today for your sacrifices.
Jun '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Thank you, David!
As always, the greatest pleasure of my life is the opportunity to serve my countrymen and country.
Edited on Nov 11, 2010 at 4:04pmNov '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
@ David Schmitt: If nothing else, more than a few of my close friends could spot me one for awhile.
@ Rob: I'll see if I can get my wife to tell me where the camera is, and then post a pic of it as my profile. Until then, here's a link to a pic of a pretty close approximation.
http://www.medievalware.com/v/vspfiles/photos/600054RM-2.jpg
May '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Blakes7th: My Confession: Although Oklahoma does allow concealed carry, I've always been too broke (or lazy, those times that money wasn't such an issue) to go about purchasing and practicing with a firearm. I am, however, well skilled with my medieval warhammer.
So, I won't be much threat if the Brownshirts come knocking, but hopefully I'll get to knock out a tooth or something. · Nov 11 at 1:41pm
Blakes7th, you realize your decision not to own a gun is protected by those of us who do? David is right. We protect our right to bear arms by actively exercising it. Use it or lose it.
Jun '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
No worries. I'll be in Tulsa for Thanksgiving, I'll hook you up. ;)
May '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Blakes7th, now you're going to think I'm picking on you. :-) I don't think you understand gun owners. If you want to go practice shooting a gun at a range, great. Many gun owners would be happy to encourage your interest. But, if Adam's topic of this thread ever played out and there's a threat to your friends' property (losing their guns) or their personal safety (not having their guns with them) you had better have a back-up plan. If there is ever chaos, it will be every man for himself.
Nov '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Well, I don't mean to say I'd wait for it to hit the fan and *then* go asking around for a spare. All I meant is don't worry about me, I have plenty of friends I can call on to help me get started.
Sep '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Armed citizens certainly help create checks and balances against an over aggressive government. Still, how many times do you hear gun-control types say things like, "Assault rifles are not useful for hunting or recreational shooting such as target practice"? I'm pretty sure that the Founding Father's were not thinking about shooting quail and beer cans when they wrote the Second Amendment.
May '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Phew...I'm so relieved. I was a little worried about you, but I see you have a fellow Ricochet friend offering "to hook you up", too. And I bet you'll be in good hands with Casey. :-)
Jun '10
Re: First they came for our guns....
Blakes7th, shoot me a line with any questions you have if you're looking to get started. I'm a firearms instructor as well as an enthusiast. I'm sweet and well-mannered, to boot.