English Language, R.I.P.
Pat Sajak ·
Sep 20, 2010 at 9:48am
Though I screw it up as much as the next guy, I really care about our language. I know it evolves, but I like to think there's some guiding force on high that cares for it and keeps that evolution from spiraling out of control. But, in these days of texts and tweets, there's little doubt the process has accelerated. In fact, there's evidence it might be too late to save it. This piece in Sunday's Washington Post reflects my sadness at its passing.
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May '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
I don't write correctly but I do write well for broadcasting, which is what I've done for so long. When I was producing on a regular basis I seemed to be able to channel the three play-by-play guys I worked with on a regular basis, their rhythms and cadences played inside my head.
Ellipses are my best friend... short... punchy... David Brinkley style... But an English teacher's nightmare...
May '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
This article seems to describe the demise of the English language less than the decline and potential demise of the typical journalist's quality of education. I'd love to get Lileks' take on this matter. Has James noticed a general decline in the erudition of the average newsroom?
Edited on Sep 20, 2010 at 10:29amJun '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
When I have any questions about proper English usage, I ask my friend Sanjay.
Jun '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Gr-8 post, Pat! But, U worry 2 much.
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Pat, I think their being to picky. Irregardless, the point of you're words is to be understood. The media doesn't always except this. Its' sort of they're big problem.
Jun '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
I am not understanding your thinking, Rob, cuz there are no gerunds in you're sentencing structure. Otherwise I luvin' it!
Jun '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Here's a little experiment that demonstrates Pat's point. Take any speech given by Winston Churchill or either of Lincoln's inauguration addresses and read them compared to any speech given by the One. Churchill's and Lincoln's speeches sing because they are carefully crafted and very specific (no one could misunderstand what Churchill meant when he said the English would fight the Nazis on the landing grounds and on the beaches). Compared to them, Obama's speeches are flat, vague, abstract, and read like a computer instruction manual.
Churchill and Lincoln had some specific things to say that they wanted the people to understand. Obama's speeches are, in contrast, intended to obfuscate, over-generalize well beyond dishonesty, and to demonize his opponents. His speeches are Exhibit A to the following comment by George Orwell in his great essay "Politics and the English Language": "The great enemy of clear language is insincerity. When there is a gap between one's real and one's declared aims, one turns as it were instinctively to long words and exhausted idioms, like a cuttlefish spurting out ink."
Edited on Sep 20, 2010 at 11:50amRe: English Language, R.I.P.
Not really. If you see more errors these days, it's probably because copy desks at many papers are understaffed, and must process enormous amounts of copy while an enormous, sweaty, half-naked slavemaster walks up and down the aisle thumping on a drum to set the pace. You may ask "what else is new?" but the position is now part-time.
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
By the way, that WaPo piece is by Gene Weingarten, one of the few great writers they have left. He wrote a book about hypochondria a few years ago, and I told him this was a mistake because the only people who cared about the subject would be afraid to read the book lest they get everything he describes. He didn't listen.
He also discovered some guy named David Barry many years ago.
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
I was writing something once and wanted to use the compound deep-seated/deep-seeded. Look it up online. Try to discern the correct version.
We need our generation's Strunk and White.
Edited on Sep 20, 2010 at 12:28pmRe: English Language, R.I.P.
whatsthefracas: I was writing something once and wanted to use the compound deep-seated/deep-seeded. Look it up online. Try to discern the correct version.
We need our generation's Strunk and White. · Sep 20 at 12:27pm
Edited on Sep 20 at 12:28 pm
I don't actually know what the correct version is, but I'd have to guess "deep-seeded." "Deep-seeded anger" would be anger that's planted deep within someone's heart (or mind, or whatever) and has thus been growing for a while. What would "deep-seated anger" be? Anger that you sit on?
Aug '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
What would "deep-seated anger" be? Anger that you sit on?
Mechanical objects can be seated into grooves or slots or cradles, so a deep-seated part would be entrenched and difficult to remove. So I guess that deep-seated anger is firmly entrenched and difficult to let go.
Just like deep-seeded?
Jun '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Mark Woodworth: What would "deep-seated anger" be? Anger that you sit on?
Mechanical objects can be seated into grooves or slots or cradles, so a deep-seated part would be entrenched and difficult to remove. So I guess that deep-seated anger is firmly entrenched and difficult to let go.
Just like deep-seeded? · Sep 20 at 12:47pm
I'm with Mark on this one. Although "anger that you sit on" is consistent with Mark's definition in the sense that I tend to have "deep-seated anger" against people who are a "pain in the a**."
Aug '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Is it just me, or does it seem like Rob Long wrote this sentence in Cantonese and then ran it through Babelfish?
Jun '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Misthiocracy
Is it just me, or does it seem like Rob Long wrote this sentence in Cantonese and then ran it through Babelfish? · Sep 20 at 1:27pm
Actually, my reaction was something like, "Geez, Rob's writing is a lot clearer since he hired James Lileks to edit his posts."
Edited on Sep 20, 2010 at 1:35pmMay '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
I don't know if the language is dead, but the brains of the people using are on life support. Consider this lede from NY Times television reviewer Mike Hale:
"In her new documentary for HBO, “The Fence,” Rory Kennedy takes just over a half-hour to demonstrate that the border fence between the United States and Mexico is a political boondoggle that kills migrants but doesn’t keep them out of the country."
So, these are people are not only illegal, but they are also zombies. It killed them but didn't keep them out. Next on HBO, Night of the Living Produce Pickers...
Edited on Sep 20, 2010 at 1:37pmMay '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Time for me read The Elements of Style again. I don't have a natural talent for writing so I have to revisit it every few years. Thanks for reminding me.
This is from one of my favorite blogs but if Google is the final arbiter of English usage, then I think the language is a goner: http://volokh.com/2010/09/18/before-making-an-assertion-about-english-usage-how-about-looking-it-up/
(OT but related to the above link, is there such a thing as Blogger's Hubris? Is it me or are bloggers increasingly confrontational towards their readers?)
May '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
Merriam-Webster claims that "whatsoever" is a word and "afterall" is not. Let's find some middle ground between relying on authorities and abandoning standards altogether.
The same goes for definitions, by the way. Not every definition provided by Oxford or Merriam-Webster is worth a cent.
May '10
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
I am not sure how many bloggers actually make a living at it. If there's no economic pressure on a blogger to keep an audience he might not feel compelled to respect them or be nice to them.
Re: English Language, R.I.P.
I'll go even further and say that the editors of today's dictionaries are the Jack Kevorkians of our dead language. They are all "descriptivists," which is to say that they'll repeat whatever nonsense they hear on the street. Robert Fiske (of Vocabula Review) rightly refers to them as "Laxocographers."
My suggestion: pour yourself a drink and curl up with a copy of Fowler's (preferably an older edition). Granted, it won't revive the language but it will make you feel better.