Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Well, if they're good enough to go after terrorists in Pakistan, they're good enough to go after cattle thieves, right? From the Los Angeles Times:
Armed with a search warrant, Nelson County Sheriff Kelly Janke went looking for six missing cows on the Brossart family farm in the early evening of June 23. Three men brandishing rifles chased him off, he said.
Janke knew the gunmen could be anywhere on the 3,000-acre spread in eastern North Dakota. Fearful of an armed standoff, he called in reinforcements from the state Highway Patrol, a regional SWAT team, a bomb squad, ambulances and deputy sheriffs from three other counties.
He also called in a Predator B drone.
As the unmanned aircraft circled 2 miles overhead the next morning, sophisticated sensors under the nose helped pinpoint the three suspects and showed they were unarmed. Police rushed in and made the first known arrests of U.S. citizens with help from a Predator, the spy drone that has helped revolutionize modern warfare.
It just reminds me how I'd read dystopian fiction in high school and think about how happy I was that surveillance such as this wouldn't ever happen in the United States.
- Comment (28)
- · Quote
- · UnfollowFollow (2)
- Pages:
- 1
- 2
Comments:
Dec '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Honestly I don't really expect drones to do so well in as technologically advance place as the US.
That said I have no more philosophical problem with unman drones being used for law enforcement than I do bomb disposal robots.
May '11
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Nyadnar, what makes you think a technologically advanced place would be different?
I wonder how the police would respond to citizens (or "journalists") using drones to monitor their activities?
Dec '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
This is the technology Perry advocates using on the border. I think this story demonstrates its usefulness.
May '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
I don't see the problem in this context. What's the difference between this and sending in a helicopter to find the guys, other than eliminating the risk to the pilot?
Do you have some concern about a slippery slope?
May '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
PJ: I don't see the problem in this context. What's the difference between this and sending in a helicopter to find the guys, other than eliminating the risk to the pilot?
Do you have some concern about a slippery slope? · Dec 13 at 7:19am
I was thinking we shout someone with a hellfire. How is this different than a helecopter?
Aug '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
WHY THIS IS NOT A PROBLEM
WHY THIS IS A PROBLEM
Aug '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Also, I get a kick out of it when extremists who claim their beef is with the Federal Government refuse to cooperate with LOCAL law enforcement officials.
Helloooooo?
Jan '11
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
COULD WE USE DRONES TO HELP AMBULANCE CREWS IN THE BOONIES?
How about using drones to provide communications for ambulances transporting seriously ill patients over spans which lack cellular communication?
I live two hours from the nearest cardiac catheterization lab, and weather here prevents medical helicopter flights several dozen days per year, particularly in the winter. During the two hour (or more in severe weather) ambulance ride, there are significant stretches where the ambulance loses contact with Medical Center expert help.
I've wondered if drones could act as communication relay repeaters circling overhead to provide communications-- including telemetry-- for transporting critically ill patients when weather precludes the use of choppers.
Dec '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
As far as I know, Perry is the only candidate to advocate using drones for border patrol. I've not heard any of the other candidates even speak to the issue, nor have I come across a discussion of it in my reading. I've often wondered why Perry's idea has gotten no attention -- good or bad. Any thoughts or citations?
Aug '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Freeven
As far as I know, Perry is the only candidate to advocate using drones for border patrol. I've not heard any of the other candidates even speak to the issue, nor have I come across a discussion of it in my reading. I've often wondered why Perry's idea has gotten no attention -- good or bad. Any thoughts or citations? · Dec 13 at 9:46am
Drones are already used for border patrol. US Customs and Border Protection owns eight drones which it operates on the US/Canada border and the US/Mexico border.
Aug '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Couldn't balloons or blimps do the same job at a lower cost?
Mar '11
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
I don't think posse comitatus is an issue here. The military isn't arresting anyone, they are just answering the question "where are there people on this property?" It is still going to be the Sherriff who hikes in there to make the arrest.
There doesn't seem to be any difference between this and using a helicopter. Cost might be an issue: I don't know what UAV flyovers are going for, but helicopters get really pricey really fast.
Dec '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Misthiocracy
Freeven
As far as I know, Perry is the only candidate to advocate using drones for border patrol. I've not heard any of the other candidates even speak to the issue, nor have I come across a discussion of it in my reading. I've often wondered why Perry's idea has gotten no attention -- good or bad. Any thoughts or citations? · Dec 13 at 9:46am
Drones are already used for border patrol. US Customs and Border Protection owns eight drones which it operates on the US/Canada border and the US/Mexico border. · Dec 13 at 9:56am
I didn't know this. Thanks.
Dec '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
From this article.
The argument against them is basically a case against government abuse of whatever power government has. It's the age old balance of liberty and security. Things on the border are bad enough to risk the technology, at least in my opinion. Believe it or not, there is actually a congressional caucus (the Congressional Unmanned Systems Caucus, commonly known as the Drone Caucus) that is pushing for more of this. I can't say it's a horrible idea. Of course, as with any government program, too much is never enough for those who receive either money, power, or prestige from a program.
Oct '11
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
I'm okay with this practice so long as there are limits. One reason that helicopters work is that they are prohibitively expensive and cumbersome, which act as a natural deterrent against using them for low level work. If you were to remove those features, as with drones, you get a much more potentially invasive situation. But no-one's talking about limits, as Mollie's article points out. Like Misthio said, Posse Comitatus Act only applies to military, and Border Patrol is DHS, but the reservations for using military-like power still stand.
I don't know what exactly the limits should be, but limiting their use to felonies that pose a danger to law enforcement, and exclusion of any evidence for crimes other than those specifically sought in the warrant (no "plain view doctrine"), would be a good start. If these drones could save officer and lawbreaker lives while providing a cheaper alternative to surveillance, then I say we use them, but they have to be used for that purpose. Mark Steyn often refers to the UK government's installation of security cameras at stoplights as another step closer to what Mollie warns about. Same goes here.
Aug '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
While Border Patrol is DHS, the drones are flown out of USAF bases.
Nov '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
I think there are more serious issues vis-a-vis US internal security/police powers and constitutional conflicts. Heck, the United States Attorney General is a one-man constitutional crisis.
Nov '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
I think there are more serious issues vis-a-vis US internal security/police powers and constitutional conflicts. Heck, the United States Attorney General is a one-man constitutional crisis.
Jul '10
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
I've never quite understood the argument that increased efficiency alone can render a technique improper. If drones can do the same thing as helicopters at lower cost, wouldn't that be a benefit to the public fisc?
Q: What's the difference between an unthinking, robotic drone and a journalist?
A: Me neither.
Oct '11
Re: Drones Used By American Law Enforcement
Misthiocracy
While Border Patrol is DHS, the drones are flown out of USAF bases.
The courts use the McArthur test, which basically asks whether the Army or Air Force actively assist, so as to exert influence, or are passively providing assistance. I think it probably is the latter, though it seems like the Air Force provides a lot of assistance, so I'm not really sure.
Wylee Coyote
I've never quite understood the argument that increased efficiency alone can render a technique improper. If drones can do the same thing as helicopters at lower cost, wouldn't that be a benefit to the public fisc?
Oh, I didn't mean to say that was the only reason, just that right now it acts as a natural limit. I'm all for making things cheaper, and even expanding use as cost drops, we should just recognize the consequences of it and adjust accordingly.
Edited on December 13, 2011 at 10:06pm