Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Peter Robinson ·
Feb 1, 2011 at 10:21am
From today's Wall Street Journal, on Judge Vinson's decision yesterday striking down ObamaCare as unconstitutional:
The judge said he didn't believe an injunction to stop the health overhaul was appropriate, because it is generally understood that the executive branch will obey a federal court. The government, however, doesn't seem to believe the ruling requires it to stop implementing the overhaul.
The Obama administration intends to flout a ruling by a federal judge? Isn't that pretty, well, serious?
John? Richard? Anyone?
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Jun '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
I'm no John Yoo, but even I can see that's pretty darn serious. And shameful.
Oct '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
I am not aware that a writ was issued. If it was not, then the legislation stands pending appeal to a more superior court. Also, it is my understanding is that the Supreme Court has already decided upon the expedition of this and the other suit(s) pertaining to Obamacare to that level.
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Thank you for this, Peter. I thought we were in a new era of Obama-inspired civility, but the White House is attacking Judge Vinson's ruling politically, and also indicating that it will not comply.
Read page 75 of the ruling for yourself. And imagine how this would play in the media if, say, the Bush Administration was refusing to comply with a federal court order.
Sep '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Who says Mubarak has no influence on the world stage anymore?
Dec '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
This admin has routinely ignored what "it is generally understood the executive branch will" do and not do.
Has the executive branch ever reported an entire State to the UN for human rights violations when it has not won that claim in court, if ever?
Has the executive branch ever accused a former admin of deliberately sanctioning torture before and without bringing suit in the courts?
Has the head of any admin ever before bowed deeply before a foreign leader, or ever publicly criticized and condemned his own country on foreign soil?
Oct '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
George Savage: Thank you for this, Peter. I thought we were in a new era of Obama-inspired civility, but the White House is attacking Judge Vinson's ruling politically, and also indicating that it will not comply.
Read page 75 of the ruling for yourself. And imagine how this would play in the media if, say, the Bush Administration was refusing to comply with a federal court order. · Feb 1 at 10:39am
Thank you George, I stand correncted. The judge states that, in this case "declatory relief" which was granted by the ruling is substantively equivalent to "injunctive relief".
It will be interesting to see how the plaintiffs respond to the Executive if it refuses to cease and desist. I would imagine that the Executive will appeal for a stay of Judge Vinsons order.
Jul '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
The centralizing impulse of the left has run flat up against Constitutional limits. But does the left recognize limits? Rahm didn't live in Chicago, but he'll be mayor even though he chose to ignore the residential requirement. Compliant judges took an expansive view of the meaning of residency. There are at least four SC justices of this character.
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
I think the only President who directly disobeyed an order of a federal judge was Abraham Lincoln (though Thomas Jefferson and Andrew Jackson came pretty close). For all his faux comparisons to Lincoln, I don't think Obama wants to emulate the Great Emancipator on this one. Lincoln refused to carry out Chief Justice Taney's order that the military release a rebel at the very start of the Civil War. We are in no such crisis. Even Nixon obeyed the Supreme Court's order to turn over the Watergate Tapes.
But I bet this is not a constitutional confrontation of a similar magnitude -- Obama would be only panicking into an escalation that is not to his advantage. Or it could be yet another example of the risky and unwise gamble of Obama's Department of Justice: threaten that the heavens will fall if any judge holds any provision of the bill unconstitutional. If so, they are playing right into the hands of the opponents of Obamacare, who would rejoice that a) DOJ has succeeded in getting the whole bill enjoined; and b) that a President would invoke the right to disobey the federal courts on something this minor. I have to believe if all of this talk of cooler heads joining the administration is true, the White House will pull back from this course.
Edited on Feb 1, 2011 at 10:58amRe: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Implementing the health overhaul requires the cooperation of the states. What happens if the twenty-six states that were a party to this suit announce that they will not cooperate until and unless Judge Vinson's ruling is overturned.
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
This confrontation could be defused into a narrower issue involving the power of the federal courts. Not to get too technical about it, but Judge Vinson is a judge in Florida; he may not have the authority to stop the healthcare bill in its operation everywhere in the country, because his court's reach only goes as far as the territory of the district in which his court sits. Obama's DOJ could claim that it is entitled to move forward on implementing the bill in the other parts of the country. It is then incumbent on Obama to seek an immediate stay of Vinson's decision from the federal appellate court of that region (the 11th Circuit) so that the appeal can move forward (ultimately to the Supreme Court) without requiring a halt to the entire bill.
Jun '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
George Savage: Thank you for this, Peter. I thought we were in a new era of Obama-inspired civility, but the White House is attacking Judge Vinson's ruling politically, and also indicating that it will not comply.
Read page 75 of the ruling for yourself. And imagine how this would play in the media if, say, the Bush Administration was refusing to comply with a federal court order. · Feb 1 at 10:39am
One would hope that some Republican sharp cookie in Congress will press the point that the ruling is essentially the same as an injunction (as stated on page 75) and that the Obama administration might want to back off their strident position. If the volume on this gets raised in the well of the House and in the Senate, wouldn't it be more likely that the Supremes would take the case sooner rather than later to resolve the dispute?
Jun '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
So the additional states that appealed to the 11th Circuit aren't covered by Vinson"s decision? If that is so, why did they bother to appeal to the 11th Circuit? Did he make a ruling that he has incomplete jurisdiction over? Are you saying this would be DOJ's case?
May '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Since all three branches of government (house, senate, and president) passed the bill last year, what difference does it make what a Federal judge rules?
Jul '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
ObamaCare was enacted against the Will of the People. Would Obama dare to be perceived against/above the Judicial Branch of government too?
Dec '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Maybe the DoJ would sue all of them. I'd love to see that happen.
Jul '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Well, the House and Senate is one branch. The third would be the Judicial Branch.
Oct '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
This is not true. The representatives in congress are the legitimate expression of the "will of the people" in a Republic. It's just that the congress which passed the legislation was propelled by an historical progressive impules whose political incarnation was not truly consistant with the conservative values of the culture. In other words, it seemed like a good idea in the abstract but a bad one in practice. IMHO the reason Obamacare passed was that the people put too much faith in the ability of big government to solve individual problems and became impatient for "change". The change they got was not the change they wanted.
May '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Judge Vinson states that "declaratory judgment is, in a context such as this where federal officers are defendants, the practical equivalent of specific relief such as an injunction" and concludes that "the award of declaratory relief is adequate and separate injunctive relief is not necessary."
Surely, there must be some difference between a declaratory judgment and an injunction, or no judge would ever issue an injunction. Correct? So what's the difference?
If they are different in any way, then why leave open even the remote possibility that the President could interpret the ruling to exclude an injunction?
Jul '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Nickolas
The judge said he didn't believe an injunction to stop the health overhaul was appropriate, because it is generally understood that the executive branch will obey a federal court.
Why would he assume such a thing regarding this administration?
I seem to recall a Federal Judge issuing a decision that the Gulf Oil Drilling Moratorum was Null and Void last year, which the Administration propmtly ignored and continued the Moratorium!
Nothing new.
Jul '10
Re: Do We Have a Constitutional Crisis on Our Hands? Or, Calling Mssrs. Epstein and Yoo
Chuck Schumer resembles that remark.
It's too bad Sarah Palin didn't say that, then there would be a full court press by the Lame Stream Media to make sure everyone knew what the actual three branches are.
Edited on Feb 1, 2011 at 11:53am