No, no that Barbara Bush--the other one.

29-year-old daughter of President George W. Bush announces in a web video posted late Monday that she supports same-sex marriage. “I’m Barbara Bush and I’m a New Yorker for marriage equality,” she says. “New York is about fairness and equality. And everyone should have the right to marry the person that they love.”

Watch the clip here

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etoiledunord
Joined
Jun '10
etoiledunord

I think I'll stick with God's plan--one man, one woman. Done properly, it still works.

Andrew Klavan

As I recall, I saw Laura Bush say she supported gay marriage on Huckabee.  (She was on Huckabee at the time, I mean.  She didn't support gays getting married right there on Huckabee, which would be indecent.)  This is just about the one issue on which I think the right is wrong and I'm glad to see more conservatives leading the way to more tolerance instead of letting the slavering, hateful radicals of the left steal the show.

drlorentz
Joined
Sep '10
drlorentz

Barbara Bush's grammar needs work: "...everyone...they"?? Please! Is this a generation thing or what?

Perhaps Barb could benefit from Grammar Girl's books or podcast.

Foxman
Joined
Dec '10
Foxman

The government should get out of the marriage business and into the civil union business.  Marriage is the business of religion.  It has been traditionally run by the government because, until relatively recently, the government and the religion were the same thing. 

If two people choose to form a civil union they should be able to go downtown and file a contract.  This could be a standard contract or a custom one that would take the place of a pre-nuptial.  This would cover legal matters such as property and who makes the final medical decisions if one of the parties is incapacitated. 

If these people choose to go their place of worship and participate in whatever ritual their faith tradition prescribes, that would be their decision. 

Edited on Feb 1, 2011 at 8:45am
raycon
Joined
Oct '10
RAYCON
Andrew Klavan: This is just about the one issue on which I think the right is wrong and I'm glad to see more conservatives leading the way to more tolerance instead of letting the slavering, hateful radicals of the left steal the show. · Feb 1 at 8:29am

Andrew... you could be more convincing if you could name actual conservatives in leadership who were on the bandwagon.  The destruction of all Western institutions is on track, and this is just one more step in the process.  Civil unions provide almost the same rights as does marriage, except one; acceptance by historical Western culture.  They damage the fabric of cultural preference for the stable replacement of dying members of the population with other members equally committed to the continuance of the existing culture.  Now... if you are fine with the end of Western civilization, than gay marriage is OK.

Edited on Feb 1, 2011 at 8:47am
Michael Tee
Joined
Jul '10
Michael Tee

Who cares what Barbara Bush thinks?

I'd disagree with Klavan that any Bush is a conservative, but again, no energy to do so. (Conservatives need to conserve something, one would think.)

What would be the point?

Calling a dog a chair doesn't make it so.

Marriage is not defined in my OED to mean two people of the same sex.

Foxman
Joined
Dec '10
Foxman

 "Now... if you are fine with the end of Western civilization, than gay marriage is OK."

Marriage, the joining of two people that only can be desolved in the most severe of circumstances, hasn't been aroud for some time.

raycon
Joined
Oct '10
RAYCON

Foxman: The government should get out of the marriage business and into the civil union business.  Marriage is the business of religion.  It has been traditionally run by the government because, until relatively recently, the government and the religion were the same thing.  · Feb 1 at 8:44am

Edited on Feb 01 at 08:45 am

It works great in many countries.  Just like it works well here to forgo the "marriage" institution.  The statistics are all on your side, just check out the relationship between marriage and most of the metrics that we have always considered important here in America... low crime rates, children going on to productive, meaningful lives, self reliance.  I guess the pathological underclass has it all going for it.  Don't need that marriage commitment stuff.  Linda and I have had it wrong for over 42 years now.

Foxman
Joined
Dec '10
Foxman

 By the way, where in the bible does it say that marriage is between one man and one woman?

One man? Yes I can see that.  One woman?  I see lots of polygamy in the bible.

Aaron Miller
Joined
May '10
Aaron Miller

I'm against it, but momentum is definitely swinging the other way.

Change via the legislature is at least a generation away. It will continue to be imposed on us by judicial fiat.

Matthew Lawrence
Joined
Aug '10
Matthew Lawrence

Foxman, one does not see polygamy sanctioned by God.

It seems to me that as long as mankind has been on this planet, if homosexual marriage were a good and beneficial thing, it would have already been worked our successfully. 

Erik Larsen
Joined
Jan '11
Erik Larsen

Gay marriage doesn't bother me, although I kind of like what Foxman says - let everything be a civil ceremony unless it's in a church, and the church can decide whatever they want to do about the issue.

The big elephant in the room is polygamy.  It is real in North America, and people from other countries are bringing in multiple wives who are being supported by the government.  This isn't an issue of "whichever-phobia" or hatred, it is real and happening. 

Should this be accepted in North America?

Paul DeRocco
Joined
Aug '10
Paul DeRocco

This is what happens when your brain has been marinating in feminism for decades: you internalize the idea that gender is a meaningless characteristic, and that all gender distinctions constitute prima facie discrimination. It's only a matter of time before you have to say, hey, I guess marriage is discrimination, too.

The issue isn't about whether homosexuals should be allowed to do anything, but whether everyone else should be required to recognize what they do as indistinguishable from what heterosexuals do. No one's trying to stop gays from having their relationship--"liberals" are trying to brand anyone who regards the union of a man and a woman as meaningful, in a way that the union of two men or two women isn't, as a bigot.

What scares me is how many so-called conservatives have been infected by this. It's like the pod people have taken over.

Andrew Klavan

Oh, gee, let me be clear.  I agree with Foxman that the world would be better off if marriage were purely a religious issue and the government only approved civil unions - which I actually think would strengthen both marriage and religion.  And I also agree the Bushes aren't paragons of conservatism.  But this is ultimately picayune stuff.  The basic idea is that two gay people should be able faithfully to love one another with the approval of society.  I know plenty of powerful and highly placed conservatives who agree with this.  The end of western civilization?  C'mon.  It's a change typical of western civilization.

Paul DeRocco
Joined
Aug '10
Paul DeRocco

Foxman:  By the way, where in the bible does it say that marriage is between one man and one woman?

One man? Yes I can see that.  One woman?  I see lots of polygamy in the bible.

Even in polygamous societies, marriage is still the union of one man and one woman. If a man has multiple wives, he is involved in multiple marriages. That's what "polygamy" means. Similarly, a "job" is the union of one employer and one employee; if you have two employers, you have two jobs.

Foxman
Joined
Dec '10
Foxman
Matthew Lawrence: Foxman, one does not see polygamy sanctioned by God.  · Feb 1 at 9:02am

King David was called out for marrying Bathsheba, but not because he was already married, which he was.  Do you think, if God objected to David’s polygamy, Nathan might have mentioned it?

Please give me chapter and verse to support your opinion.

Matthew Lawrence
Joined
Aug '10
Matthew Lawrence

Foxman, one does not see polygamy sanctioned by God.

It seems to me that as long as mankind has been on this planet, if homosexual marriage were a good and beneficial thing, it would have already been worked our successfully. 

Paul DeRocco
Joined
Aug '10
Paul DeRocco
Andrew Klavan: Oh, gee, let me be clear.  I agree with Foxman that the world would be better off if marriage were purely a religious issue and the government only approved civil unions - which I actually think would strengthen both marriage and religion.  And I also agree the Bushes aren't paragons of conservatism.  But this is ultimately picayune stuff.  The basic idea is that two gay people should be able faithfully to love one another with the approval of society.  I know plenty of powerful and highly placed conservatives who agree with this.  The end of western civilization?  C'mon.  It's a change typical of western civilization. · Feb 1 at 9:05am

You can't separate "gay marriage" from everything else it is related to--it is merely one particularly dramatic symptom of what modern feminism is doing to our culture, which boils down to the attempted abolition of gender. That is what will lead to the end of western civilization.

Good Berean
Joined
Oct '10
Good Berean
Andrew Klavan: Oh, gee, let me be clear.  I agree with Foxman that the world would be better off if marriage were purely a religious issue and the government only approved civil unions - which I actually think would strengthen both marriage and religion.  And I also agree the Bushes aren't paragons of conservatism.  But this is ultimately picayune stuff.  The basic idea is that two gay people should be able faithfully to love one another with the approval of society.  I know plenty of powerful and highly placed conservatives who agree with this.  The end of western civilization?  C'mon.  It's a change typical of western civilization. · Feb 1 at 9:05am

I do not agree that gay marriage "should" be approved by "society". I believe that gay marriage, under a federal system, "may" be approved in some jurisdictions as a result of legislation arising from a legitimate democratic process within that jurisdiction (ie State or County). However, when you speak of "society" the conotation is the whole of the Republic, and If gay marriage is repugnant to even a minority of "society" then legalization at the national level is anti-federal..

Leslie Watkins
Joined
Sep '10
Leslie Watkins

I happen to be gay. I also believe that under the law there should be no bias in favor of marriage (e.g., estate taxes being lower for widows than for unmarried inheritors) . But also, because I respect tradition and the sensibilities of religious people, I do not see this form of inequality being properly corrected by forcing the use of "marriage" on relationships not traditionally covered under the rubric. Also, it seems to me that gay people are trying to crash a party that's already over. To quote Foxman, "Marriage, the joining of two people that only can be dissolved in the most severe of circumstances, hasn't been around for some time." If heterosexuals were really concerned about the fate of marriage, they'd go after divorce far more vigorously than extension of marriage itself.


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