Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Frozen Chosen ·
December 1, 2011 at 1:11am
Perry's the man!.....er, no, Herman's the man!.... wait, I mean, Newt's the man!
Are Republican primary voters (at least those in the polls) highly emotional or just flaky? Newt is the same guy he was 6 months ago - if he's so highly qualified to be president now how come he wasn't then? I thought the Democrats were the party of feelings and the Republicans were supposed to be the party of logic.
What's going on here?
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Comments:
Dec '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
We're not flip-floppers. Our standards have not changed. We've measured each candidate against those standards, and when they failed to measure up we've discarded them.
Apr '11
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
For me, at least, it's a matter of others falling, rather than Newt rising.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
If Newt measures up shouldn't you have supported him from the start? Did you just figure out he was a good debater?
Dec '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Frozen Chosen
If Newt measures up shouldn't you have supported him from the start? Did you just figure out he was a good debater? · Nov 30 at 2:07pm
His past failings kept many (myself included) from taking him seriously when he first announced. He was an old book with a ragged cover. It wasn't until all the other books turned out to be unsatisfactory that we picked him up and began to read.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
We've had an unprecedented number of debates in which we've had the opportunity to gauge the candidates. And Newt Gingrich has consistently shown himself to be better informed and better prepared for the challenge ahead than the other candidates.
That's what the primary process is supposed to be about: letting voters have a chance to weigh the strengths and weaknesses of the various candidates; not just blindly supporting someone because they happen to be, um, a member of one's church.
You're just pouting because, month after month, your preferred candidate continues to languish.
Edited on November 30, 2011 at 11:23pmJan '11
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
I think it's more a function of the GOP/Tea Party base being pretty cool on Gov. Romney and looking for the most electable alternative to him.
If Gov. Perry hadn't been so verbally challenged, he'd still be in the #1 or #2 position. If Mr. Cain had been more informed and not the subject of those accusations - he'd be in that top tier as well.
I've been thinking alot about Gingrich vs. Romney, the memories of Sharon Angle & Christine O'Donell always in my head. I'm not thrilled with the choice. Gingrich is a lobyist w/ some great ideas and alot of baggage. Romney seems capable yet uninspired-I can't think of a bold stance he's taken that doesn't appear calculated.
Objective #1 - Beat Obama
Objective #2 - Hope the GOP candidate/President is commited & bold enough to turn this ship of state around.
I don't know who that is yet.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
So, according to Elena, Frozen is...
I hope you have some hard evidence to back that up, Elena. Because that's a pretty serious charge to make.
Harry Reid was Mormon of the Year 2009. You honestly think Frozen supports Harry Reid as well? Because that would be the implication of Frozen just blindly supporting his coreligionists.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Midget Faded Rattlesnake: So, according to Elena, Frozen is...
I hope you have some hard evidence to back that up, Elena. Because that's a pretty serious charge to make.
Harry Reid was Mormon of the Year 2009. You honestly think Frozen supports Harry Reid as well? Because that would be the implication of Frozen just blindly supporting his coreligionists. · Nov 30 at 2:38pm
Where's his hard evidence that I am a mindless flip-flopper? I am tired of certain Members branding the rest of us as ignoramuses because we don't support Romney.
And you bringing Harry Reid into it is irrelevant.
Edited on November 30, 2011 at 11:44pmJul '11
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Elena: ...not just blindly supporting someone because they happen to be, um, a member of one's church.
You're just pouting because, month after month, your preferred candidate continues to languish. · Nov 30 at 2:17pm
Edited on Nov 30 at 02:23 pm
Fight, fight, fight!!
May '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Neither fickle or flip-flopping seems the right term for a restless and dissatisfied electorate. We aren't changing positions on key issues. We're looking for the best man for an unbelievably difficult and complicated job in appalling circumstances. There's a constant calculus going on as the primary season unfolds, candidates bomb out or drop out, and new information comes to light. So hopes and aspirations keep shifting.
Edited on December 1, 2011 at 1:15amAug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Elena
I am tired of certain Members branding the rest of us as ignoramuses because we don't support Romney.
If you feel Frozen is trying to brand you or people like you because of his post, maybe you're taking it a bit too personally?
Me, I find this here post by Frozen a bit redundant, since we've had similar conversations started by other members not too long ago. But that doesn't mean Frozen mindlessly supports Romney simply because Romney is Mormon, nor does it mean Frozen is branding the rest of us as ignoramuses.
Elena
And you bringing Harry Reid into it is irrelevant.
Hardly. A person who blindly supported Mormon politicians simply because they were Mormon would support both Romney and Reid.
Elena
Where's his hard evidence that I am a mindless flip-flopper?
Elena, I doubt anyone mistakes you for a mindless flip-flopper on anything. You clearly have no problem sticking to your guns good and hard. But at any rate, an evidence-free insinuation that a person is behaving mindlessly because of his religion is a breach of polite society in a way that merely calling folks flip-floppers is not.
Oct '11
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Since I've pretty much followed Frozen Chosen's trajectory above, here's my thinking.
We need an articulate, persuasive candidate with some of the "vision thing" notably missing in Bush 41; the country's problems are too dire to leave to a candidate running because he thinks he ought to be president, and the remedies are likely to be more painful than slowly ripping off a band-aid.
Romney never did much for me - he falls in the "running because he thinks he ought to be president" category. So I never flipped for him at all.
I heard Bachmann at a live event a couple of years ago and was impressed, so was a fan after the Iowa straw poll, briefly - until the Gardasil->retardation thing.
Perry sounded good on paper - and then he opened his mouth. Articulate? Persuasive? Not.
Cain met those two criteria, but his foreign policy remarks seemed to lack depth, and his campaign handled the recent allegations very badly.
Then I heard some Newt soundbites, and I'm old enough to recall his work as Speaker. Right now, he's meeting my criteria.
Don't know if that's flipflopping or not.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
I think Republicans are understandably very upset and a bit frightened by the course our country has taken under Obama. Many of them are having a visceral reaction to recent events and are angry.
However, I fear this reaction is primarily driven by emotions which explains the wild swing in support for the various candidates. Strong emotions can be a positive thing when they motivate people to action but they can also lead to bad decisions.
Let's not be the party of "feelings" but the party of reason.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Midget Faded Rattlesnake
Elena
And you bringing Harry Reid into it is irrelevant.
Hardly. A person who blindly supported Mormon politicians simply because they were Mormon would support both Romney and Reid.
For that matter, such a person should support both Romney and Huntsman, or find himself tragically torn between the two.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Kelly B:
Romney never did much for me - he falls in the "running because he thinks he ought to be president" category. So I never flipped for him at all.
I heard Bachmann at a live event a couple of years ago and was impressed, so was a fan after the Iowa straw poll, briefly - until the Gardasil->retardation thing.
Perry sounded good on paper - and then he opened his mouth. Articulate? Persuasive? Not.
Cain met those two criteria, but his foreign policy remarks seemed to lack depth, and his campaign handled the recent allegations very badly.
Then I heard some Newt soundbites, and I'm old enough to recall his work as Speaker. Right now, he's meeting my criteria.
Don't know if that's flipflopping or not. · Nov 30 at 3:07pm
Totally with you, sister.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
I think you're correct in your assessment here, Tom, regarding the Tea Party and I think a lot of the resistance to Romney is because of the perception that he is the "next in line" and there is kind of a revolt against the establishment vibe going on.
However, we should still evaluate the candidates for who they are and not dismiss someone because of this perception. Gingrich may not be the GOP establishment's pick this election but that doesn't mean he is not a DC insider through and through. Conversely, just because Romney is the establishment's pick doesn't mean he's the wrong guy either. Maybe he is the wrong guy but let's evaluate his case on the merits, not some blind revulsion of the "Establishment".
We are all going to suffer immensely if we pick the wrong nominee and Obama gets re-elected.
May '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Frozen Chosen: I think Republicans are understandably very upset and a bit frightened by the course our country has taken under Obama. Many of them are having a visceral reaction to recent events and are angry.
However, I fear this reaction is primarily driven by emotions which explains the wild swing in support for the various candidates. Strong emotions can be a positive thing when they motivate people to action but they can also lead to bad decisions.
Let's not be the party of "feelings" but the party of reason. · Nov 30 at 3:09pm
Well, if you first tag the reaction as visceral, it's not surprising that you find it too "emotional". Personally I find myself if anything to emotionally detached from the crises. My reason knows it's disastrous, but I'm not yet feeling it.
Reason and judgment lead me to be very dissatisfied with our current choices, concerned that none is up to the job, and not sure which is the least bad of a bad set.
May '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
I'm still leaning Romey over Gingrich, because I respect Romney's managerial and leadership skills and have some hope that with enough pressure from the right, he'll end up doing good.
I'm afraid Gingrich will flame out somewhere along the line and do a lot of damage in the process.
On the other hand, his talent for bold ideas might be more like what we need at the moment. IF he doesn't flame out.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
katievs: I'm still leaning Romey over Gingrich, because I respect Romney's managerial and leadership skills and have some hope that with enough pressure from the right, he'll end up doing good.
I'm afraid Gingrich will flame out somewhere along the line and do a lot of damage in the process.
On the other hand, his talent for bold ideas might be more like what we need at the moment. IF he doesn't flame out. · Nov 30 at 3:35pm
If I thought that Newt had the capability to put his bold ideas into action I might think about supporting him.
Also, he seems to cycle through his bold ideas pretty regularly. Chances are today's ideas will be discarded by next November.
Aug '10
Re: Are Voters Flip-Floppers?
Frozen Chosen
Did you just figure out he was a good debater?
Well, speaking for the young 'uns among us, yeah, we could have just figured it out.
We were ankle-biters while Newt was last in the public spotlight.