The Modern Vacuum of Ethical Restraint

 

I believe that the remarkable changes in our society are largely due to a few things happening either all at once or at least in rapid succession: First, we have moved away from God. Nietzsche got the ball rolling when he subtly pointed out that God is Dead, but now if a Christian says “God is good” then everybody rolls their eyes. (Interestingly, if certain Muslims say the same thing, everybody ducks.)

Regardless, the idea that each of us lives according to the ideals of someone greater than ourselves is considered, well, provincial. Perhaps quaint. Certainly non-scientific and outside the realm of polite, reasonable society. But then some other things happened:

The idea of pride and shame was also degraded into a primitive impulse to be avoided except in antiquated cultures. Public ostracism was sneered upon as “judgmental.” Who are you to judge? Because after all, we all answer to ourselves! So you can’t criticize me for striving to live up to whatever ethical guidelines I decided for myself the day before yesterday! Partially because I’ve already changed them in ways that I don’t fully understand! And so on.

And then our family structure has been either damaged or disregarded. Every TV show has the father portrayed as, at best, a bumbling fool. With the wife and kids trying to work around his foolishness without hurting his feelings more than necessary for a good laugh.

Then the concept of law has been degraded as well. So many men are in prison only because of racist cops. Laws are so numerous that no one can follow them all. Regulatory agencies and courts enact laws outside the democratic process, and those laws are clearly not legitimate and thus should be discretely avoided without making the father figure (government) feel silly, just like the TV dad. Or God. Or family. Or societal norms.

Nietzsche (a flawed genius, but unquestionably a genius) predicted that this vacuum of ethical restraint would result in societal upheaval, violence, and a complete restructuring of human interactions. All of which has come to pass, almost precisely as he predicted.

So – what now? Some of what has been torn asunder cannot easily be rebuilt. I posit that modern western society is clearly unsustainable. So what’s next? Human nature is not nice. And now it acts without the restraint of God, society, family, or government. We seem to view the concept of freedom as simply the liberty to do whatever the heck we want. This is not working out all that well.  To me, the concept of personal freedom doesn’t even make sense without personal responsibility.  Today we ask, “Responsible to who?”  If the answer is just to ourselves, than Nietzsche would say (and did say) that we have a very serious problem.

What do you think? Am I overstating the changes in western society? Where are we going? And can our course be altered at this late stage? If so, how?

Thank you for your input.

Published in General
This post was promoted to the Main Feed by a Ricochet Editor at the recommendation of Ricochet members. Like this post? Want to comment? Join Ricochet’s community of conservatives and be part of the conversation. Join Ricochet for Free.

There are 107 comments.

Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.
  1. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    I’ll throw out some amateur political analysis in the tolerance department.

    Prior to the mid 90s, state recognized marriage was ridiculed by most homosexuals as a “het” institution that they didn’t need or want. I think there’s actually some very politically incorrect social statistics that bear that out for men. 

    Some say the whole gay marriage thing was strictly just another tactic for the Democratic Party to gain more power or whatever. I have no big opinion, other than I do remember it being that way for a long time. 

    • #61
  2. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Painter Jean (View Comment):

    Because abortion is not the sole measurement here. Working, safety, consumer, product standards I mean both by government decree and civil society standards.

    So you are tying improvements in those areas with increased secularization?? How is that? Please explain!

    It’s a function of society’s accumulated wealth too. Child labor went away partly because we didn’t need it to survive anymore.

    • #62
  3. Front Seat Cat Member
    Front Seat Cat
    @FrontSeatCat

    We need today’s youth to be more optimistic than pessimistic – and I hope that’s the case. What’ different today than  70 years ago is social media and the rapid way an idea can spread – toxic or otherwise. I’m not sure what is taught today within Common Core, but older folks have wisdom based on the conditions that led to the catastrophes we’ve seen in past history, even recent past history. Now there is so much political correctness (censorship) it is also driving group think – and this is how dictators rise, wars start and boundaries are eliminated. 

    • #63
  4. Dr. Bastiat Member
    Dr. Bastiat
    @drbastiat

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    It’s a function of society’s accumulated wealth too. Child labor went away partly because we didn’t need it to survive anymore.

    This is so true.  Child labor laws, like environmental regulations, handicapped ramps etc, lifetime pensions for government employees, and so many other causes of the left – these are all really just luxuries of a society made wealthy by free markets and other things the left despises. 

    You would think this would give Democrats pause.  But no.

    • #64
  5. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Dr. Bastiat (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    It’s a function of society’s accumulated wealth too. Child labor went away partly because we didn’t need it to survive anymore.

    This is so true. Child labor laws, like environmental regulations, handicapped ramps etc, lifetime pensions for government employees, and so many other causes of the left – these are all really just luxuries of a society made wealthy by free markets and other things the left despises.

    You would think this would give Democrats pause. But no.

    Peter Schiff is really good at explaining this type of thing. He said the 50s were similar. Everyone thinks our economy was so great during that time simply because all of our competitors got bombed all the hell. In reality all kinds of human and actual capital got unleashed after the depression and the suppressive, controlled WW2 economy.

    I wish Peter Schiff would cut the straight economic education out of all of his podcasts and sell it separately. He’s very good at explaining Austrian economics and history.

    • #65
  6. ST Member
    ST
    @

    She (View Comment):

    Mitchell Messom (View Comment):

    She (View Comment):

    Mitchell Messom (View Comment):

    Inversely I hope many religious people can see why the non-religious people think these changes are positive.

    No, with the greatest respect, I’m not sure why you think they are. Please elaborate.

    Not even one? Will the treatment of homosexuals, relief from certain forms of censorship and self expression, comes to mind.

    Equal rights under the rule of law and according to the Constitution? Sure. Special rights invented out of whole cloth and shadowy penumbrae? Um, no.

    As for censorship, it seems to me it’s alive and well, just more insidious, and that it has morphed from a fixation on sex to one on politics and feelings. You may think that the assertion which is made by many, that they have a “right” not to hear anything that’s offensive to them, and that “words” are somehow equivalent to actual “violence,” is an improvement; I’m not sure I do.

    And, limitless self-expression? I think the OP and some of the comments make the case as to why such a thing is against the best interests of society at large in this age of #meeeeeeee2 far better than I can.

    What She said.

    • #66
  7. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    My youngest is the Marine, ST.

    • #67
  8. Mitchell Messom Inactive
    Mitchell Messom
    @MitchellMessom

    Painter Jean (View Comment):
    So you are tying improvements in those areas with increased secularization?? How is that? Please explain!

    The point being as religious attitudes decreased concern for human welfare remained. 

    • #68
  9. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    ST (View Comment):

    Randy Webster (View Comment):
    You don’t have to be an atheist to think that entropy increases.

    Ricochet comment of the quarter.

    My 15 minutes of fame.

    • #69
  10. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    Mitchell Messom (View Comment):

    Painter Jean (View Comment):
    So you are tying improvements in those areas with increased secularization?? How is that? Please explain!

    The point being as religious attitudes decreased concern for human welfare remained.

    I don’t think that that’s something you can just assert.

    • #70
  11. Mitchell Messom Inactive
    Mitchell Messom
    @MitchellMessom

    She (View Comment):
    Equal rights under the rule of law and according to the Constitution? Sure. Special rights invented out of whole cloth and shadowy penumbrae? Um, no.

    No idea what that is referencing.

     

    She (View Comment):
    As for censorship, it seems to me it’s alive and well, just more insidious, and that it has morphed from a fixation on sex to one on politics and feelings. You may think that the assertion which is made by many, that they have a “right” not to hear anything that’s offensive to them, and that “words” are somehow equivalent to actual “violence,” is an improvement; I’m not sure I do.

    I am not making the arrangement that one form of censorship is better then the other. But that the lack of religious motivated censorship is good. It is not a binary choice between secular blasphemy or religious blasphemy attitudes.

    • #71
  12. ST Member
    ST
    @

    Mitchell Messom (View Comment):
    The point being as religious attitudes decreased concern for human welfare remained. 

    I would say that the 20th century put a test to that theory.  Results were inconclusive (only 100 million or so souls died horribly) but seem to point to the fact that not all religious ‘attitudes’ were created by God.

    • #72
  13. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    ST (View Comment):

    Equal rights under the rule of law and according to the Constitution? Sure. Special rights invented out of whole cloth and shadowy penumbrae? Um, no.

    As for censorship, it seems to me it’s alive and well, just more insidious, and that it has morphed from a fixation on sex to one on politics and feelings. You may think that the assertion which is made by many, that they have a “right” not to hear anything that’s offensive to them, and that “words” are somehow equivalent to actual “violence,” is an improvement; I’m not sure I do.

    And, limitless self-expression? I think the OP and some of the comments make the case as to why such a thing is against the best interests of society at large in this age of #meeeeeeee2 far better than I can.

    One of the reasons I don’t have a problem with a right to privacy, however SCOTUS justified it, is the same reason some of the founders didn’t want a bill of rights:  the feds would limit our rights to those enumerated.  I think we DO have a right to privacy; the Constitution doesn’t say we don’t.  I don’t think the right to privacy stretches to killing unborn children, though.

    • #73
  14. Mitchell Messom Inactive
    Mitchell Messom
    @MitchellMessom

    Painter Jean (View Comment):
    The treatment of homosexuals? Really?? How is that specifically tied to the Judeo/Christian tradition in this country?

    Painter Jean (View Comment):
    The treatment of homosexuals? Really?? How is that specifically tied to the Judeo/Christian tradition in this country? It doesn’t take too long to think of quite a number of successful entertainers, artists, and writers in this country and in Western Europe who were known to be gay, yet still succeeded, while in the atheist Soviet Union, homosexuality was criminalized and gays were persecuted. The neo-pagan Nazis persecuted gays. So how, then, do you equate the Judeo/Christian tradition with ill-treatment of gays?

    So others where worse thus…..

     

    • #74
  15. ST Member
    ST
    @

    Randy Webster (View Comment):
    My 15 minutes of fame.

    Yes and you should be proud.  The Ricochet comment of the quarter is a rare and highly regarded award.  To put it into perspective it is something like Obama’s first (anticipating that there will be at least a second) Nobel Peace Prize but without the cash award.

    • #75
  16. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    ST (View Comment):

    Randy Webster (View Comment):
    My 15 minutes of fame.

    Yes and you should be proud. The Ricochet comment of the quarter is a rare and highly regarded award. To put it into perspective it is something like Obama’s first (anticipating that there will be at least a second) Nobel Peace Prize but without the cash award.

    I’m staggered by the honor.

    • #76
  17. She Member
    She
    @She

    Mitchell Messom (View Comment):

    She (View Comment):
    Equal rights under the rule of law and according to the Constitution? Sure. Special rights invented out of whole cloth and shadowy penumbrae? Um, no.

    No idea what that is referencing.

    Probably because, if I recall correctly, you’re a Canadian.  Yes? (If so, it’s OK, I’m a green-card carrying Brit.  But I live in the States, and have for years).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penumbra_(law)

    • #77
  18. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    That’s because in a Keynesian system, graft, dependency, and rent seeking are more profitable and dependable than honest productivity. Once the bad behavior gets entrenched, what are you going to do? The only thing that’s going to fix it as a bond market collapse. 

    I understand the first part.  The bond market collapsing I have no clue about.

    • #78
  19. ST Member
    ST
    @

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    That’s because in a Keynesian system, graft, dependency, and rent seeking are more profitable and dependable than honest productivity. Once the bad behavior gets entrenched, what are you going to do? The only thing that’s going to fix it as a bond market collapse.

    I understand the first part. The bond market collapsing I have no clue about.

    I think he is talking about armageddon/ the apocalypse.

    • #79
  20. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    I DID just order 1k rounds of .223.

    • #80
  21. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    That’s because in a Keynesian system, graft, dependency, and rent seeking are more profitable and dependable than honest productivity. Once the bad behavior gets entrenched, what are you going to do? The only thing that’s going to fix it as a bond market collapse.

    I understand the first part. The bond market collapsing I have no clue about.

    The Fed’s  ability to goose the economy, suppress interest rates, and monetize debt allows politicians to engage in largess, never make hard choices or fund all kinds of repressive government programs. Inflation reduces the the cost of government debt. Asset bubbles generate taxes. Crime pays and  honest productivity is for suckers.

     

     

    • #81
  22. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    ST (View Comment):

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    That’s because in a Keynesian system, graft, dependency, and rent seeking are more profitable and dependable than honest productivity. Once the bad behavior gets entrenched, what are you going to do? The only thing that’s going to fix it as a bond market collapse.

    I understand the first part. The bond market collapsing I have no clue about.

    I think he is talking about armageddon/ the apocalypse.

    The debt to GDP and the unfunded liabilities can’t keep going in this trajectory. No way. Something has to give. When the 10 year treasury hits 4% the U.S. government is broke. Too much debt issued at low interest rates will make something break at some point.

    The thing is other areas like Japan or whatever can be worse than us or have severe problems and that makes people demand U.S. treasuries. So it gets put off. It could be prevented but that would require Congress to be very intelligent and act with integrity.

    • #82
  23. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    It could be prevented but that would require Congress to be very intelligent and act with integrity.

    Ha, ha, ha.  If twenty-one trillion in debt isn’t broke, I’m not sure what is.

    • #83
  24. Painter Jean Moderator
    Painter Jean
    @PainterJean

    Mitchell Messom (View Comment):

    Painter Jean (View Comment):
    So you are tying improvements in those areas with increased secularization?? How is that? Please explain!

    The point being as religious attitudes decreased concern for human welfare remained.

    I don’t think you can substantiate this. In this country, many of the improvements in workplace safety have far more to do with man’s entrepreneurial and innovative spirit combined with a relatively free and stable marketplace which rewards advances in technology and productivity. The religious affiliation of those entrepreneurs may or may not have anything to do with it, so in order to prove your assertion, it seems to me that you have to show just to what extent there has been a decrease in the Judeo/Christian practice of the individuals in these fields. I’m not so sure that the basic profit motive isn’t more of a factor. You initially mentioned this as part of your post stating what was better with increased secularization – I just don’t think there’s much of a connection.

    By  contrast, look at the track record of working conditions in atheist countries, such as China and North Korea. Where there is no recognition of the inherent worth and dignity of each person as a child of God, they often become no more than useful cogs in a wheel, and are expendable.

    • #84
  25. Randy Webster Inactive
    Randy Webster
    @RandyWebster

    Our EMR is roughly .8.  It’s a competitive advantage.

    • #85
  26. ST Member
    ST
    @

    Randy Webster (View Comment):
    EMR

    ?  Asked Mr. Google but he does not seem to know either.

    • #86
  27. ST Member
    ST
    @

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    I DID just order 1k rounds of .223.

    …for your military assault rifle with fixed bayonet?

    • #87
  28. RufusRJones Member
    RufusRJones
    @RufusRJones

    Randy Webster (View Comment):

    RufusRJones (View Comment):
    It could be prevented but that would require Congress to be very intelligent and act with integrity.

    Ha, ha, ha. If twenty-one trillion in debt isn’t broke, I’m not sure what is.

    This is an oversimplification, but you can’t control spending politically if you have a central bank that “helps” the economy (helps the whores overspend, really) on a discretionary basis. Discretionary rules. This is why I never get excited about Republicans overspending, and the omnibus stuff and all the related crap they go on and on about on Hate Radio. 

     

    • #88
  29. ST Member
    ST
    @

    Randy Webster (View Comment):
    I’m staggered by the honor.

    Take a sleeping pill.  This too shall pass.

    • #89
  30. Painter Jean Moderator
    Painter Jean
    @PainterJean

    Mitchell Messom (View Comment):

    Painter Jean (View Comment):
    The treatment of homosexuals? Really?? How is that specifically tied to the Judeo/Christian tradition in this country?

    Painter Jean (View Comment):
    The treatment of homosexuals? Really?? How is that specifically tied to the Judeo/Christian tradition in this country? It doesn’t take too long to think of quite a number of successful entertainers, artists, and writers in this country and in Western Europe who were known to be gay, yet still succeeded, while in the atheist Soviet Union, homosexuality was criminalized and gays were persecuted. The neo-pagan Nazis persecuted gays. So how, then, do you equate the Judeo/Christian tradition with ill-treatment of gays?

    So others where worse thus…..

    Isn’t it obvious?? You state that one of the benefits of increased secularization is the treatment of gays. I pointed out that atheists don’t have a better record. That seems to negate your assertion, wouldn’t you agree? The truth is,  a person who is gay is much more likely to be treated better today in a country with a Judeo/Christian tradition than in other places. Atheistic regimes don’t have a good track record on this.

     

     

    • #90
Become a member to join the conversation. Or sign in if you're already a member.